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Post by wiz on May 15, 2015 1:09:27 GMT -6
Ok, I gave myself 1 hour..., So 2:00 hours later this is what i have lol, I had no plan in mind what so ever, it was more about throwing ideas than doing a finished mix. I slid right into going for the complete opposite of what everyone else was doing with an overall dry sound, It's 100% ITB(which i don't like 8), I did 0 editing except some clip volume edits, some filtering, very little eq, cuts/boosts did not exceed 2db, no comps used more than 2db of reduction, NOTHING was used on the 2 buss at all, I used only a mono verb, a couple delays, and a couple of effects. I used bypassing to match levels by ear, I tried to make it move, and be a bit active to bring some excitement to the tune, as far as the loudness, i think if anything it may be a bit lower in level than wiz's original? It seems almost everyone made thiers louder despite wiz's request? I think this sounds better the more U turn it up with your volume knob...yaay! 8) thanx wiz, it was fun, hope you can get a couple ideas from my whirl? cool tune budro 8) https%3A//soundcloud.com/tonycamp/wizfoolmequickmixI'm sure the bass and drums are going to be considered too hot! Yeah! just the way i like it lol 8) Kick and snare sound cool, again sounds like a different beater/mic set up than what it is.. and the snare was real solid. Vox harmonies were interesting, though I probably wouldnt have that treatment right from the start, but certainly its a great colouring idea. I thought the panning of the nashville acoustic was interesting (done with delay?) Now, coming out of left field, wah on the resonator... now I didn't expect that 8) again, makes your ears prick up and go .. hmmm maybe blended in a bit underneath, rather than fully wet, again, a very cool artistic idea. Also the delays are interesting. Pretty cool stuff and again made me think , artistically about the song. I have been a bit crook this week, and when I am up to it next week, I think its time for me to mix the song and post it up for criticism...and what I will do , is mix it with my original vision for the tune... though its gonna be hard to shake some of these influences.. thanks again for having a crack at the mix nice one Cheers Wiz
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Post by sopwith on May 15, 2015 1:54:04 GMT -6
Awesome mixes in here - song's been stuck in my head for days! Great tune Wiz!
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Post by wiz on May 15, 2015 18:32:36 GMT -6
Wiz, here's my revisit to "Fool Me Once." I don't know what to do about the tom fills, I moved the tom hit in the Resonator solo a little bit, it's still not awesome, and I faded the song to eliminate the one in the back. But I like this mix, it sounds pretty much like a record to me. I try to serve the song and vocal first, and make a mood that suits the tune and performance. This is not a balance that a live performance would have. Given the miracle of ITB total recall, I could tweak just about anything easily. I'd be glad to explain any sounds and processes I used on this. www.dropbox.com/s/mmw7ofynhb4yrii/Foolme%20DonR%20mix7%20copy.mp3?dl=0I saw you post on another thread that you used Ocean Way on the drums.. can you talk about how you used that, how it integrated into your workflow (UAD horsepower, freezing, bouncing down etc) as thats probably the only thing that I covet by UA. cheers Wiz
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Post by donr on May 16, 2015 13:09:33 GMT -6
Wiz, I'm traveling. Post when I can open the session.
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Post by wiz on May 16, 2015 18:39:39 GMT -6
Wiz, I'm traveling. Post when I can open the session. No probs don... when you get a chance, would be great to hear about it... take care Wiz
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Post by odyssey76 on May 16, 2015 20:02:08 GMT -6
I think I may have finished my mix, I'll post tomorrow afternoon so I can take a little time to give my ears a break and listen fresh. I'm dying to hear other people's mixes - the only one I've listened to is @smallbutfine's very 1st mix. I just have to say that's it's terrific that this thread is already up to 6 pages long! This is a great community exercise and I learn a ton from threads like this one. Thanks for posting these tracks wiz!
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Post by wiz on May 17, 2015 1:12:31 GMT -6
Here is my first pass mix.
I think I was influenced by everyone else's mix 8)
I kept it to two hours, in keeping with along the lines of what everyone else did...
As always, I would go back and tweak this over time.. but it is what it is...
go on.. tear me a new one fellas 8)
https%3A//soundcloud.com/user550433336/fool-me-once-wiz-mix
cheers
Wiz
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2015 1:36:45 GMT -6
Nice, really nice! I really like the top end! Sounds really classy. I see how you like your lead guitar. It cuts nicely thru the mix and gives especially a nice contrast to the resonator. I have the impression this mix is not as dark as previous mixes of you. This said, this is just an impression i didn't a/b with your last album, but it sounds really well balanced, maybe because you heard so many versions of your song already. I am very interested in how your mix will sound in the final version. Very interesting to hear the artist mixing his song after so many different cool and interesting mixes from other people.... Great stuff.
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Post by mrholmes on May 17, 2015 10:28:37 GMT -6
Here is my first pass mix. I think I was influenced by everyone else's mix 8) I kept it to two hours, in keeping with along the lines of what everyone else did... As always, I would go back and tweak this over time.. but it is what it is... go on.. tear me a new one fellas 8) https%3A//soundcloud.com/user550433336/fool-me-once-wiz-mixcheers Wiz Like it. Special that the LV is not up mixed. A bit more room on the acoustic guitar?? Oh ah you do not like to hear this but pull the snare a few db down and listen AB the next day. Everything else sounds good to me...
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Post by tonycamphd on May 17, 2015 13:45:21 GMT -6
wiz sounds great mang, you know what you want bud 8) I went back and listened to my turd, after throwing up in my mouth a little 8) I decided to level it out, get rid of some stupid, and bring it up a bit, I was concentrating on ideas and didn't realize how off the balance was..., it still sucks, but it's better now 8) https%3A//soundcloud.com/tonycamp/wizfoolmequickmix2
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Post by odyssey76 on May 17, 2015 15:03:53 GMT -6
Alright here we go. I took some artistic liberties here but I wanted to try a bunch of new ideas. I tried to make it modern but also try to mix like I think wiz might approve. I used 4th Time Lucky as a reference for balances. I have many thoughts about improving this but I'm always my own worst critic so I'd much rather hear what others have to say before I criticize myself. This is the most LCR mix I've done and I also used the free version of Lil' Primal Tap which is a 1st LOL! Song is great and I particularly like how you "took the bass for a walk" at the end of the tune. I may have added a couple subtle elements.....who can pick them out? https%3A//soundcloud.com/treehil/fool-me-once-5-16-15
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Post by mrholmes on May 17, 2015 15:15:00 GMT -6
Justin very cool Version........
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Post by tonycamphd on May 17, 2015 15:21:54 GMT -6
Alright here we go. I took some artistic liberties here but I wanted to try a bunch of new ideas. I tried to make it modern but also try to mix like I think wiz might approve. I used 4th Time Lucky as a reference for balances. I have many thoughts about improving this but I'm always my own worst critic so I'd much rather hear what others have to say before I criticize myself. This is the most LCR mix I've done and I also used the free version of Lil' Primal Tap which is a 1st LOL! Song is great and I particularly like how you "took the bass for a walk" at the end of the tune. I may have added a couple subtle elements.....who can pick them out? https%3A//soundcloud.com/treehil/fool-me-once-5-16-15I like it! i like the fact that you tried stuff out, it makes it interesting! The 2 things i'd change is the shaker, dry it up and throw it in the back somewhere cool, it sounds a bit funny to me being so present with all the ambience on it and way out wide, it's hanging on like the songs trying to shake it off 8) the second thing is id bring the drums in right after the words "sometimes beat" plaaaaappp!!! great job J man!
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Post by odyssey76 on May 17, 2015 15:58:26 GMT -6
Justin very cool Version........ Thanks mrholmes - looking forward to listening to your mix after my son goes to bed!
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Post by odyssey76 on May 17, 2015 16:04:01 GMT -6
Alright here we go. I took some artistic liberties here but I wanted to try a bunch of new ideas. I tried to make it modern but also try to mix like I think wiz might approve. I used 4th Time Lucky as a reference for balances. I have many thoughts about improving this but I'm always my own worst critic so I'd much rather hear what others have to say before I criticize myself. This is the most LCR mix I've done and I also used the free version of Lil' Primal Tap which is a 1st LOL! Song is great and I particularly like how you "took the bass for a walk" at the end of the tune. I may have added a couple subtle elements.....who can pick them out? https%3A//soundcloud.com/treehil/fool-me-once-5-16-15I like it! i like the fact that you tried stuff out, it makes it interesting! The 2 things i'd change is the shaker, dry it up and throw it in the back somewhere cool, it sounds a bit funny to me being so present with all the ambience on it and way out wide, it's hanging on like the songs trying to shake it off 8) the second thing is id bring the drums in right after the words "sometimes beat" plaaaaappp!!! great job J man! Thanks Tony! The shaker is bone dry but I agree it's a little confusing and not quite in it's own space. I just felt like I wanted a little more movement as the tune progressed. Must be the rock in me.......always needing to up the thrill a little more! Will listen to your mixes as well tonight when I can L.I.P. (Listen in Peace).
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Post by carymiller on May 17, 2015 16:09:18 GMT -6
I am adding the bits between the asterix's to help with some confusion ************************** You load it, set the mixer up as I suggested and play through it... think of it as the clients rough mix to you. You then decide, artistically and sonically what it needs. You find the couple of tracking errors in the project and fix them, if you think it needs fixing. You do your "mix thing" be it parallel compression, summing, special effects what ever you think Maybe Dr Bill can run the mix through his silver bullet.. that sort of thing My idea is, we all have the same starting point. But we will end up with a bunch of diffent mixes, and in some cases arrangement changes. That way, if there is some treatment someone does to something that you like, you can ask them about it... and see sonically what it did. Also, the artist has asked that the resultant mix for the Mastering Engineer be no louder than this rough mix.. it can have reduced crest factor but not an overall increase of loudness.... Artists feh ! 8) ****************************** I thought this might be interesting. Maybe it won't be? 8) www.dropbox.com/s/8c1epjtw7l8cll4/Fool%20Me%20Once.zip?dl=0Here is a song I just wrote and tracked. "Fool Me Once" 112Bpm 96khz 24bit Wave Files I thought it might be interesting if people wanted to have a mix.. we often hear about things like parallel compression on drums, and this and that, this plug in, Ocean Way this, Briscasti that... 8) So these tracks are all me recorded here in my studio. I tracked these things, then they have been re amped through my outboard, things like WA76, WA - TEC, Drip STA, Drip LA2A, LA500s etc This is normal for me to do this... as a one man show, with limited outboard, it sort of simulates what I would do, if I had more gear at the tracking stage.. This should also function as a unity fader mix for you... with the exception of the back harmonies, which need to be pulled 6dB. I would pan like this. Kick Snare Bass Vocal Solos Center Ride and Hat half left and right (audience perspective) Nashville Acoustic Hard Left (ride side) Les Paul Tremelo Rythm Hard Right (hat side) so its a LCR mix, with the exception of Overheads (Ride and Hat) which are just around half way left and right (Pan law vagaries aside) The kick drum is an edited pattern, I had played it with the kick on 1 and 3 and wanted a few hits in there.... There are a couple of things, that need fixing "hint" a tom hit perhaps... but I want to see what people miss... evil snigger... 8) So load in the tracks, set the pans and those backing vocals faders as I said and you should hear what I hear, pan law aside. Lets hear what people come up with So we can have apples with apples.. .You are not allowed to make it louder. No louder... be good for you to have some headroom in there... you can limit, compress all you want.. but do not raise the RMS level. I also don't mind if you edit the arrangement or add or remove things.. just not louder... 8) cheers Wiz I just downloaded it. I'm going to mix it...but I'll also run a mastering chain on it and give you a mix optimized for mastering so you can A/B the two. This a way "louder" version with a DR of 11dB to 8dB will exist. I get the point of the exercise, but the mix to me has to be optimized for finalizing during mastering...there's sort of no point if you don't prep for that.
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Post by mrholmes on May 17, 2015 16:33:04 GMT -6
Justin very cool Version........ Thanks mrholmes - looking forward to listening to your mix after my son goes to bed! cool let me know what you think.... and make sure to listen to the last revision....
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Post by wiz on May 17, 2015 17:15:13 GMT -6
wiz sounds great mang, you know what you want bud 8) I went back and listened to my turd, after throwing up in my mouth a little 8) I decided to level it out, get rid of some stupid, and bring it up a bit, I was concentrating on ideas and didn't realize how off the balance was..., it still sucks, but it's better now 8) https%3A//soundcloud.com/tonycamp/wizfoolmequickmix2 tonycamphdwhats really cool about this, is the bass .. .it grooves so well... Tell us what you did to get that happening, it really improved the tune no end... cheers Wiz
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Post by wiz on May 17, 2015 17:33:32 GMT -6
Alright here we go. I took some artistic liberties here but I wanted to try a bunch of new ideas. I tried to make it modern but also try to mix like I think wiz might approve. I used 4th Time Lucky as a reference for balances. I have many thoughts about improving this but I'm always my own worst critic so I'd much rather hear what others have to say before I criticize myself. This is the most LCR mix I've done and I also used the free version of Lil' Primal Tap which is a 1st LOL! Song is great and I particularly like how you "took the bass for a walk" at the end of the tune. I may have added a couple subtle elements.....who can pick them out? https%3A//soundcloud.com/treehil/fool-me-once-5-16-15Damn.... who knew my song was THAT good!!! As an artist (the person who wrote the song)My jaw hit the desk........ Great great GREAT! version. Showed me what the song could be. I love it. Love it! As a MixerThere are some things in it that would need attention.. but the Artist just turned up and told me to shut up because he doesn't care... 8) I will have to come back and comment on the mixing, if you want... but at the moment, I am just riding the good vibes.... really great cheers Wiz
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Post by mrholmes on May 17, 2015 18:05:47 GMT -6
Wiz I always ask cats older than me .... would you arrange it diffrent.... its good to get new input..... we may get some creatve culture at RGO?
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Post by odyssey76 on May 17, 2015 18:33:43 GMT -6
Alright here we go. I took some artistic liberties here but I wanted to try a bunch of new ideas. I tried to make it modern but also try to mix like I think wiz might approve. I used 4th Time Lucky as a reference for balances. I have many thoughts about improving this but I'm always my own worst critic so I'd much rather hear what others have to say before I criticize myself. This is the most LCR mix I've done and I also used the free version of Lil' Primal Tap which is a 1st LOL! Song is great and I particularly like how you "took the bass for a walk" at the end of the tune. I may have added a couple subtle elements.....who can pick them out? https%3A//soundcloud.com/treehil/fool-me-once-5-16-15Damn.... who knew my song was THAT good!!! As an artist (the person who wrote the song)My jaw hit the desk........ Great great GREAT! version. Showed me what the song could be. I love it. Love it! As a MixerThere are some things in it that would need attention.. but the Artist just turned up and told me to shut up because he doesn't care... 8) I will have to come back and comment on the mixing, if you want... but at the moment, I am just riding the good vibes.... really great cheers Wiz wiz - thanks man, that means a lot to me coming from you. First off - the song and the tracks are already superb. When something's tracked this well it's unsettling because I feel anything I'm going to do will detract from the fidelity of your tracks. It's hard for me because I don't have the mixing experience that a lot of you guys have and I'm one of those people who struggles, with great frustration, to get the sounds out of my head that I want on tape. This is a great exercise for me for practice and even if I can't nail a mix (yet) I can still get my point across effectively. I absolutely want your mix feedback - that's why I'm here - to drain absorb all the great knowledge from you awesome dudes....... Time to listen to the other mixes!
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Post by odyssey76 on May 17, 2015 18:39:04 GMT -6
Wiz I always ask cats older than me .... would you arrange it diffrent.... its good to get new input..... we may get some creatve culture at RGO? RGO is already different. The talent is so good and I think you're on to something when you talk about creative culture here. Some great music is coming from here and it's getting better all the time. I believe we'll see some bigger things coming from this place......
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Post by carymiller on May 17, 2015 18:47:42 GMT -6
s Damn.... who knew my song was THAT good!!! As an artist (the person who wrote the song)My jaw hit the desk........ Great great GREAT! version. Showed me what the song could be. I love it. Love it! As a MixerThere are some things in it that would need attention.. but the Artist just turned up and told me to shut up because he doesn't care... 8) I will have to come back and comment on the mixing, if you want... but at the moment, I am just riding the good vibes.... really great cheers Wiz wiz - thanks man, that means a lot to me coming from you. First off - the song and the tracks are already superb. When something's tracked this well it's unsettling because I feel anything I'm going to do will detract from the fidelity of your tracks. It's hard for me because I don't have the mixing experience that a lot of you guys have and I'm one of those people who struggles, with great frustration, to get the sounds out of my head that I want on tape. This is a great exercise for me for practice and even if I can't nail a mix (yet) I can still get my point across effectively. I absolutely want your mix feedback - that's why I'm here - to drain absorb all the great knowledge from you awesome dudes....... Time to listen to the other mixes! I love the shaker in your version...I might have to track a shaker track or ask for the one you cut to round it out. I feel like the shaker needs to be there...there's things I like about most of the versions posted...but that part stands out to me...it just really makes it groove.
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Post by odyssey76 on May 17, 2015 19:13:12 GMT -6
s wiz - thanks man, that means a lot to me coming from you. First off - the song and the tracks are already superb. When something's tracked this well it's unsettling because I feel anything I'm going to do will detract from the fidelity of your tracks. It's hard for me because I don't have the mixing experience that a lot of you guys have and I'm one of those people who struggles, with great frustration, to get the sounds out of my head that I want on tape. This is a great exercise for me for practice and even if I can't nail a mix (yet) I can still get my point across effectively. I absolutely want your mix feedback - that's why I'm here - to drain absorb all the great knowledge from you awesome dudes....... Time to listen to the other mixes! I love the shaker in your version...I might have to track a shaker track or ask for the one you cut to round it out. I feel like the shaker needs to be there...there's things I like about most of the versions posted...but that part stands out to me...it just really makes it groove. Thanks carymiller! Wiz' voice has such a nice old soul groove/cool thing I thought the music had to keep up with him. I think Tony's right though - it's crowded and a little convoluted. Could have better space. I'd be happy to send you my shaker part lol! First time for everything. Also be curious how you mix it.
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Post by carymiller on May 17, 2015 19:47:20 GMT -6
sI love the shaker in your version...I might have to track a shaker track or ask for the one you cut to round it out. I feel like the shaker needs to be there...there's things I like about most of the versions posted...but that part stands out to me...it just really makes it groove. Thanks carymiller! Wiz' voice has such a nice old soul groove/cool thing I thought the music had to keep up with him. I think Tony's right though - it's crowded and a little convoluted. Could have better space. I'd be happy to send you my shaker part lol! First time for everything. Also be curious how you mix it. I messaged you with my email...I really love your shaker...and I think you were onto something with how you stripped it down to guitar only in the first verse. I love Wiz's voice on this song too...but I've got a few ideas bouncing around already. =D
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