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Post by Omicron9 on Mar 8, 2023 11:51:18 GMT -6
Greetings.
I've been looking for darker SDCs for instrument mic'ing. My two current faves, tho I wouldn't call them dark, are the AKG C-460-B and the venerable Shure SM-81. The top end on both is close to what I seek; although they're pretty flat, they can still be a bit more crispy than I want. Preamps are all Grace.
I've tried many other well-known SDCs (Neumann, AKG, Gefell, Shure KSM series, Oktava, et. al.), and these two are the ones thus far. I'd still like to find something a little darker on top. Please don't say KM-84s, as that's way out of my budget, and I'm not a fan of maintaining vintage gear.
I've tried various ribbons (Royer, Mesanovic, Cascasde), and they're just too dark on top and lack definition for what I want to hear. I'm going for clean/accurate, not vintage/muddy/saturated.
I want to think there must be some happy medium between ribbons and the 81/460. Or maybe not.
Suggestions?
TIA,
-09
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 8, 2023 11:54:47 GMT -6
The serrrano has two caps for that purpose ?
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 8, 2023 11:56:16 GMT -6
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Post by Darren Boling on Mar 8, 2023 11:58:19 GMT -6
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Post by bikescene on Mar 8, 2023 12:27:17 GMT -6
I am liking the Soyuz 013 FET and Oktava MK-012 when I don’t want as bright of a sound.
My reference of brighter SDCs are the Shure KSM137 and Beesneez Lulu FET.
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Post by eyebytwomuchgeer on Mar 8, 2023 12:32:27 GMT -6
Cheapo Oktava 012s? They seem to have a nice bottom end and not an obnoxious amount of sizzle up top. Seem to hold their cheap value pretty well too, as you won't lose your shirt buying or selling.
-edit Bikescene beat me to it haha
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2023 12:41:50 GMT -6
Most of the time e issue is not just the frequency response of the capsule and mic but the internal amp, lack of headroom, your pre amps, and your converter. They all have analog circuits in them that can sound trashy.
I can recommend Shure and Beyer SDCs. The Austrian Audio ones might be a good gamble.
Also ditch the Grace. They’re just a bunch of bright chip amps that will further distort harsh sources. The deaf guys running the big budget classical/live sound/broadcast industries decided they were clean because they’re low noise without putting them on an analyzer or loopback into digital. I wouldn’t really describe a Grace as flat perceptibly or as even a clean canvas type of thing that when you push it gets colored. It always sounds like that.
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Post by EmRR on Mar 8, 2023 12:50:37 GMT -6
Sennheiser MKH20/30/40. Neumann KM131.
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Post by jaba on Mar 8, 2023 12:51:09 GMT -6
I haven't tried some of what you've listed but do know the KM-184/84, and SM81, but I'd recommend the Beyer MC-930 and Sennheiser MKH-40. I know the MKH best and it's great for thin sounding instruments, and excel at overheads - smooth cymbals and big toms.
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Post by the other mark williams on Mar 8, 2023 12:53:30 GMT -6
I second the Soyuz 013FETs. They're darker and heftier sounding to me.
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Post by robo on Mar 8, 2023 13:01:55 GMT -6
Plenty of mics out there that might fit the bill, but since you say you’ve tried lots and the closest are the ones you’re using, I really think you should try some different pres. Something with some transformers you can drive a little to soak up the excess sizzle. ISA’s would be a good affordable option, and they are still quite clean/neutral sounding. Iron Age, Hardy, Great River…Tons of good options out there.
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Post by woofhead on Mar 8, 2023 13:38:06 GMT -6
Not available yet but the forthcoming samar mg20 could be an idea. I pre ordered one and am speculating it will be on the dark side relatively.... looking forward to checking it out
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Post by plinker on Mar 8, 2023 13:38:17 GMT -6
Line Audio CM4 and Omni are ruler-flat. Clean and accurate. They have been compared favorably to Schoeps, if that sound is what you are looking for. lineaudio.se/CM4.htmlAbout $120 USD each. Shipping isn't much. I have both. I like both. |
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Post by drumsound on Mar 8, 2023 14:30:27 GMT -6
I am liking the Soyuz 013 FET and Oktava MK-012 when I don’t want as bright of a sound. My reference of brighter SDCs are the Shure KSM137 and Beesneez Lulu FET. Cheapo Oktava 012s? They seem to have a nice bottom end and not an obnoxious amount of sizzle up top. Seem to hold their cheap value pretty well too, as you won't lose your shirt buying or selling. -edit Bikescene beat me to it haha Yeah, the Octavas work really well and aren't overly bright, but the top is there. Great sound in the low end as well. |
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Post by sirthought on Mar 8, 2023 14:34:58 GMT -6
I'd change the preamp first.
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Post by notneeson on Mar 8, 2023 15:04:12 GMT -6
I'd change the preamp first. I do feel like the Oktava sizzle is worse with transformerless pres, I have some tracks out in the wild where I wish I hadn’t used conolse Pres in hindsight. Not terrible, but a little pokey. |
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Post by svart on Mar 8, 2023 15:06:26 GMT -6
Not SDC's but Bumblebee ribbons are pretty nice. Not overly dark at all, especially if you get the phantom powered one.
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 8, 2023 15:38:29 GMT -6
I'd give AEA N8 ribbons a shot too. They are wonderful sounding and have a great tone top to bottom. Very balanced.
I'm not sure which grace pre's you have. I'm a big fan of them. But might be worth trying something else as well.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Mar 8, 2023 17:04:07 GMT -6
Try an Omni, many of the cardiods have an HF boost to compensate for the LF boost you get from proximity effects and close micing, while it won’t necessarily be dark it will probably be better balanced and that might be what you want.
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Post by ab101 on Mar 8, 2023 18:28:59 GMT -6
Put them through a Locomotive tube pre! I have the 286a, but I understand that they have a new two channel tube pre that may even be better and at a lower price than the 286a.
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Post by hadaja on Mar 8, 2023 19:01:34 GMT -6
Put them through a Locomotive tube pre! I have the 286a, but I understand that they have a new two channel tube pre that may even be better and at a lower price than the 286a. The 86b-2 is a nice preamp but i dont think it is in the same vein as the 286. |
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Post by hadaja on Mar 8, 2023 19:03:38 GMT -6
I didnt find my soyuz sdc mic dark or darker then my km84’s?
I think you might be heading in the right direction if you go for a ribbon something like the samar al95 will be a small mic wth a nice neutral sound not bright and similar size of sdc.
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Post by ab101 on Mar 8, 2023 19:21:02 GMT -6
Put them through a Locomotive tube pre! I have the 286a, but I understand that they have a new two channel tube pre that may even be better and at a lower price than the 286a. The 86b-2 is a nice preamp but i dont think it is in the same vein as the 286. Interesting. I once had a pair of Neumann 184s which I thought were too bright and they were crispy. Anyway, I recorded overheads for a CD project with the mics going through a Demeter tube pre (with some Mullard upgrades) and it really tamed those mics. I like the Locomotive 286a better than the Demeter and it has a similar effect on these high, crispy sdcs. |
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Post by hadaja on Mar 8, 2023 19:38:47 GMT -6
86b-2 better? Not sure. If you are updating the 286 with a few twists and making it cheaper i am not sure if the term better applies.
Although i have not used a 286 i would be interested in testing the two out.
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Post by ab101 on Mar 8, 2023 19:47:43 GMT -6
86b-2 better? Not sure. If you are updating the 286 with a few twists and making it cheaper i am not sure if the term better applies. Although i have not used a 286 i would be interested in testing the two out. Frankly, I hope the 286a is better because I have it and appears to be the hand-wired version. But for the sake of the wonderful Locomotive people and their customers, I hope the 86b-2 is great. I have a hard time believing that Locomotive would put out anything that is not great. |
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