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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 18, 2016 22:38:13 GMT -6
Killer video!
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Post by nobtwiddler on Aug 19, 2016 7:21:15 GMT -6
OK kids, what have we learned from all this?
Nothing new here but tried and true techniques, & methodology, with a mix of vintage and modern gear...beautiful result! Go Vance!
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Post by indiehouse on Aug 19, 2016 7:55:46 GMT -6
That was awesome. Thanks for sharing, man!
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 19, 2016 8:14:32 GMT -6
Yeah that was really cool.
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Post by svart on Aug 19, 2016 8:59:30 GMT -6
A couple thoughts on this..
First, this level of recording, especially "live" like this.. Is NOT possible without lengthy pre-production and practice. Even then, you heard him mention this was take 17..
The problem with these types of videos, is invariably a band will watch this video and come to the studio thinking that they can spend as little money as possible if they can do "all at once" recording, like they see in videos like this. This seems to be the new trend around here at least, and they come in with a "lets jam" mentality and not enough "lets make an album" mentality.
I've got one coming back into the studio this weekend to redo a handful of tracks they were ultimately unhappy with, due to their performances being a little too "jam" and not enough "album", if you know what I mean.
Secondly, I still have issue with vids like this where the guy is like "oh I don't like to use much gear" and then proceeds to rattle off names of about 30 pieces of high end gear throughout the video that are in use across tons of tracks, either during tracking, during mixdown or printed to separate tracks..
Third.. That snare.. There is NO way there isn't compression on that snare. It's 100% dynamically flat, with no rattles at all. Nothing but wet smack and perfect snare strainers.. There has to be compression on it, since even when he solo'd the drums and turned off the parallels, it barely changed at all. Methinks there is still things done to the mix that weren't mentioned.
Lastly, and the part I'm currently having the most trouble with.. The tones are good, the mix is decent, but when he adds the delays, and other effects, it just balloons and transforms into this huge professional mix.
Damn. I just can't seem to get that whole additive effect thing down yet. Nothing I do sounds right, yet this guy makes it seem so simple to just add a couple things and BOOM. Pro mix city.
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Post by mhbunch on Aug 19, 2016 10:24:28 GMT -6
Secondly, I still have issue with vids like this where the guy is like "oh I don't like to use much gear" and then proceeds to rattle off names of about 30 pieces of high end gear throughout the video that are in use across tons of tracks, either during tracking, during mixdown or printed to separate tracks.. Third.. That snare.. There is NO way there isn't compression on that snare. It's 100% dynamically flat, with no rattles at all. Nothing but wet smack and perfect snare strainers.. There has to be compression on it, since even when he solo'd the drums and turned off the parallels, it barely changed at all. Methinks there is still things done to the mix that At about 33:30 you can see that the kick and snare are being slammed by the distressors right behind him.
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Post by indiehouse on Aug 19, 2016 10:41:17 GMT -6
Secondly, I still have issue with vids like this where the guy is like "oh I don't like to use much gear" and then proceeds to rattle off names of about 30 pieces of high end gear throughout the video that are in use across tons of tracks, either during tracking, during mixdown or printed to separate tracks.. Third.. That snare.. There is NO way there isn't compression on that snare. It's 100% dynamically flat, with no rattles at all. Nothing but wet smack and perfect snare strainers.. There has to be compression on it, since even when he solo'd the drums and turned off the parallels, it barely changed at all. Methinks there is still things done to the mix that At about 33:30 you can see that the kick and snare are being slammed by the distressors right behind him. Yeah, but he said he wasn't using them for this track. Right?
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Post by svart on Aug 19, 2016 11:34:24 GMT -6
At about 33:30 you can see that the kick and snare are being slammed by the distressors right behind him. Yeah, but he said he wasn't using them for this track. Right? He said that, but it sure sounds like a slammed distressor/1176 type of snare sound though..
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Post by indiehouse on Aug 19, 2016 11:37:16 GMT -6
He didn't really talk much about the tracking setup. I'm willing to bet a ton of outboard processing was used there, which is why it sounds like it does 'flat'.
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Post by kilroyrock on Aug 19, 2016 11:52:49 GMT -6
That was enjoyable I do enjoy a well placed delay!
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 19, 2016 12:07:11 GMT -6
Just bounced around a little. Seems really cool. He's totally full of it though, those distressors on kick and snare are crushing.
The guitar tones are wild. Maybe I'll have to fire up my shitty Valve Jr. at my next session.
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Post by swurveman on Aug 19, 2016 12:32:40 GMT -6
Those Fulltone Tube Tape Echo's sound great.
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Post by ChaseUTB on Aug 19, 2016 12:39:11 GMT -6
I believe he was playing the final printed snare sound at first then soloed the channel snare that was sent to parallel effects and that's when he said the Distressors were in bypass. I got the impression the final mix snare had distressor and parallel chains he uses ( 33609, to taste bus, delay, GML comp, API 2500) This was a great vid for me. Tracks are recorded together or overdubbed? Almost sounds overdubbed how well the bleed was managed. He didn't go much into the overdub process aside from vox, and weird intro gtr. The bass sounded real cool to me and seeing him boost like +9db on the kick drum plus VOG/ transient designer is crazy:) No reverb other than the room is dope too, plus the analog delay gave the drums life when added into the drum bus. The drums had a lot of punch considering how much compression was used. I have a hard time heavily compressing snares/ kicks, so seeing this made me want to email him to ask more also he is using real drums not samples so I know that had a drastic effect. Thanks for the vid
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Post by noah shain on Aug 19, 2016 12:52:30 GMT -6
Secondly, I still have issue with vids like this where the guy is like "oh I don't like to use much gear" and then proceeds to rattle off names of about 30 pieces of high end gear throughout the video that are in use across tons of tracks, either during tracking, during mixdown or printed to separate tracks.. Third.. That snare.. There is NO way there isn't compression on that snare. It's 100% dynamically flat, with no rattles at all. Nothing but wet smack and perfect snare strainers.. There has to be compression on it, since even when he solo'd the drums and turned off the parallels, it barely changed at all. Methinks there is still things done to the mix that At about 33:30 you can see that the kick and snare are being slammed by the distressors right behind him. You can see the distressors hitting hard every time he hits play. We all know a snare doesn't ring out that long and that full without some compression. BUT his mono "special sauce" channels are big part of that sound and they are smash-ola'd! I was wondering if the distressors are in the insert but the insert return isn't open. Could be they're working but not returning. Regardless, it's a great video, great sound, and you can hear compression very clearly. Reminded me of the sound of the snare on Tenessee Whiskey off the Stapleton record. Obviously compression at work but not crazy pumping/sucking compression. Just tasty and heavy. All hail VP
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Post by swurveman on Aug 19, 2016 13:23:28 GMT -6
He didn't really talk much about the tracking setup. I'm willing to bet a ton of outboard processing was used there, which is why it sounds like it does 'flat'. He didn't talk about guitar compression, but that Fuzz intro guitar on the left is pretty solidly held in place.
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Post by Guitar on Aug 19, 2016 18:07:23 GMT -6
Just bounced around a little. Seems really cool. He's totally full of it though, those distressors on kick and snare are crushing. The guitar tones are wild. Maybe I'll have to fire up my shitty Valve Jr. at my next session. My Mosrite Fuzzrite germanium copy pedal gets some velcro tones like that. DAM made one for a while. The snare does sound compressed to me. I'm with svart, he's either lying or confused about the past. Or using his parallel chains. Also nothing like a good Champ or similar small combo amp in the studio. The mastered version of this track sounds really good. I'm not a fan of the music, but the production is so good, that I kind of like it. Some of the techniques that stood out to me were when he says, "I EQ'd the guitars to sound mono, but then panned them into their own space" that's a great concept to me, and maybe one I haven't tried. He also seems to compress pretty hard. And is not afraid to use guitar pedals, which I am a little shy about still. I know Randge likes pedals too. The no reverb thing also stands out, and I think that's one of his big signatures on his records sounding "in your face" by not giving all this roomy ambience. I also really like the way he treated the drums with the tracking setup, and the way he did the whole band in a room with some ad hoc isolation. I'm no Vance Powell but I did something vaguely similar to that years ago that I'm still pretty proud of, and would like to try again. Also to echo svart the band I recorded back then was so sloppy it took hours of takes and hours of editing to get anywhere near a semblance of a passable take, let alone a "good" take. Not for the faint of heart or loose of hand band.
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Post by swurveman on Aug 20, 2016 9:33:12 GMT -6
Does anybody know how big his tracking room is? I found this picture. The ceiling appears to be very tall. I was surprised how little guitar bleed there was in the room mics.
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 20, 2016 11:41:26 GMT -6
That's actually the room in the front and not Vance's tracking room...but that one might actually be a little bigger.
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Post by nobtwiddler on Aug 20, 2016 17:29:03 GMT -6
Looks like no more then 12 feet?
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 20, 2016 18:41:48 GMT -6
I would say that room is bigger. Probably 25x20 ish
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Post by stratboy on Aug 20, 2016 19:02:54 GMT -6
I think Nob was referring to the ceiling height.
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Post by henge on Aug 21, 2016 9:41:45 GMT -6
Awesome vid! Thanks for posting
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Post by stratboy on Aug 21, 2016 13:31:20 GMT -6
Vance Powell's ears are not like the rest of ours. Check the close up at 18:00. Maybe it's not the gear... 8)
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Post by nobtwiddler on Aug 21, 2016 18:44:32 GMT -6
yep ceiling height !
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Post by yotonic on Aug 21, 2016 23:39:32 GMT -6
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