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Post by skav on Sept 3, 2021 13:23:40 GMT -6
YOUR opinion on why it's a good OR a bad idea to get into the UAD plugin ecosystem in 2021? Ja? Nei? Please share your thoughts!
I have been thinking about it, but am very hesitant as I think I have what I need already, but at the same time curious. I have never tried the products myself.
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Post by Guitar on Sept 3, 2021 13:31:08 GMT -6
I think there was another big thread about this a month or so ago if you dig down a bit.
Short answer for me is they are "one of the good ones" So they have some standouts, some that are the same as many other comparable plugs, and some that aren't worth using.
But the cost of entry is about twice as expensive as, say, buying Plugin Alliance, due to higher plugin prices, and the DSP required to run them.
I don't use mine more or less than any other brand of plugins I own. I'm glad to have them but I could do without them also.
If you want specific recommendations, I've been using Pultec, Fairchild, 1176, Neve 1073, and API 500 EQ quite a bit lately. The SSL strips also get some use in my drum template.
If you do enter, be prepared to go down the rabbit hole and spend a ton of money. Anything that exists native (Sonnox, many of the brainworx ones, etc) buy native.
I don't really rate the guitar amps from them so I would skip those. Unison technology also gets a 'Meh' from me. So I just use them like regular mix plugins.
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Post by kcatthedog on Sept 3, 2021 13:45:48 GMT -6
If you have a good relationship with a retailer/friend, maybe see if you could demo a unit and try the plugs, UA has a 14 day demo: only your ears will really answer your question .
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Post by mrholmes on Sept 3, 2021 14:13:39 GMT -6
I left UAD when it was clear that other brands can do the same native. One of the best examples is the BRA Magnitite at a fraction of the UAD costs and it sounds like what I expect to sound like. Special with the upcoming M1-X by Apple...
I can't see myself going back to the DSP route.
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Post by Johnkenn on Sept 3, 2021 14:38:57 GMT -6
When I can run a 50 channel mix with several VST instruments at 32 buffers, I’ll consider it. But that day is a long way away.
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Post by tkaitkai on Sept 3, 2021 15:16:08 GMT -6
I love my UAD plugins. But I would be fine without them. Surprisingly, the main one I'd really hate to lose is the 1176 collection. There are better-sounding options (Arturia FET-76, Overloud Gem 76, PA Purple MC77), but they tend to be kind of CPU-hungry. The UADs sound fine (even the MKIs) and they load fast as hell. Great utility compressors.
Other than that, I can't really think of a single UAD plugin I'd have trouble replacing.
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Post by phdamage on Sept 3, 2021 15:30:43 GMT -6
I think I would struggle to get mixes done without UAD plugs. my comp is no slouch, but being able to off-load a ton of DSP to my Octo means I'm rarely in situations where my computer is crapping out.
Also, their plugs are top notch. Don't get me wrong, plenty of great native stuff out there, but I often just stick to UAD as it's easier to dial things in - though this could certainly be due to familiarity.
Worth noting - if you are buying into it, see if you can snag a used card with plugs someone else bought on them. Will be far better bang for your buck! In my early years of UAD, I would often buy used cards with plugs, dump the plugs to my UAD account, and then re-sell the card. I'd often end up getting 4-5 killer plugs for maybe $75 when all is said and done.
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Post by sirthought on Sept 3, 2021 17:01:22 GMT -6
They are certainly one of the best devs out there. The price is the main concern.
I'll say this: if you go in, it's smarter to go all in at once. Buy an Octo satellite. Then spend the $1k+ for the huge everything bundle. Yes that's a huge investment, but it gets the cost per plugin down to around $35-$45. From this viewpoint it's pretty reasonable and you are lacking nothing, with many of them not really comparable.
I don't know anybody who really wants to do this who doesn't end up spending that much money over time anyhow. So why not just go all in with a top dev and get a strong DSP benefit.
If you want to just get one or two at a time, it's a terrible task of waiting for the best price and weighing whether you like one brand better than another. Just stay away from UAD and get a PA subscription, because they make decent stuff to and you can learn about a lot of different tools quickly.
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Post by gwlee7 on Sept 3, 2021 17:17:02 GMT -6
I was one of the biggest “complainers” on that other UAD that Guitar mentioned. However, my complaint was more about the timing of a purchase of an Apollo with a USB connection being rendered obsolete just over a year after purchasing it. I also have an OCTO usb. I wanted to dump all of it while I was feeling kinda “pissy” about the whole situation but, I am still using the OCTO and the plugs I have a lot of the time, especially on rough mixes. I got a different interface, set the Apollo to the side and will just not buy anything else from UA. However, if I had a computer with Thunderbolt, I would seriously consider UA again.
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Post by mrholmes on Sept 3, 2021 17:50:03 GMT -6
When I can run a 50 channel mix with several VST instruments at 32 buffers, I’ll consider it. But that day is a long way away. Using the damn low latency button and freezing, or running the vsti on an external server machine does not hurt. When power is needed my old 8 core jumps in running vienna. Most users miss the fact that they can run cpu intense audio plug ins on the vienna server.
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Post by sirthought on Sept 3, 2021 18:02:35 GMT -6
When I can run a 50 channel mix with several VST instruments at 32 buffers, I’ll consider it. But that day is a long way away. Using the damn low latency button and freezing, or running the vsti on an external server machine does not hurt. When power is needed my old 8 core jumps in running vienna. Most users miss the fact that they can run cpu intense audio plug ins on the vienna server. But then you are running a total system as expensive as UAD. If I have a large mix going and later in the game decide I need to punch something in, what's helping more? Using the DSP, or turning off a bunch of native plugs or figuring out what to freeze? The DSP has me worrying much less in that situation.
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jes
Full Member
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Post by jes on Sept 3, 2021 18:11:20 GMT -6
If it’s plug-in vs plug-in, they are very good but there are other very good options.
If the DSP helps you, then go for it. But if not, I don’t see the point.
I had the UAD-1 PCI, then the UAD PCMCIA, and then when I had to buy more stuff to keep using the same plugs with a new computer, I gave up. I really hate spending serious money on music gear that is destined for landfill in the short term. I understand I’m screwed on the computer front, but I’d prefer not to have the same problem with hardware.
I think if I went outboard DSP at this point, I’d be more likely to do a H9000 or something.
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Post by ab101 on Sept 3, 2021 18:12:33 GMT -6
I opened a project this last week and it had a UAD Neve 1084 on it, and I remember thinking about how great it sounded. Would it be same as an outboard nevish eq? No way. E.g., my heritage 73eq jrs. kill the UAD Neve eqs. But since I bought my octo card so many years ago, and invested in some of these UAD plugs - well - it still has its purpose. But what I do not understand is why they have not updated their cards by now. Computers are so much faster than when I bought my Octo, and one can put plugs on a superfast SSD with incredibly low latency access, etc., I am not sure I would have bought the Octo today. I do like the suggestion about buying UAD used with plugins included. Cheers!
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Post by kcatthedog on Sept 3, 2021 18:28:48 GMT -6
If it’s plug-in vs plug-in, they are very good but there are other very good options. If the DSP helps you, then go for it. But if not, I don’t see the point. I had the UAD-1 PCI, then the UAD PCMCIA, and then when I had to buy more stuff to keep using the same plugs with a new computer, I gave up. I really hate spending serious money on music gear that is destined for landfill in the short term. I understand I’m screwed on the computer front, but I’d prefer not to have the same problem with hardware. I think if I went outboard DSP at this point, I’d be more likely to do a H9000 or something. Just to be clear UA had to mothball UAD-1 as it was end of life. It offered an upgrade Reimbursement for a period of time, then went uad-2. Perhaps, I misunderstood, but don’t see how it is any more destined for dust bin then anything else digital. But, agreed a used octo with some plugs would be a good starting point.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Sept 3, 2021 18:48:01 GMT -6
If you can get by with the limitations of the DSP platform UAD is probably one of if not the most consistent sounding family of plugins. If you count the cost of DSP, even with the coupons. Can you finder cheaper native substitutes? Yes but not in a one stop shop, that’s were UAD has the advantage.
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Post by sirthought on Sept 3, 2021 18:49:33 GMT -6
I opened a project this last week and it had a UAD Neve 1084 on it, and I remember thinking about how great it sounded. Would it be same as an outboard nevish eq? No way. E.g., my heritage 73eq jrs. kill the UAD Neve eqs. But since I bought my octo card so many years ago, and invested in some of these UAD plugs - well - it still has its purpose. But what I do not understand is why they have not updated their cards by now. Computers are so much faster than when I bought my Octo, and one can put plugs on a superfast SSD with incredibly low latency access, etc., I am not sure I would have bought the Octo today. I do not like the suggestion about about buying UAD used with plugins included. Cheers! They haven't updated for several reasons, but largely the complaints Jes had above your comment. They run the risk by updating of things no longer being compatible and not working together as a system. Also, their code works now and they don't want to pay devs again for re-coding the whole library to be optimized for a new chipset. Finally, they are making a killing with the current business model. Hard to walk away from that. But the whole purpose of LUNA is to slowly move new product into these native extensions and still keep you tied into the UA ecosystem.
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Post by OtisGreying on Sept 3, 2021 19:08:09 GMT -6
I use the plugins everyday, but sold my interface. If you have good preamps I don’t think the interfaces are worth it. If you’re just starting with no pres the interfaces are great.
As far as the plugins I like having the off load affect because my computer needs it. I’m aware I’m spending the top top premium to do this though because DSP is expensive. So I’m torn for the plugs, I personally dig them but they’re expensive
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Post by BenjaminAshlin on Sept 3, 2021 19:16:43 GMT -6
I left UAD about 2 years ago now. They make great plugins but anyone who can't run a ~100 track session without DSP needs a new computer or interface with better drivers. (tracking vocals is a different story)
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Post by sirthought on Sept 3, 2021 19:27:10 GMT -6
I use the plugins everyday, but sold my interface. If you have good preamps I don’t think the interfaces are worth it. If you’re just starting with no pres the interfaces are great. As far as the plugins I like having the off load affect because my computer needs it. I’m aware I’m spending the top top premium to do this though because DSP is expensive. So I’m torn for the plugs, I personally dig them but they’re expensive This is all true. There's better interfaces out there, but feature-for-feature Apollo is a professional tool especially appealing to someone starting out. Tons of pros use them still. The DSP is expensive too, yet for some people it's effective in their workflow. If I was starting over again I don't know if I would go down that road. But many of the better plugins cost a lot of money and don't offer DSP advantages, so I don't think going the UAD is the worst move. I do wish they might partner with someone like Valhalla or Soundtoys to get some modern approach in there. If I hadn't gone UAD and knew what I know now, I probably would have bought the Fab Filter bundle. That's just as expensive.
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Post by indiehouse on Sept 3, 2021 21:16:17 GMT -6
UAD has answered their criticism with Luna, which is poised to become a ProTools HD replacement. Integrated latency-free tracking through plugs (monitoring or printing) is what you would get into UAD for.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Sept 3, 2021 23:48:29 GMT -6
I won't even go near Luna until it can do everything I can do in Logic. UAD's Apollo system has served me well and it did exactly what I needed it to do flawlessly.
But if I was starting again I would go with a better sounding interface and use an assortment of other brands of plug-ins. The only thing UAD has made I "can't do without" is the ATR-102, which just makes everything better. I'm sure in time I could find one tape sim I liked. Yes, the EMT-140 sounds great on some things, but I have a dozen other reverbs that sound great, many with excellent plate reverbs.
I don't use the preamps ever. Only if I was tracking a group live could they come in handy.
I resent not being able to sell or trade my UAD plugs. I have so many I don''t use, or I thought I liked but found I didn't really like them, the API 2500 comes to mind and the Massive Passive EQ. I would really like to have a few of their new ones, but they're just not enough bang for the buck.
One day I'll just get a better interface and buy an octo to run the plugs I do have in a mix, unless I could get a fair price with all the plug-ins. I can see that I could let them go without too much worry.
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Post by mrholmes on Sept 4, 2021 3:47:00 GMT -6
Using the damn low latency button and freezing, or running the vsti on an external server machine does not hurt. When power is needed my old 8 core jumps in running vienna. Most users miss the fact that they can run cpu intense audio plug ins on the vienna server. But then you are running a total system as expensive as UAD. If I have a large mix going and later in the game decide I need to punch something in, what's helping more? Using the DSP, or turning off a bunch of native plugs or figuring out what to freeze? The DSP has me worrying much less in that situation.
Not at all .... an old 8 core mac pro is about 400 bucks and the Vienna software in sale is about 130 bucks. And I can run way more plugs on that old mac pro than on an apollo etc.... I am free, I am not bound to the mercy of UAD plug ins.
BTW: The Vienna session is locked to my DAW session, nothing to worry about in any second.
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Post by nick8801 on Sept 4, 2021 7:00:19 GMT -6
Love the UAD plug-ins. There are lots I bought that I really never use unfortunately, but the ones that I do use are indispensable, and not really available in native. If I had to go back in time, I would have never bought into the Apollo thing. While it’s a solid converter, you are paying for a lot of features that at least I never used. As far as the plugs go, just hunt down a used satellite online somewhere. Every once in a while you’ll see one at a great price. Never ever buy the plugins at full price. Wait for sales and demo several times if possible to see if you reallllly need it. Also, check for native solutions at lower costs. Some of my must haves at this point are...
Manley Massive Passive. I use it on almost every master, and sometimes busses. It’s really smooth and natural sounding.
Capital Chambers. Wow. Never heard a plug-in verb better.
1176/LA2A - Every mix somewhere, although there are lots of great native options in this department.
Neve Compressors/Neve 1073eq - I just love these.
There are lots of others I use, but those are first call on every mix.
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jes
Full Member
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Post by jes on Sept 4, 2021 7:32:48 GMT -6
I had the UAD-1 PCI, then the UAD PCMCIA, and then when I had to buy more stuff to keep using the same plugs with a new computer, I gave up. I really hate spending serious money on music gear that is destined for landfill in the short term. I understand I’m screwed on the computer front, but I’d prefer not to have the same problem with hardware. I think if I went outboard DSP at this point, I’d be more likely to do a H9000 or something. Just to be clear UA had to mothball UAD-1 as it was end of life. It offered an upgrade Reimbursement for a period of time, then went uad-2. Perhaps, I misunderstood, but don’t see how it is any more destined for dust bin then anything else digital. But that's exactly my point. Even old digital hardware that's considered "bad" like a Digitech DSP 128 still works if you took care of it and got lucky (of course things eventually do break-- see the other thread). But I don't like buying things where companies can "mothball" them because they reach "end of life," which is a euphemism for planned obsolescence, which is a business choice, not an act of nature or a consequence of use. The fact that UA offered a paid upgrade plan is irrelevant. You can say it wasn't their decision to stop building computers with the PCI bus and you'd be right. But computer hardware is part of their business model. From their standpoint it makes a lot of sense, and from their standpoint they offered something to soften the blow; I get it. I just no longer want to participate in that kind of thing as a user.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2021 8:17:54 GMT -6
They’re good but often try a bit too hard to sound “analog” and the compressors aren’t as good or as cracked out as what you can get native in 2021.
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