Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2023 18:07:10 GMT -6
It's also interesting to me that the plugins I'm thinking about how best to replace are (as @tomegatherion said) the old ones. I almost feel ridiculous typing this out, but I actually still liked RVox, RAxx, Renn DeEsser, Doubler, SuperTap, and H-Delay. All of those are old plugins, and all except H-Delay were from the first Waves package I bought 20yrs ago: the Musician's 2 Bundle. Blackdawg is right about Vx Clarity Pro - that's a really really good one for post guys. I have RX and Acon, but Vx Clarity Pro was pretty special. Fortunately for me Final Cut added their own native voice isolation about a year ago that is not just surprisingly good, it is surprisingly great. I'm going to miss Sibilance, too. That was a really good DeEsser. But man, I loved the simple UI on RVox and RAxx. Those were like automatic quick and easy - and sounded good with virtually no aliasing. You can get much better results from many modern compressors, especially the kind with multiple detectors. RVox and RAxx are just soft knee, high ratio 90s-early 2000s outmoded stuff with a proper lookahead, low passed sidechain that will change the tonal balance of the material from not being triggered by the high, auto release (multiple release constants), and a downwards expander (the “gate”) in Rvox. see the maximum loudness section in the Oxford Dynamics manual and use the limiter for a faster peak attack and release on top of that. Then you can use much better modern plugins that also have dual detectors and auto releases. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2023 18:17:53 GMT -6
It's also interesting to me that the plugins I'm thinking about how best to replace are (as @tomegatherion said) the old ones. I almost feel ridiculous typing this out, but I actually still liked RVox, RAxx, Renn DeEsser, Doubler, SuperTap, and H-Delay. All of those are old plugins, and all except H-Delay were from the first Waves package I bought 20yrs ago: the Musician's 2 Bundle. Blackdawg is right about Vx Clarity Pro - that's a really really good one for post guys. I have RX and Acon, but Vx Clarity Pro was pretty special. Fortunately for me Final Cut added their own native voice isolation about a year ago that is not just surprisingly good, it is surprisingly great. I'm going to miss Sibilance, too. That was a really good DeEsser. But man, I loved the simple UI on RVox and RAxx. Those were like automatic quick and easy - and sounded good with virtually no aliasing. Re: Raxxe and RVox, same here. The extreme GR you could get from those with no aliasing, even at 0 attack (the fixed rate for RVox) is not something I’ve found elsewhere, even from much more recent software. Renaissance series is very limited in functionally by design. They have lower thd than usual from lookahead and alias less than others from their era with their heavily low passed sidechains so they tend to pump both dynamical and tonally from not being triggered by anything above 2khz. Thus in Rcomp, longer attack means more bass and longer release means less treble. You can get cleaner behavior at deeper gain reductions from modern dual detector compressors like Kotelnikov and MDWDRC2. |
|
|
|
Post by drsax on Mar 27, 2023 18:59:53 GMT -6
Waves has been dishonestly ripping off paying customers for years. WUP’ing many of us that paid thousands to “own” their plugins. I stopped using them years ago for this reason. And with this new subscription only move, it just makes me glad I stopped using their plugins altogether. There are SO many great alternatives. Greed upsets me.
|
|
|
|
Post by sam on Mar 27, 2023 19:04:11 GMT -6
Waves has been dishonestly ripping off paying customers for years. WUP’ing many of us that paid thousands to “own” their plugins. I stopped using them years ago for this reason. And with this new subscription only move, it just makes me glad I stopped using their plugins altogether. There are SO many great alternatives. Greed upsets me. Yeah but they were upfront and honest about the WUP from the get go. This is actually the first dishonest thing they’ve done |
|
|
|
Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 27, 2023 19:09:53 GMT -6
It's also interesting to me that the plugins I'm thinking about how best to replace are (as @tomegatherion said) the old ones. I almost feel ridiculous typing this out, but I actually still liked RVox, RAxx, Renn DeEsser, Doubler, SuperTap, and H-Delay. All of those are old plugins, and all except H-Delay were from the first Waves package I bought 20yrs ago: the Musician's 2 Bundle. Blackdawg is right about Vx Clarity Pro - that's a really really good one for post guys. I have RX and Acon, but Vx Clarity Pro was pretty special. Fortunately for me Final Cut added their own native voice isolation about a year ago that is not just surprisingly good, it is surprisingly great. I'm going to miss Sibilance, too. That was a really good DeEsser. But man, I loved the simple UI on RVox and RAxx. Those were like automatic quick and easy - and sounded good with virtually no aliasing. You can get much better results from many modern compressors, especially the kind with multiple detectors. RVox and RAxx are just soft knee, high ratio 90s-early 2000s outmoded stuff with a proper lookahead, low passed sidechain that will change the tonal balance of the material from not being triggered by the high, auto release (multiple release constants), and a downwards expander (the “gate”) in Rvox. see the maximum loudness section in the Oxford Dynamics manual and use the limiter for a faster peak attack and release on top of that. Then you can use much better modern plugins that also have dual detectors and auto releases. You really have a way with words. |
|
|
|
Post by drsax on Mar 27, 2023 19:14:45 GMT -6
Waves has been dishonestly ripping off paying customers for years. WUP’ing many of us that paid thousands to “own” their plugins. I stopped using them years ago for this reason. And with this new subscription only move, it just makes me glad I stopped using their plugins altogether. There are SO many great alternatives. Greed upsets me. Yeah but they were upfront and honest about the WUP from the get go. This is actually the first dishonest thing they’ve done I started with Waves plugins before WUP existed. And they were crazy expensive. They kindly transitioned my plugins to the WUP model automatically. |
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on Mar 27, 2023 19:37:03 GMT -6
(Mainly Lurking)
Can't resist...
Waves = "Canary in the coal mine"
For other Plugin companies then.
IMHO the buy to own backlash, will be much Much larger than Waves anticipated.
Chris
|
|
|
|
Post by Blackdawg on Mar 27, 2023 20:30:50 GMT -6
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2023 20:31:11 GMT -6
(Mainly Lurking) Can't resist... Waves = "Canary in the coal mine" For other Plugin companies then. IMHO the buy to own backlash, will be much Much larger than Waves anticipated. Chris They're making Waves chris, making waves.. |
|
|
|
Post by Blackdawg on Mar 27, 2023 20:32:55 GMT -6
Which RX tool are you trying? I've removed guitar noise with excellent results with RX. I started with the most basic suite, which was good at removing noise, but often took highs with it. I did got for an upgrade when I put the new system together, and I haven't dived in very far TBH. I did pull one of them up the other day and it did seem pretty effective. I believe it was GTR centric, which is where my problems tend to lie, being I only have an amp that is newer than about 20 years old, and at least one that is older than me. I've always had good success with spectral denoiser and using a custom noise profile and noise curve. Works really well. |
|
|
|
Post by christophert on Mar 27, 2023 20:45:10 GMT -6
I wave(d) them goodbye about 10 years ago. Never going back  |
|
|
|
Post by centralpark on Mar 27, 2023 22:02:43 GMT -6
There's probably going to be a bunch of third party plugins created to fill the void of the Waves ones that don't already have equivalents.
A lot of people's favorites (rVox, rComp, rBass,S1, cla76 + 10-15 more) are old and basic but people used them because they were simple, familiar, got the job done, and cheap.
There was no point previously in knocking off rComp for example, because anybody who wanted to use it could easily buy the original.
That's now gone.
I think we may see some plugins from other developers in the future with settings like "OurComp".
|
|
|
|
Post by bobeschism on Mar 28, 2023 5:00:17 GMT -6
|
|
|
|
Post by svart on Mar 28, 2023 7:50:23 GMT -6
Anyway, I decided to try out Softube Weiss limiter MM-1 in place of Waves L1.
Sounds great but the PDC is 30,000.
WTF.
|
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on Mar 28, 2023 8:14:06 GMT -6
Pure genius! Guess they thought they had a......... Monopoly on things. Chris P.S. PR? Equals "Promise Retraction". |
|
|
|
Post by teejay on Mar 28, 2023 8:43:12 GMT -6
|
|
|
|
Post by mattbroiler on Mar 28, 2023 9:22:22 GMT -6
I read this as stating that my existing plugins will continue to work (not be bricked) but no further upgrades without the sub plan Where exactly does it say my current stuff will no longer work after a certain point? I can live without them but hope that's not the case Questions about my perpetual (non-subscription) licenses What happens to the plugin or bundle licenses I purchased prior to Waves Creative Access? You continue to own them, at the latest version you bought or updated to prior to the launch of Waves Creative Access. You can continue to use your plugin/bundle licenses and software, on all systems and host applications that are compatible with the versions you own.
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Mar 28, 2023 10:07:35 GMT -6
I'm fine with what UA (and a few others) and a few others are doing, which is to offer a sub AND a perpetual option. It doesn't have to be a one or the other thing. Just offer both and let everyone pick the option that suits them. Almost everyone who offers BOTH will eventually move to subscription. Every one of my work programs had both options for a year or two and then moved to subscription. It's a better way than just switching, but they'll eventually move over. I can't believe waves won't lose market share from this...if it comes down to subscription, I would probably just afford one company and be done with it. |
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Mar 28, 2023 10:08:22 GMT -6
Meanwhile, UAD is openly elated about this and Softube is currently running an ad over at GS that reads "Invest in professional plugins that you'll own forever." All their competitors are licking their chops, and rightfully so. Wish I knew how to get people to advertise here... |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2023 10:17:14 GMT -6
Anyway, I decided to try out Softube Weiss limiter MM-1 in place of Waves L1. Sounds great but the PDC is 30,000. WTF. Lol almost a second of latency 🤯 🔫 The MM-1 is just ancient, ported 90s dsp from the DS-1. If you want some cool 90s dsp, Sonnox is owned by Focusrite now but still operating as usual. Goodhertz Faraday Limiter is fun and was designed to be L2 meets an 1176. Turn hq and experiment! It has about 500 something samples of latency. goodhertz.com/faraday-lim/theproaudiofiles.com/free-faraday-limiter-plugin-interview-with-devin-kerr/Oxford Limiter is cool. I think of it like an L1/L2 meets an SSL bus comp that doesn’t sound like crap or over compress when you hit it hard. For what I do, it’s better than both of them with about 150 samples of latency. Remember to to turn off the distorted safe mode that’s on by defaulted, start with enhance (think inflator for just transients) at zero, and the “auto comp” true peak limiter off too. Keep the “auto gain” in that’s the slower, ssl auto type secondary release on most of the time and that will make the main release the faster time constant of an “auto” release circuit. So keep “auto gain” off for L1 type behavior, on for L2. Nothing Waves hits as hard as Faraday or as fast as the Oxford. |
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Mar 28, 2023 10:19:15 GMT -6
Anyway, I decided to try out Softube Weiss limiter MM-1 in place of Waves L1. Sounds great but the PDC is 30,000. WTF. Lol almost a second of latency 🤯 🔫 The MM-1 is just ancient, ported 90s dsp from the DS-1. If you want some cool 90s dsp, Sonnox is owned by Focusrite now but still operating as usual. Goodhertz Faraday Limiter is fun and was designed to be L2 meets an 1176. Turn hq and experiment! It has about 500 something samples of latency. goodhertz.com/faraday-lim/theproaudiofiles.com/free-faraday-limiter-plugin-interview-with-devin-kerr/Oxford Limiter is cool. I think of it like an L1/L2 meets an SSL bus comp that doesn’t sound like crap or over compress when you hit it hard. For what I do, it’s better than both of them with about 150 samples of latency. Remember to to turn off the distorted safe mode that’s on by defaulted, start with enhance (think inflator for just transients) at zero, and the “auto comp” true peak limiter off too. Keep the “auto gain” in that’s the slower, ssl auto type secondary release on most of the time and that will make the main release the faster time constant of an “auto” release circuit. Nothing Waves hits as hard as Faraday or as fast as the Oxford. I probably need to back off the threshold and try that one again, but I often find it too heavy handed. |
|
|
|
Post by tkaitkai on Mar 28, 2023 10:22:11 GMT -6
I read this as stating that my existing plugins will continue to work (not be bricked) but no further upgrades without the sub plan Where exactly does it say my current stuff will no longer work after a certain point? I can live without them but hope that's not the case It just means that when you eventually make an OS that breaks compatibility with your Waves plugins, you're basically fucked unless you subscribe. Of course, that could be months or even years down the road, and it's generally a good practice to not update your OS very often (hell, I'm still hanging out on Sierra!), but it's still a slap in the face to anyone who's invested thousands in Waves plugins. There's plenty of Waves stuff I love and enjoy using, but I can't imagine having spent $7500 on Mercury only to be suddenly faced with this news. |
|
|
|
Post by bossanova on Mar 28, 2023 10:33:27 GMT -6
Someone at the purple place noted that there's the very real possibility that their never ending sales were due to come under fire from EU regulators, and without those, subscriptions might be the only other sustainable alternative.
|
|
|
|
Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 28, 2023 11:10:19 GMT -6
Literally just got email from waves while reading the thread here. 😘😂
|
|
|
|
Post by the other mark williams on Mar 28, 2023 11:12:23 GMT -6
Someone at the purple place noted that there's the very real possibility that their never ending sales were due to come under fire from EU regulators, and without those, subscriptions might be the only other sustainable alternative. What’s the EU regulation in question in this case? |
|
