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Post by OtisGreying on Oct 6, 2021 4:32:46 GMT -6
How do we like 84s on piano? What do you guys feel 84s shine on?
Can’t wait to get my hands on these mics, I hope Carlos is done soon.. my gas is kickin in
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rpc
Junior Member
Posts: 69
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Post by rpc on Oct 6, 2021 12:26:15 GMT -6
"How do we like 84s on piano? What do you guys feel 84s shine on?"
I want to try them on (classical) strings. If they work I'll try to make/buy some spheres and try a Decca tree. (Of course that means purchasing a third one but I don't think Carlos will mind!)
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Post by mcirish on Oct 6, 2021 15:42:55 GMT -6
I like the KM84 on acoustic instruments like guitar, mandolin and upright bass. Not my favorite on violin though.
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Post by bossanova on Oct 8, 2021 14:52:03 GMT -6
This is based on using the Warm 84, so take it with a grain of salt, but it’s the most no-hype mic I’ve used. It captures the natural tone of vocals without being pokey in the mids or harsh in the highs, takes EQ well, and it will respond to every nuance in the room. The trade-off is that it doesn’t sound great in a bad room, and it doesn’t “cut” the way a mid-forward mic will in a mix.
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Post by sirthought on Nov 26, 2021 21:07:07 GMT -6
Any updates on these Carlos? I'm hoping to get some mics before Christmas.
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Post by cserrano on Nov 28, 2021 21:51:42 GMT -6
Any updates on these Carlos? I'm hoping to get some mics before Christmas. The Serrano 84s and 83s are definitely coming along. Before Christmas is still a possibility but it will be tight! I'm eager to be able to have a concrete release date, but not quite yet. Thanks for inquiring!
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Post by mike on Nov 29, 2021 6:15:02 GMT -6
The Serrano 84s and 83s are definitely coming along. Before Christmas is still a possibility but it will be tight! I'm eager to be able to have a concrete release date, but not quite yet. Thanks for inquiring!
I'm looking forward to it, but take all the time you need Carlos. I appreciate your approach and priority to getting it right more than anything else.
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Post by Ward on Nov 29, 2021 6:37:37 GMT -6
Any updates on these Carlos? I'm hoping to get some mics before Christmas. The Serrano 84s and 83s are definitely coming along. Before Christmas is still a possibility but it will be tight! I'm eager to be able to have a concrete release date, but not quite yet. Thanks for inquiring! I'm just gonna trust you on that. Since your 87 turned out so fantastic, I doubt you'll do a firm release until it's bulletproof. Kudos and cheers
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Post by hadaja on Feb 14, 2022 12:59:52 GMT -6
For those who pre ordered the serrano 84 the Latest update from Carlos this morning contained both good and bad news. Bad news was the delay but good news was the decision to offer the Serrano 84 with a total of 3 capsules – KK84 (standard), KK83 (omni) and now also the KK84-DARK. I am quite excited by this. It felt like an Oprah issue where everyone got a car. Great job Carlos.
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Post by Ward on Feb 15, 2022 18:39:21 GMT -6
For those who pre ordered the serrano 84 the Latest update from Carlos this morning contained both good and bad news. Bad news was the delay but good news was the decision to offer the Serrano 84 with a total of 3 capsules – KK84 (standard), KK83 (omni) and now also the KK84-DARK. I am quite excited by this. It felt like an Oprah issue where everyone got a car. Great job Carlos. Are all three capsules compatible with my old KM84s?
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Post by notneeson on Feb 15, 2022 18:43:02 GMT -6
For those who pre ordered the serrano 84 the Latest update from Carlos this morning contained both good and bad news. Bad news was the delay but good news was the decision to offer the Serrano 84 with a total of 3 capsules – KK84 (standard), KK83 (omni) and now also the KK84-DARK. I am quite excited by this. It felt like an Oprah issue where everyone got a car. Great job Carlos. Are all three capsules compatible with my old KM84s? I’m pretty sure the capsules/bodies ended up not being compatible with Neumann but I don’t mean to speak for Carlos.
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Post by hadaja on Feb 15, 2022 19:12:15 GMT -6
For those who pre ordered the serrano 84 the Latest update from Carlos this morning contained both good and bad news. Bad news was the delay but good news was the decision to offer the Serrano 84 with a total of 3 capsules – KK84 (standard), KK83 (omni) and now also the KK84-DARK. I am quite excited by this. It felt like an Oprah issue where everyone got a car. Great job Carlos. Are all three capsules compatible with my old KM84s? No idea. Sorry you will need to check with Carlos
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Post by wiz on Feb 15, 2022 19:40:45 GMT -6
Are all three capsules compatible with my old KM84s? No idea. Sorry you will need to check with Carlos That would be a huge market advantage...if they were compatible
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Post by cserrano on Feb 15, 2022 20:12:51 GMT -6
For those who pre ordered the serrano 84 the Latest update from Carlos this morning contained both good and bad news. Bad news was the delay but good news was the decision to offer the Serrano 84 with a total of 3 capsules – KK84 (standard), KK83 (omni) and now also the KK84-DARK. I am quite excited by this. It felt like an Oprah issue where everyone got a car. Great job Carlos. Are all three capsules compatible with my old KM84s? The Serrano 84 capsules are not be compatible with Neumann, but I agree that would be really neat!
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Post by Ward on Feb 16, 2022 6:19:45 GMT -6
Are all three capsules compatible with my old KM84s? The Serrano 84 capsules are not be compatible with Neumann, but I agree that would be really neat! Thanks. I was extremest hopeful, cos I would hit you up for some capsules!! Especially the 83.
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Post by drbill on Feb 16, 2022 9:35:51 GMT -6
The Serrano 84 capsules are not be compatible with Neumann, but I agree that would be really neat! Thanks. I was extremest hopeful, cos I would hit you up for some capsules!! Especially the 83. The KM83 is the magical overlooked step-child of the KM series IMO. You can put it right up on the sound hole of an acoustic, and not get boomy like with an 84. Actually easier to place, and because of that, I don't really feel the "roominess" that I often do with an omni. Serrano is smart to release with multi capsules.
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Post by indiehouse on Mar 24, 2022 19:11:08 GMT -6
What’s the word on these?
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Post by enlav on Mar 24, 2022 19:35:09 GMT -6
Late April was the latest word.
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Post by hadaja on Mar 24, 2022 22:46:16 GMT -6
Carlos sent out an email 17th of march to preorder customers.
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 25, 2022 0:37:37 GMT -6
The warm prototype 84 capsule threading was compatible with Neumann, but that was then dropped, apparently sone Neumann Sabre rattling I think. I see above Carlos says his aren’t too, likely a wise move.
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Post by plinker on Mar 25, 2022 7:18:41 GMT -6
I wonder if there would be a problem if Warm or Serrano just provided the thread specs and barrel diameter?
...assuming here that stating compatibility with an existing product is the problem.
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Post by the other mark williams on Mar 25, 2022 12:12:02 GMT -6
The warm prototype 84 capsule threading was compatible with Neumann, but that was then dropped, apparently sone Neumann Sabre rattling I think. I see above Carlos says his aren’t too, likely a wise move. I'm going to quote a lengthier post from cserrano back on page 2 of this thread, only because I think it answers the question of why his capsules/threads aren't directly compatible with Neumann's. I doubt it's from Neumann raising concerns in this case. I think Carlos explains well here what the simple economies of scale are, and how his design decisions are impacted by projected sales. It's a nice peek behind the curtain of gear manufacture, and helps me understand better what kinds of limitations Carlos and other small builders have to overcome to bring a superior product to market. I thought you'd appreciate this, too, plinker, given your post above. Thank you for your question. Please excuse the length of this response but I want to give you a complete, nuanced answer. Keeping costs down? No, and yes: There hasn't been any decisions to cut costs down at the component level of the individual microphone. That is to say that all the parts, the capsule, the transformer, etc. are all at the highest level of premium. However, when it comes to metalwork companies, they will typically require a minimum quantity order of several thousands of units in order to lengthen the body to accommodate a pad. This is because the tooling and moulding has to be "rebuilt." Just to do a slight modification on a body would require a minimum quantity order over 10-20 times of that which I currently order. So these metalwork manufacturers mostly work with very large companies who have grown their business to the retail level. You can find their products at Guitar Center, MusiciansFriend, zZounds, etc. The drawback is that those large companies are required to have a distributor like RAD Distribution or else Guitar Center, MusiciansFriends and zZounds will not do business with them. And then to have a distributor like RAD, they might require 1/3 of the profit (though I don't know exactly their cut.) Doing this typically causes one of two scenarios; either the consumer price of the products will need to be significantly raised, or the products themselves will need to have compromises made and won't sound as good -- which is why companies like Black Lion Audio, Revive Audio, Signal Art Electronics, Oktavamod, etc. can then create a thriving business just by undoing and fixing the compromises through offering modifications that put in more premium components. A company like Neumann makes no compromises and their products are very expensive (however an argument could be made that their TLM line is their own way of compromising.) And I'm sure you can think of companies who's products are being modded all the time to sound better -- I won't mention them by name in order not to disparage them; but you get the idea. At the level of principle I don't think there is anything wrong with being in retail. But to do it without compromising with products requires a lot more capital and a lot more resources. Serrano Audio simply is not in the retail business and does not have a distributor. Serrano Audio also sells products in small batches. Going back to these metalwork manufacturers; only a few of them are willing to do OEM business with me if I use bodies/chassis that are readily available and don't require more tooling with extremely high minimum quantity orders. Because Serrano Audio operates on small scale, is not in retail with a distributor and uses readily available metalwork, the prices of our products can remain lower while also being at the at the highest level of premium. And thus modding them with more premium parts is not a thing. I wasn't able to find readily available OEM bodies, from a company WILLING to work with me, that only included an opening for a pad. Also, after building several prototypes without pads as well as some DIY kits without pads, I was extremely pleased and content without the pad. I have also not heard complaints from others who have built DIY KM84 kits about a lack of a pad. And what I mentioned in an earlier post about the Serrano 84 only having a 5dB difference with a Neumann KM84 with its pad engaged, I think it becomes even less necessary. Because of all these factors Serrano Audio is then able to make available the Serrano 84, with no compromises in sound quality or components, at this very affordable price. ... But you don't have a pad.
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 25, 2022 13:09:38 GMT -6
so what is a pair selling for ?
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Post by the other mark williams on Mar 25, 2022 14:29:42 GMT -6
so what is a pair selling for ? I don't know if there's been a final price announced for them once they're in stock. I know those of us who pre-ordered got a very nice discount. I don't even remember offhand what it was, though.
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Post by enlav on Mar 25, 2022 15:20:50 GMT -6
I don't know if there's been a final price announced for them once they're in stock. I know those of us who pre-ordered got a very nice discount. I don't even remember offhand what it was, though. I'm not sure if it'd be frowned upon to say what the intro or pre-order price is given it's been removed from the first post.
Considering that (If my memory is still intact) only the cardioid capsule pair were initially planned and now we're looking at cardioid, dark-cardioid, and omni, I would have no idea where to start guessing.
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