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Post by EmRR on Apr 8, 2019 19:14:32 GMT -6
The 6386 is the input stage and the gain reduction. The input transformer would be considered the first 'gain'. If it's like a Sta, the input control is between transformer and 6386.
I don't think of tubes as having headroom differences, that's the circuit. If there's big differences between tubes they aren't really the same tube type or one is bad.
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 8, 2019 20:08:37 GMT -6
Interesting. I thought the 6386 was only gain reduction. I just assumed like in a guitar amp, some tubes had less headroom or broke up sooner than others.
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Post by jtc111 on Apr 8, 2019 22:29:55 GMT -6
I got an email from Chris telling me "the iron is on the way" so he should have more of these ready to ship soon.
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Post by Ward on Apr 9, 2019 7:46:09 GMT -6
Well, going back and listening. I TOTALLY over-compressed going in...doh. So it's a little hairy at the peaks...still learning. Nothing that can't be dealt with - and I'm not sure you will even hear it in the end product. And that can be the issue with the sta-level. Man, I'd love to have both side by side. I might text Chris or Bowie about NOS tube swaps to see which tubes might have higher headroom. I'm not really sure which tubes are responsible for the input gain... EmRR you know? I was going into the comp with proper gain staging. I might just have to learn this one specifically. Maybe Double mode with lower input. Hey, you're in Nashville. Over-compressed and hairy describes nearly every mix out of there, for the past 8-9 years. Notable exceptions! |
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 9, 2019 9:29:10 GMT -6
Well, going back and listening. I TOTALLY over-compressed going in...doh. So it's a little hairy at the peaks...still learning. Nothing that can't be dealt with - and I'm not sure you will even hear it in the end product. And that can be the issue with the sta-level. Man, I'd love to have both side by side. I might text Chris or Bowie about NOS tube swaps to see which tubes might have higher headroom. I'm not really sure which tubes are responsible for the input gain... EmRR you know? I was going into the comp with proper gain staging. I might just have to learn this one specifically. Maybe Double mode with lower input. Hey, you're in Nashville. Over-compressed and hairy describes nearly every mix out of there, for the past 8-9 years. Notable exceptions! Touché. Just talking to Bowie and he said (as did EmRR a i believe) that the headroom thing wasn’t really in the tubes, Moreno in the input padding and input transformer. I guess that’s been the hardest thing to get right - hit it too hard and it gets dirty, not enough and it doesn’t compress. This is going to take a lot more experimenting. I knew I was probably hitting too hard on the peaks (about 15 to -20). Again - nothing that most would have a problem with, just a little more saturation than I like. Got to find the happy medium...need to find out whether it’s better to hit it harder coming in with less input on the sta, or less input from the pre and more input on the sta. Then how each mode reacts. |
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Post by 000 on Apr 9, 2019 9:50:43 GMT -6
Hey, you're in Nashville. Over-compressed and hairy describes nearly every mix out of there, for the past 8-9 years. Notable exceptions! I guess that’s been the hardest thing to get right - hit it too hard and it gets dirty, not enough and it doesn’t compress. hmmm... |
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Post by swafford on Apr 9, 2019 10:38:59 GMT -6
I knew I was probably hitting too hard on the peaks (about 15 to -20). Again - nothing that most would have a problem with, just a little more saturation than I like. Got to find the happy medium...need to find out whether it’s better to hit it harder coming in with less input on the sta, or less input from the pre and more input on the sta. Then how each mode reacts. I like to hit the Retro so the Input on the Sta stays between 11:00 and 1:00 on single and the output around 12:00. Usually peaks the comp around 10 or so on the swinging meter (sorry, I know there are tech terms for this stuff and I should know them, but I don't care to.) I then adjust the release to how much I want the vocal to sit on top or disappear at the tail of a phrase. I know...science! Here's a sample of my pal Freedy's song Evie's Garden I was working on yesterday with those exact settings: comealongcafe.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Evies-Garden-M3.1.mp3 |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Apr 9, 2019 10:45:14 GMT -6
The vocal sounds pretty good swafford, thanks for posting. Was the Sta used on only that vocal track?
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Post by swafford on Apr 9, 2019 11:49:39 GMT -6
The vocal sounds pretty good swafford, thanks for posting. Was the Sta used on only that vocal track? Thanks! If you mean was it used anyplace else in this song - no. If you mean was it the only comp on the vocal - yes. It lives there. It's all I've used on my vocal for the last 3 or 4 years. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 9, 2019 11:55:56 GMT -6
I guess that’s been the hardest thing to get right - hit it too hard and it gets dirty, not enough and it doesn’t compress. hmmm... Oh no no no, I didn’t mean the V Comp, I was just paraphrasing what bowie said about state level builds in general |
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 10, 2019 12:51:25 GMT -6
Actually think this was just bad gain staging by me.
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Post by Ward on Apr 10, 2019 21:13:36 GMT -6
Actually think this was just bad gain staging by me. Takes a numble man to admit that. I'll folllow your lead and admit I've made those mistakes too . . . recently, even. I can't wait to be able to order one of these! And the D-Comp, I absolutely LOVE that one. |
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Post by jtc111 on Apr 10, 2019 22:22:08 GMT -6
I asked Chris to send me an invoice when these were back in stock. He sent it tonight and my v-comp will be on the way tomorrow.
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Post by the other mark williams on Apr 11, 2019 0:07:35 GMT -6
I asked Chris to send me an invoice when these were back in stock. He sent it tonight and my v-comp will be on the way tomorrow. Wow, fantastic! Can't wait to hear your thoughts. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Apr 11, 2019 2:54:46 GMT -6
Ward, do you have a D comp or just want to get one ?
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Post by kcatthedog on Apr 11, 2019 2:56:08 GMT -6
Have people tried the v comp on bass : just curious: how multi purpose it may be ?
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 11, 2019 8:48:22 GMT -6
Have people tried the v comp on bass : just curious: how multi purpose it may be ? Sounds great on bass in single...like the Retro, it can be a little farty in double and triple. |
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Post by Ward on Apr 11, 2019 10:12:09 GMT -6
Ward, do you have a D comp or just want to get one ? Just want to, and will, get one! And a D-Comp. Next album. |
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Post by mike on Apr 11, 2019 10:57:33 GMT -6
I asked Chris to send me an invoice when these were back in stock. He sent it tonight and my v-comp will be on the way tomorrow.
Mine too, looking forward to it!
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 11, 2019 21:00:04 GMT -6
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Post by the1984studios on Apr 11, 2019 21:09:22 GMT -6
Have people tried the v comp on bass : just curious: how multi purpose it may be ? The V really shines on vox and bass, IMO. It can be cool on drums if you're looking for a much more "retro" vibe, which is cool! To all who are asking how it compares to a Retro STA.... TBH, I think I prefer the V over the STA. Input and Output have way more useable range and I feel like the recovery times are a bit faster sounding, but I can still get the GOOEY MU thing happening with little to no effort. IDK if it's just me going crazy or what, but John, regarding your gain-staging "issues" and finding the right balance between saturation and compression, etc on the V, I found that changing the 6V6 tubes made a dramatic difference as to how the V saturated and responded to lowend (specifically). I dug the JJ's that my unit shipped with (I'd assume yours has JJ's as well) but I was fortunate enough to have a pair of 1956 RCA Grey Glass Black Plates laying around, so curiously, I popped them in. Let's just say, I haven't taken them out since (except to directly compare them to the JJ's). I noticed a pronounced difference in the amount and TYPE of grit I was getting, and how early I was getting it. Also, I felt like the RCA's opened up the top-end a bit more... as you can probably imagine, they were just overall bigger, better and more pleasing to the ear than the JJ's (which again, sound fantastic in their own right and are probably fine for MOST users). I'm a tube snob so, you know.... =D Hope it helps, guys! And to those who have V's on the way.... man oh man, you're in for a treat |
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 11, 2019 22:14:40 GMT -6
I feel tweaky...I’m gonna have to try it.
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Post by jtc111 on Apr 11, 2019 22:42:10 GMT -6
That comp sounds wonderful. I love the way it gives the vocal some attitude. I might have to invest in a nos 6386 just because the thing deserves it. |
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Post by seawell on Apr 11, 2019 23:20:51 GMT -6
Have people tried the v comp on bass : just curious: how multi purpose it may be ? The V really shines on vox and bass, IMO. It can be cool on drums if you're looking for a much more "retro" vibe, which is cool! To all who are asking how it compares to a Retro STA.... TBH, I think I prefer the V over the STA. Input and Output have way more useable range and I feel like the recovery times are a bit faster sounding, but I can still get the GOOEY MU thing happening with little to no effort. IDK if it's just me going crazy or what, but John, regarding your gain-staging "issues" and finding the right balance between saturation and compression, etc on the V, I found that changing the 6V6 tubes made a dramatic difference as to how the V saturated and responded to lowend (specifically). I dug the JJ's that my unit shipped with (I'd assume yours has JJ's as well) but I was fortunate enough to have a pair of 1956 RCA Grey Glass Black Plates laying around, so curiously, I popped them in. Let's just say, I haven't taken them out since (except to directly compare them to the JJ's). I noticed a pronounced difference in the amount and TYPE of grit I was getting, and how early I was getting it. Also, I felt like the RCA's opened up the top-end a bit more... as you can probably imagine, they were just overall bigger, better and more pleasing to the ear than the JJ's (which again, sound fantastic in their own right and are probably fine for MOST users). I'm a tube snob so, you know.... =D Hope it helps, guys! And to those who have V's on the way.... man oh man, you're in for a treat Very helpful, thank you! |
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Post by swafford on Apr 12, 2019 3:37:29 GMT -6
I dug the JJ's that my unit shipped with (I'd assume yours has JJ's as well) but I was fortunate enough to have a pair of 1956 RCA Grey Glass Black Plates laying around, so curiously, I popped them in. Let's just say, I haven't taken them out since (except to directly compare them to the JJ's). Interesting! I have a pile of the same RCA 6v6's I pulled from a Hammond PR-40 cab, I'll have to give this a try. |
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