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Post by christopher on Jun 25, 2020 15:20:19 GMT -6
The 20 tubes would be a concern, but most of the tubes will likely be fine for years to decades- I hope! Just when I think of my guitar amps they all seem to do ok for a long time. But maybe 670 is a whole other maintenance beast.. could it benefit from some rack exhaust fans? One could use a cheap 12v line lump supply and connect new quiet computer case fans. I swapped out my console PSU fan this way after seeing John Hardy suggest it’s easy and doable (in case anyone gets ideas, tread wisely.. go for the highest CFM quiet fan over original CFM.. I went from loud 65 CFM fan to 100+ CFM super quiet fan it’s been a few months, seems ok so far- fingers still crossed, + I have a backup PSU just in case). Still I’m attracted to difficult to reach sound like a moth to a bug light.
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Post by drbill on Jun 25, 2020 15:48:25 GMT -6
The 20 tubes would be a concern, but most of the tubes will likely be fine for years to decades- I hope! Just when I think of my guitar amps they all seem to do ok for a long time. But maybe 670 is a whole other maintenance beast.. could it benefit from some rack exhaust fans? One could use a cheap 12v line lump supply and connect new quiet computer case fans. I swapped out my console PSU fan this way after seeing John Hardy suggest it’s easy and doable (in case anyone gets ideas, tread wisely.. go for the highest CFM quiet fan over original CFM.. I went from loud 65 CFM fan to 100+ CFM super quiet fan it’s been a few months, seems ok so far- fingers still crossed, + I have a backup PSU just in case). Still I’m attracted to difficult to reach sound like a moth to a bug light. You're talking about a sledge hammer compared to a scalpel here in comparing a guitar amp to a 2 Buss compressor. For me, tubes don't go "bad". They go intermittent, weird, crackly, change in volume, do strange things at the worst moments and often leave me not using the unit when I need it. Now....multiply X 20, and make it stereo where imaging is important.  I'm sure Stam will say that all his tubes are tested, dialed in, matched, and perfect. And I've had the exact same from other revered tube suppliers here in the states that I trust implicitly go bad quickly, cause bizarre issues, and generally cause me grief. Tubes are not static in my experience. They are a expendable commodity that's meant to be maintained and changed out by an experienced tech who knows how to get things back to spec. That's my experience and my $0.02. Yours may - and almost certainly will - vary. But 20 tubes in a matched stereo unit gives me serious pause for thought. No matter how great it may sound. Changing out tubes is grade school stuff. Getting a stereo tube compressor to track, compress, gain and image right has been one of the most frustrating gear experiences in my life. And that particular unit only had a fraction of the tubes a 670 requires. |
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Post by drbill on Jun 25, 2020 15:50:03 GMT -6
Still I’m attracted to difficult to reach sound like a moth to a bug light. Hahahaaaa!!! Watch out! ZAAAAAAAP! |
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Post by EmRR on Jun 27, 2020 19:52:39 GMT -6
The 20 tubes would be a concern, but most of the tubes will likely be fine for years to decades- I hope! Just when I think of my guitar amps they all seem to do ok for a long time. But maybe 670 is a whole other maintenance beast. Bingo. They eat expensive tubes. You won’t find an old guy interview that doesn’t talk about retubing every 6 months. Known reality....that everyone forgot. |
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Post by Ward on Jun 28, 2020 6:32:55 GMT -6
The 20 tubes would be a concern, but most of the tubes will likely be fine for years to decades- I hope! Just when I think of my guitar amps they all seem to do ok for a long time. But maybe 670 is a whole other maintenance beast. Bingo. They eat expensive tubes. You won’t find an old guy interview that doesn’t talk about retubing every 6 months. Known reality....that everyone forgot. So . . . in short, every Fairchild clone is planned obsolescence? If the thing burns through tubes like that, what's the point? Every owner is eventually (sooner rather than later) have a pretty boat anchor. My understanding is some of the choobs are 'unobtainium' and no recreations of them are being made. Does it really sound that much better than every other compressor out there? I've never used one, just compared other people's results and touched a couple of knobs. |
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Post by EmRR on Jun 28, 2020 9:43:48 GMT -6
You can switch to double the tubes with the single triode variants in an adapter socket some builders have used(manley T thingy - one example) , like the modern stalevel options. Then everyone hoards those and they get expensive too. I resolved long ago to own no compressors that use a 6386. You can certainly build something like a fairchild without them. BUT! BUT! People want clones and won’t stand for it. Which seems pretty silly to me because.....transformers.....but then there’s the U47 situation, so......
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Post by shakermaker on Jun 28, 2020 13:28:06 GMT -6
"The original Fairchild runs at a very high plate voltage. So high, in fact, that the original
Fairchild manual recommends that you change the tubes every 6 months. We lowered the plate
voltage going to the 6386 tubes to help extend their life and reliability. 6386 tubes can cost anywhere from $120 -$500 each and the unit uses 8 of them! Best case you’re looking at $1,000 every
6 months to be sure an original Fairchild is running up to spec. This is one of the reasons so many
of them sound so different from one another...and why some sound so bad. With the lower plate
voltage and a good set of tubes, the UnFairchild will run reliably for years."
From the unfairchild website.
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Post by shakermaker on Jun 28, 2020 13:31:03 GMT -6
Hopefully Stam factored this in as well or else its beans and toast every for a couple weeks every 6 months haha ... I remember reading on a purple site deeeep in the stamchild thread, somewhere Josh saying they applied a similar technique to ensure the tubes last forever.
Ironically, I believe I saw a picture of George Harrison with a plate of beans and toast with a cup of tea on or near a fairchild in abbey road. It all makes sense now, the food budget went to new tubes 😂
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Post by EmRR on Jun 28, 2020 13:33:56 GMT -6
"The original Fairchild runs at a very high plate voltage. So high, in fact, that the original Fairchild manual recommends that you change the tubes every 6 months. We lowered the plate voltage going to the 6386 tubes to help extend their life and reliability. 6386 tubes can cost anywhere from $120 -$500 each and the unit uses 8 of them! Best case you’re looking at $1,000 every 6 months to be sure an original Fairchild is running up to spec. This is one of the reasons so many of them sound so different from one another...and why some sound so bad. With the lower plate voltage and a good set of tubes, the UnFairchild will run reliably for years." From the unfairchild website. Uh, mostly wrong. It runs at high CURRENT when idling. All that time it's on and doing nothing is when it's eating tubes. If it's compressing it's burning less current. |
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Post by shakermaker on Jun 28, 2020 13:45:14 GMT -6
That's direct from the undertone website who makes arguably one of the most revered 670 clones ... I guess they need to update their literature? lol
I have the stamchild not unfairchild.
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Post by shakermaker on Jun 28, 2020 13:46:29 GMT -6
But if that is the case, I guess I should stop using mine as a night light and roasting marshmallows over it haha
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Post by EmRR on Jun 28, 2020 13:57:11 GMT -6
That's direct from the undertone website who makes arguably one of the most revered 670 clones ... I guess they need to update their literature? lol I have the stamchild not unfairchild. Yeah, well, it's ad copy. And it's wrong. But they don't care, because people mostly don't know anything about it. People kinda get 'voltage', but 'current' glazes the eyes. Revered is a funny word. Looked it up, runs at 230V on the 6386's. That's not 'high'. Pretty standard stuff, given the design (1 stage amp driving a transformer directly). Lowering the voltage.....means lower headroom.... There's better ways to do it, they've been discussed publicly, yet no one seems to be taking the 'better' approach. |
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Post by christopher on Jun 28, 2020 14:04:46 GMT -6
Yikes! Does keeping it powered down help the tubes live longer? Maybe if it’s just powered up for printing stems & mastering? (Edit: I mean, does power cycling do the damage or the extended on time?)
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Post by EmRR on Jun 28, 2020 14:14:57 GMT -6
Yikes! Does keeping it powered down help the tubes live longer? Maybe if it’s just powered up for printing stems & mastering? (Edit: I mean, does power cycling do the damage or the extended on time?) Certainly. Extended on time is like burning a candle. Power cycling is minimal in comparison. Tubes are a finite resource, I don't believe tubes should just be left on and running. They warm up and settle in fast enough to make plans around doing so. |
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 31, 2021 20:59:54 GMT -6
Anyone here have one of these? Several popping up for sale on reverb. Pretty tempting.
I have a deposit down for a 660 but haven't heard a peep about it.
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 31, 2021 21:01:05 GMT -6
Anyone here have one of these? Several popping up for sale on reverb. Pretty tempting. I have a deposit down for a 660 but haven't heard a peep about it. People buying for $2xxx and trying to sell for $6500 lol |
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Post by drbill on Mar 31, 2021 21:54:05 GMT -6
Man....every one that was sold must be up FS on Reverb right now.... LOL Insane.
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 31, 2021 22:02:29 GMT -6
Anyone here have one of these? Several popping up for sale on reverb. Pretty tempting. I have a deposit down for a 660 but haven't heard a peep about it. People buying for $2xxx and trying to sell for $6500 lol mm not quite haha I believe the total price with the switches was close to 5000 or so. Still definitely all trying to make some money haha |
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 31, 2021 22:03:10 GMT -6
Man....every one that was sold must be up FS on Reverb right now.... LOL Insane. ha! Probably not all..but a lot more than I thought would show up. Probably a lot of people that bought more compressor than they wanted/needed and realized how much money is tied up in it. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 31, 2021 22:13:41 GMT -6
Man....every one that was sold must be up FS on Reverb right now.... LOL Insane. ha! Probably not all..but a lot more than I thought would show up. Probably a lot of people that bought more compressor than they wanted/needed and realized how much money is tied up in it. Well, that and probably a lot of people that thought it would be life changing. |
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 31, 2021 22:38:48 GMT -6
ha! Probably not all..but a lot more than I thought would show up. Probably a lot of people that bought more compressor than they wanted/needed and realized how much money is tied up in it. Well, that and probably a lot of people that thought it would be life changing. Yeah very true. I also always wonder how many people buy a hardware piece like this and then don't spend the time to learn it and appreciate it and find it's happy place and how they can integrate that into their work. I'm sure a lot. The only person I can think of here that ordered one was indiehouse I think? You ever get yours? |
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 31, 2021 23:04:36 GMT -6
Well, that and probably a lot of people that thought it would be life changing. Yeah very true. I also always wonder how many people buy a hardware piece like this and then don't spend the time to learn it and appreciate it and find it's happy place and how they can integrate that into their work. I'm sure a lot. The only person I can think of here that ordered one was indiehouse I think? You ever get yours? There is absolutely everything to be said for not cutting corners and getting tools that just work and don’t create problems. Those tools are definitely available. What we get caught up in is buying into scarcity and “legend.” Now - this was a great buy for people wanting some of the legend - at $3k. But man - $5k? For any clone? Sorry - (begin rant) Plumbers don’t buy vintage crescent wrenches at astronomical prices...because there are excellent options available that will get the job done. Somehow, we’ve let the subjectivity of songwriting - art - convince us that the compression we use on a vocal is going to make us create something wonderful. Anyway - it’s just funny (I’m guilty too) that in this hobby/profession/obsession we lose sight of what matters most - the songs. (End rant) I apologize for this - because I realize this is a gear forum - and gear STILL makes me happy. I guess I’m just saying we should admit we are all musicians AND collectors. This is a thread unto itself I guess |
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Post by ab101 on Mar 31, 2021 23:19:15 GMT -6
Maybe 40 years from now people will appreciate the Gyraf G22 I recently acquired. Talk about smooth!
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 31, 2021 23:40:28 GMT -6
Yeah very true. I also always wonder how many people buy a hardware piece like this and then don't spend the time to learn it and appreciate it and find it's happy place and how they can integrate that into their work. I'm sure a lot. The only person I can think of here that ordered one was indiehouse I think? You ever get yours? There is absolutely everything to be said for not cutting corners and getting tools that just work and don’t create problems. Those tools are definitely available. What we get caught up in is buying into scarcity and “legend.” Now - this was a great buy for people wanting some of the legend - at $3k. But man - $5k? For any clone? Sorry - (begin rant) Plumbers don’t buy vintage crescent wrenches at astronomical prices...because there are excellent options available that will get the job done. Somehow, we’ve let the subjectivity of songwriting - art - convince us that the compression we use on a vocal is going to make us create something wonderful. Anyway - it’s just funny (I’m guilty too) that in this hobby/profession/obsession we lose sight of what matters most - the songs. (End rant) I apologize for this - because I realize this is a gear forum - and gear STILL makes me happy. I guess I’m just saying we should admit we are all musicians AND collectors. This is a thread unto itself I guess I agree! Mostly. I mean I'm not a song writer like a lot of folks here. Im an engineer. So tools to me a fun and inspiring in a different but similar way. Either way, I agree it's not the tool that makes the track great and you don't need epic tools to make anything. It's not the tool, it's how you use it. And yes we are always chasing the past as well as pushing into the future, kind of a cool thing about art in generally though. It's all based off of the past and being constantly referenced. Not just in music but in everything art wise. Probably a thread all by itself indeed. haha |
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Post by seawell on Mar 31, 2021 23:52:18 GMT -6
At that price range I think those that could afford it would just go for the Unfairchild.
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I'm sure Stam will say that all his tubes are tested, dialed in, matched, and perfect. And I've had the exact same from other revered tube suppliers here in the states that I trust implicitly go bad quickly, cause bizarre issues, and generally cause me grief. Tubes are not static in my experience. They are a expendable commodity that's meant to be maintained and changed out by an experienced tech who knows how to get things back to spec. That's my experience and my $0.02. Yours may - and almost certainly will - vary. 
