|
|
Post by copperx on Dec 1, 2023 21:42:52 GMT -6
Why wouldn't they? It's far easier to leave the algorithms untouched. What's the working hypothesis here? |
|
|
|
Post by thehightenor on Dec 2, 2023 3:38:13 GMT -6
The only difference is what they run on and where they are stired on your computer: two different folders. As of a few months ago, Drew stated they are still committed to cards, the large majority of its plugs are not native, why would they abandon selling what processes those plugs? There are demo videos of Capital, you can demo it for 14 days through ua connect, what’s the issue: am demoing it here now. I am liking it, compared it to using my warm ssl clone on 2 bus: am selling the Warm. Will likely buy it and sound city with 2/99$. Came back to UA for a hot minute, and still trying to get UA Connect to work. I followed all steps meticulously and it just locks up and nothing works. I put in a ticket. Hopefully, this isn’t a new direction UA is taking, nothing works? Since I still have a UA interface lying around I thought I would see if it’s any better, seems to have gotten worse. I know their customer support has taken a huge hit Are you on PC? |
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Dec 2, 2023 4:27:00 GMT -6
Came back to UA for a hot minute, and still trying to get UA Connect to work. I followed all steps meticulously and it just locks up and nothing works. I put in a ticket. Hopefully, this isn’t a new direction UA is taking, nothing works? Since I still have a UA interface lying around I thought I would see if it’s any better, seems to have gotten worse. I know their customer support has taken a huge hit Are you on PC? I put in ticket and within 24 hours I rebooted my Mac M1 and it worked |
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Dec 2, 2023 4:27:13 GMT -6
I put in a ticket and within 24 hours I rebooted my Mac M1 and it worked, evidently it was on UA’s side, then all of my UA plugs didn’t even show up. I put in another ticket. What a pain, never had issues like this before, however I managed to authorize and install plugs. Hopefully tomorrow I will be able to resolve all this |
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Dec 2, 2023 6:27:33 GMT -6
C'mon, do you think AU and VST from the same.plugin sounds different? Do you think that plugins running on Mac Intel and the same plugin running on Mac Silicon sounds different? It's the same code! |
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 2, 2023 6:46:12 GMT -6
I don’t understand this concern, when you buy the uad2 plug you get the uadx included so you can run what you choose.
Since, anyone could then run them side by side and compare, why would ua make one inferior, what would be the point ?
|
|
|
|
Post by thehightenor on Dec 2, 2023 8:01:33 GMT -6
I don’t understand this concern, when you buy the uad2 plug you get the uadx included so you can run what you choose. Since, anyone could then run them side by side and compare, why would ua make one inferior, what would be the point ? Powercore Sony EQ sounded better than the native version - and they didn't null! Same with the Powercore Softube CL1B to my ears it sounded way better than the Sotftube native version. Go figure - something about the Powercore DSP - Fixed 48 on those Motorola chips - up or over sampled? Who knows. |
|
|
|
Post by seawell on Dec 2, 2023 9:32:59 GMT -6
I did this one when UADX first came out as well: |
|
|
|
Post by doubledog on Dec 2, 2023 9:36:42 GMT -6
I think anyone arguing that UA's DSP will go away has either forgotten, or perhaps never used a UA interface with DSP. This is really where their magic is - being able to use a plugin during tracking with no observed latency (it might not be latency-free, but you can't hear it). So you need an Apollo interface to actually benefit from this, and then you insert the plugin in UA's "Console" app which runs on the host and does any routing before it hits your DAW. You can also use Console to get "latency-free" (again no perceived latency) monitoring while tracking (you have to mute the track in your DAW otherwise you will get weird robot-like flanging).
That said I almost never do that, except for maybe putting a little reverb in the headphones when tracking (in monitor mode, not record mode) - although I did once use the Thermionic Culture Vulture (DSP plugin) in record-mode to really dirty up a track. I'm using UAD or UADx plugins mostly in mixing and I do use a combination of DSP/Native depending on the session. It's true CPUs will get faster and faster, but plugins will probably get more bloated then too. I suspect that UA's DSP code had to stay fairly lean to still run on a SHARC with 20+yr old technology.
the DSP satellites and PCIe cards (I have an older quad DSP card) will probably eventually go away because the host CPU really can replace that (as long as all your favorite plugins get ported to Native)
|
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 2, 2023 9:37:46 GMT -6
I don’t understand this concern, when you buy the uad2 plug you get the uadx included so you can run what you choose. Since, anyone could then run them side by side and compare, why would ua make one inferior, what would be the point ? Powercore Sony EQ sounded better than the native version - and they didn't null! Same with the Powercore Softube CL1B to my ears it sounded way better than the Sotftube native version. Go figure - something about the Powercore DSP - Fixed 48 on those Motorola chips - up or over sampled? Who knows. I meant with UA, its been raised before and peeps report they null |
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Dec 2, 2023 11:22:20 GMT -6
I think anyone arguing that UA's DSP will go away has either forgotten, or perhaps never used a UA interface with DSP. This is really where their magic is - being able to use a plugin during tracking with no observed latency (it might not be latency-free, but you can't hear it). So you need an Apollo interface to actually benefit from this, and then you insert the plugin in UA's "Console" app which runs on the host and does any routing before it hits your DAW. You can also use Console to get "latency-free" (again no perceived latency) monitoring while tracking (you have to mute the track in your DAW otherwise you will get weird robot-like flanging). That said I almost never do that, except for maybe putting a little reverb in the headphones when tracking (in monitor mode, not record mode) - although I did once use the Thermionic Culture Vulture (DSP plugin) in record-mode to really dirty up a track. I'm using UAD or UADx plugins mostly in mixing and I do use a combination of DSP/Native depending on the session. It's true CPUs will get faster and faster, but plugins will probably get more bloated then too. I suspect that UA's DSP code had to stay fairly lean to still run on a SHARC with 20+yr old technology. the DSP satellites and PCIe cards (I have an older quad DSP card) will probably eventually go away because the host CPU really can replace that (as long as all your favorite plugins get ported to Native) Something like that. Interfaces with DSP will exist for much longer, many companies have that nowadays, and UAD are the best on this for sure. But I guess the use will be especifically for these situations you described. Altough I also don't see the reason to commit to something on the way in with a plugin... but anyway. But satellites and relying on DSP to run plugins will probably die in the next years. For example, I think that UA will stop selling satellites in the near future for the simple reason that they will not sell enough to justify selling them at all. |
|
|
|
Post by dok on Dec 2, 2023 11:26:59 GMT -6
This thread is a perfect read for my current situation. I was one of the lucky few who was able to snag Ultimate 12 for ~$200. So I now own all of those plugins but only about half of them have been ported to native at this point. So there's a bunch of stuff I'd need a Satellite to run (whether I need to actually USE that stuff is a totally different story). The issue is I've gotten *really* used to just the stock plugins in Logic and intentionally stayed that way in the past because it's such a pain to migrate to a new system and then open old sessions that have plugins to which I no longer have access. So the satellite purchase would tie me even tighter to that UA system on a likely indefinite basis. I'm otherwise pretty happy with my MOTU front end and definitely don't think it's worth dismantling that setup to get an Apollo solely for Unison. But should I get a cheap used Satellite to utilize all those sparkly new UAD plugs or am I better off leaving it alone and not further complicating things?
|
|
|
|
Post by trakworxmastering on Dec 2, 2023 11:49:27 GMT -6
My suspicion was that they could have cut some corners to economize CPU usage in the Native versions because some of their plugins are DSP hogs. This came from an in-person conversation I had with other AEs who said they thought they heard a difference. 'Seems like that was a misplaced concern, so that's good news to me!
|
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 2, 2023 11:56:52 GMT -6
Never been a better time to grab a used octo: tbst gives you a hybrid processing system, largely independent of but complementary to each other.
Run your uadx native uad2 on sharcs, very efficient.
Only fly is that an apollo big refresh is long overdue: what if they dropped a new one in 6 months, better converters, an onboard octo, would you care?
|
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Dec 2, 2023 12:22:39 GMT -6
This thread is a perfect read for my current situation. I was one of the lucky few who was able to snag Ultimate 12 for ~$200. So I now own all of those plugins but only about half of them have been ported to native at this point. So there's a bunch of stuff I'd need a Satellite to run (whether I need to actually USE that stuff is a totally different story). The issue is I've gotten *really* used to just the stock plugins in Logic and intentionally stayed that way in the past because it's such a pain to migrate to a new system and then open old sessions that have plugins to which I no longer have access. So the satellite purchase would tie me even tighter to that UA system on a likely indefinite basis. I'm otherwise pretty happy with my MOTU front end and definitely don't think it's worth dismantling that setup to get an Apollo solely for Unison. But should I get a cheap used Satellite to utilize all those sparkly new UAD plugs or am I better off leaving it alone and not further complicating things? Get some used satellite, man. It'll take some years for them to port all those plugins to native. |
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Dec 2, 2023 12:25:22 GMT -6
My suspicion was that they could have cut some corners to economize CPU usage in the Native versions because some of their plugins are DSP hogs. This came from an in-person conversation I had with other AEs who said they thought they heard a difference. 'Seems like that was a misplaced concern, so that's good news to me! The opposite is more likely to have happened. For example, they had to simplify some new release because it wouldn't be able to run on a Sharc chip. That might be the case of the new Sound City plugin and one reason that it wont appear in DSP format. |
|
|
|
Post by dok on Dec 2, 2023 12:54:29 GMT -6
Never been a better time to grab a used octo: tbst gives you a hybrid processing system, largely independent of but complementary to each other. Run your uadx native uad2 on sharcs, very efficient. Only fly is that an apollo big refresh is long overdue: what if they dropped a new one in 6 months, better converters, an onboard octo, would you care? I'd be interested in what's on the table but the value proposition at UAD's current Apollo prices is definitely not there for me. I could buy some really nice hardware to finish my front end for what a new Apollo with equivalent features to my 828es would cost (minus the DSP of course). And of course I could buy a really nice used Audioscape piece for close to what a used octo would cost, too. Hard to make these decisions! |
|
|
|
Post by thehightenor on Dec 3, 2023 3:29:31 GMT -6
Powercore Sony EQ sounded better than the native version - and they didn't null! Same with the Powercore Softube CL1B to my ears it sounded way better than the Sotftube native version. Go figure - something about the Powercore DSP - Fixed 48 on those Motorola chips - up or over sampled? Who knows. I meant with UA, its been raised before and peeps report they null Ok great, I haven’t tried nulling UAD DSP vs native. That’s good to know. |
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 3, 2023 5:07:49 GMT -6
It was immediately asked and discussed at ua forum as soon as uadx was launched (2 year’s ago?).
I think Matt, the site founder did a null test, if I recall correctly: anyway Drew certainly maintained same code so they null.
|
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 3, 2023 5:17:51 GMT -6
i don’t disagree with your general point, if you are not tracking with ua plugs, why buy apollo ? “And of course I could buy a really nice used Audioscape piece for close to what a used octo would cost, too. Hard to make these decisions!” Used AS for $700, where, sign me up !  1-2 channels of dedicated fx or 10’s of multiple plug ins and reducing demand on your computer cpu. Not exactly apples and oranges but you’d create different results for the same money, but I think AS box would cost you more. |
|
|
|
Post by Drew @ UA on Dec 3, 2023 9:42:20 GMT -6
Are they abandoning the Satellite? We are not. |
|
|
|
Post by Drew @ UA on Dec 3, 2023 9:45:08 GMT -6
With the native ports, we expect users to lean less on Sats, but DSP will remain the backbone of the ecosystem for many years to come.
|
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Dec 3, 2023 9:51:15 GMT -6
I put in a ticket and within 24 hours I rebooted my Mac M1 and it worked, evidently it was on UA’s side, then all of my UA plugs didn’t even show up. I put in another ticket. What a pain, never had issues like this before, however I managed to authorize and install plugs. Hopefully tomorrow I will be able to resolve all this I logged on yesterday and my plugins were there and everything just worked. Not sure why it just didn’t work right away? Anyway, it all works and I was able to use LUNA and tracked some stuff to test it. Worked great and sounds really good on an MacBook Pro M1 |
|
|
|
Post by Drew @ UA on Dec 3, 2023 9:55:49 GMT -6
I logged on yesterday and my plugins were there and everything just worked. Not sure why it just didn’t work right away? Anyway, it all works and I was able to use LUNA and tracked some stuff to test it. Worked great and sounds really good on M1👍🏻 Glad to hear you're enjoying LUNA. Thanks for taking the time. We're thrilled with the response to LUNA open, and are seeing a HUGE influx of new users. |
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Dec 3, 2023 10:12:59 GMT -6
With the native ports, we expect users to lean less on Sats, but DSP will remain the backbone of the ecosystem for many years to come. Exactly. |
|
