ericn
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Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107 
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Post by ericn on Nov 28, 2022 11:17:09 GMT -6
I remember the Peluso 47 being highly hyped. Nobody mentions them now. I didn't really participate in forums much during the time, but I see old posts outlining the drama behind the origin of certain components or the bodies and wonder if that was the point where public opinion started to change.
I've regularly used a 2247LE or SE years back and thought it was a pretty solid mic, but I would say I doubt it sounds anything like the Heiserman.
Reminds me I should make a call and see if the studio/owner still have the Peluso.
Peluso didn’t fade, a 100 others copied their buisness model, decent cheap internals make it look pretty and cheap Chinese capsule. Now how many of those are there? |
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Post by plinker on Nov 28, 2022 11:59:22 GMT -6
Agree with Eric.
I remember, back in the day, hearing an NPR interview with Peluso about his mics. He was doing what was considered niche stuff, at the time. Yes; he was using imported metalwork, then skinning the capsules himself.
Then Telefunken USA (or whatever they called themselves) got caught charging a premium for un-modded imports -- that blew the whole thing up, IMHO, and had everyone second guessing any mics that had imported parts. In essence, Peluso got #metoo'd.
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Post by enlav on Nov 28, 2022 12:21:17 GMT -6
Then Telefunken USA (or whatever they called themselves) got caught charging a premium for un-modded imports -- that blew the whole thing up, IMHO, and had everyone second guessing any mics that had imported parts. In essence, Peluso got #metoo'd. Which, in hindsight, if people were just open with their process or practices (and not using clever language), it maybe wouldn't be such a big deal, but I'll be honest, I didn't realize how much these 2247's were going for until I just looked them up.
Peluso didn’t fade, a 100 others copied their buisness model, decent cheap internals make it look pretty and cheap Chinese capsule. Now how many of those are there? Makes sense, you could even save money having one made by SAE/cdkelly at the moment. |
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Post by notneeson on Nov 28, 2022 13:30:44 GMT -6
Passive summers.
Modded Soundcraft Ghosts.
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Post by teejay on Nov 28, 2022 13:44:08 GMT -6
C1 was my first mic, circa 2002...think I paid closer to $150+. Hung on to it for a long time. Just several years ago paid for the Mic Parts “upgrade”, which of course made it sound exactly like a U87. That’s what they told me, anyways.
Also had both the Peluso 2247SE and 22 251. My SE had an LE body because that's all he sold at the time. At that point he only differentiated by tube...mine had the “American Red” tube.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Nov 28, 2022 13:48:12 GMT -6
Jim Williams.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Nov 28, 2022 13:49:54 GMT -6
Too far ^^?
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Post by sean on Nov 28, 2022 14:00:00 GMT -6
I love Jim’s work. He has opinions that can come across as strong but I don’t think there’s any denying the improvements he can make, especially to early op-amp/transistor designs. I think people who react negatively to the idea of modifying say a DBX 160 or 1178 or LA4 have never actually heard the difference or a side by side. I think you hear less about Jim now because those pretty mediocre pieces of gear not command a much higher premium than before.
A Designs doesn’t seem to get much attention any more. I was always interested in hearing their Ventura preamp/EQ
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Post by teejay on Nov 28, 2022 15:04:36 GMT -6
Sebatron. I had an original Thorax at one point. It was probably pretty good...I just didn't know how to use it.
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Post by thehightenor on Nov 28, 2022 15:22:17 GMT -6
Noooo! No surely not! I still love and revere my Soundtoys 5 bundle, there’s some really unique plug-ins in that collection. They’re a keyboard players dream ( pretty great with guitar too) |
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Post by chessparov on Nov 28, 2022 15:31:14 GMT -6
Perfect kinda thing for a RGO "Roast" type dinner get together! That'd actually be way cool, around NAMM, at a nearby restaurant. We just have to pick a Guest of Honor. Let's do it! Gee I wonder who should MC it?. Anyone we know, with a (hopefully) warped sense of humor? Hmm... Chris |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107
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Post by ericn on Nov 28, 2022 17:26:43 GMT -6
Perfect kinda thing for a RGO "Roast" type dinner get together! That'd actually be way cool, around NAMM, at a nearby restaurant. We just have to pick a Guest of Honor. Let's do it! Gee I wonder who should MC it?. Anyone we know, with a (hopefully) warped sense of humor? Hmm... Chris Hey Chris we pretty much in private agree we will all vote for you if you cover our bar bill, It might be cheaper to buy JK a M49v pair. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2022 20:47:01 GMT -6
I love Jim’s work. He has opinions that can come across as strong but I don’t think there’s any denying the improvements he can make, especially to early op-amp/transistor designs. I think people who react negatively to the idea of modifying say a DBX 160 or 1178 or LA4 have never actually heard the difference or a side by side. I think you hear less about Jim now because those pretty mediocre pieces of gear not command a much higher premium than before. A Designs doesn’t seem to get much attention any more. I was always interested in hearing their Ventura preamp/EQ Jim can clean things up to not crap all over your sound. He can go overkill and remove all box tone, inaudible roll off, and minute distortion but he's right there's a lot of eating shit and liking it in the audio world. This is very apparent when you hear what many common processors do to raw tracks or versus clean substitutions. Musicians are often all too aware of this with regards to "production" too and often seek to eliminate it especially when they spent a lot of time and money getting it recorded how they sound or want to sound. I've had really nice snares have a dump taken all over them by the tracking engineer shovking an 1176 on the way in on stuff done on days and wasted hours compensating for the limiting, pumping, and distortion and getting the drum in the mix to sound like what the drummer insisted his performance was. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2022 21:51:29 GMT -6
There are risks and it’s a different “feet on the ground” kinda search. I know people who still get tons of good stuff cheap because the hit the road and pay cash. There’s a learning curve for sure. There’s a lot of untested that’s really been sitting unpowered for 40+ years, factor the cost of a cap job and cleaning. 90% of the time it’s fine. Altec 436’s are still half the price of a Chandler, and they’re the (convertible/restorable) real thing. Full RS124 repro’s made from 436’s (by someone we know here - not me) are competitive with the Chandler clone. One example. I get it. I still think the majority of good vintage stuff is still overpriced. 20 years ago it was just "old stuff" in someone's closet and some of the old-timers at the local Hamfest might be internet-ignorant enough to sell it for cheap, but the vast majority of folks hocking "old stuff" use the internet to find out how to profit every red cent from it. Relabel it "vintage" and use hyperbolic language in the description and folks with a little bit of internet searching will be bidding it up to sky-high levels in a matter of minutes. There's precious few "deals" to be had these days now that you can search everywhere and even see pricing trends over years on auction sites that allow you to list for free until it sells removing any incentive to price it realistically. There's still good deals for things with more than two knobs that idiots can't set or without a lot of distortion so they can't use it "for sound design" |
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Post by craigmorris74 on Nov 28, 2022 22:15:10 GMT -6
I get it. I still think the majority of good vintage stuff is still overpriced. 20 years ago it was just "old stuff" in someone's closet and some of the old-timers at the local Hamfest might be internet-ignorant enough to sell it for cheap, but the vast majority of folks hocking "old stuff" use the internet to find out how to profit every red cent from it. Relabel it "vintage" and use hyperbolic language in the description and folks with a little bit of internet searching will be bidding it up to sky-high levels in a matter of minutes. There's precious few "deals" to be had these days now that you can search everywhere and even see pricing trends over years on auction sites that allow you to list for free until it sells removing any incentive to price it realistically. There's still good deals for things with more than two knobs that idiots can't set or without a lot of distortion so they can't use it "for sound design" I sort of agree with the sentiment, but at the same time, when I want a screwdriver, I don’t use my Leatherman unless it’s the only thing I have on hand. |
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Post by drumsound on Nov 29, 2022 2:41:05 GMT -6
Y'all might be too young to remember, but URS plugins. What a joke. I remember people talking about those a lot, but I was still no where near the plugin world sans for (probably terrible) mastering. "These u47 clones sound just like the real thing, except they have a different tube, and transformer, and capsule, and PSU, and build quality, and... sound." I remember the Peluso 47 being highly hyped. Nobody mentions them now. Maybe people realized his capsules are terrible and he's a crook. Repeat after me; we as an industry are slaves to fashion and hype. The U47 is our little black dress, the classics seldom fail. In my days as a gear pimp there were always these weird cycles, Drawmer 1969’s were hot for a couple of weeks then they weren’t for 8 months, then it would be Tube Tech. Some gear, and now plugins ride a wave then disappear, some does something different that wows at first but over time just doesn’t cut it. That Drawmer 1968/1969 was hyped up to no end by Fletcher and yes it sounds big and cool but it only really has that one sound. The old, still made Drawmer live sound vca compressors do more. The 1978 does a ton but flies under the radar. I've used the shit out of my '69 over the years. Every mix I did until I bought my RND 5424 had it on the mix bus, and I still often patch it in if I need to send out a quick ruff mix. Also good on bass, and vocals. I'd have bought a '68 if it was available at the time. I don't use the pres or the DI, but still think the compressor is great. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2022 2:44:26 GMT -6
Y'all might be too young to remember, but URS plugins. What a joke. I remember people talking about those a lot, but I was still no where near the plugin world sans for (probably terrible) mastering. I remember the Peluso 47 being highly hyped. Nobody mentions them now. Maybe people realized his capsules are terrible and he's a crook. That Drawmer 1968/1969 was hyped up to no end by Fletcher and yes it sounds big and cool but it only really has that one sound. The old, still made Drawmer live sound vca compressors do more. The 1978 does a ton but flies under the radar. I've used the shit out of my '69 over the years. Every mix I did until I bought my RND 5424 had it on the mix bus, and I still often patch it in if I need to send out a quick ruff mix. Also good on bass, and vocals. I'd have bought a '68 if it was available at the time. I don't use the pres or the DI, but still think the compressor is great. Yeah the Drawmer sounds great. It just has that fat sound from the makeup gain. |
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Post by drumsound on Nov 29, 2022 2:45:31 GMT -6
I remember people talking about those a lot, but I was still no where near the plugin world sans for (probably terrible) mastering. Maybe people realized his capsules are terrible and he's a crook. I've used the shit out of my '69 over the years. Every mix I did until I bought my RND 5424 had it on the mix bus, and I still often patch it in if I need to send out a quick ruff mix. Also good on bass, and vocals. I'd have bought a '68 if it was available at the time. I don't use the pres or the DI, but still think the compressor is great. Yeah the Drawmer sounds great. It just has that fat sound from the makeup gain. I think that's a big part of how it helps mixes translate outside of the controlled environment of the studio. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2022 2:51:57 GMT -6
Yeah the Drawmer sounds great. It just has that fat sound from the makeup gain. I think that's a big part of how it helps mixes translate outside of the controlled environment of the studio. Agreed. It does what you need about three good plugins to do typically: a great smooth compressor, something to fatten up the bass, and a high shelf or exciter to compensate for the high frequency compression. |
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Post by Ward on Nov 29, 2022 8:34:11 GMT -6
Maybe people realized his capsules are terrible and he's a crook. Come on, man . . . that's awful harsh. |
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Post by Ward on Nov 29, 2022 8:35:28 GMT -6
Yeah the Drawmer sounds great. It just has that fat sound from the makeup gain. It'll be a cold day in hell when someone pries my Drawmer 1960 out of steely grip. Drawmer used to get the recognition it deserves. |
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Post by drumsound on Nov 29, 2022 8:45:14 GMT -6
Maybe people realized his capsules are terrible and he's a crook. Come on, man . . . that's awful harsh. Just like his capsules if you have a singer that gets above a mezzo forte. Before he was in the mic biz, repairs were his game and I know of a few people he NEVER repaired of RETURNED gear to. Yeah the Drawmer sounds great. It just has that fat sound from the makeup gain. It'll be a cold day in hell when someone pries my Drawmer 1960 out of steely grip. Drawmer used to get the recognition it deserves. agreed |
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Post by bchurch on Nov 29, 2022 10:25:25 GMT -6
Yeah the Drawmer sounds great. It just has that fat sound from the makeup gain. It'll be a cold day in hell when someone pries my Drawmer 1960 out of steely grip. Drawmer used to get the recognition it deserves. Drawmer has a lot of GREAT kit. The 1961 Tube EQ is not for everything, but where it works - it really works. Their newer 197x series is all a good intersection of price/performance. Ugliest design language I've seen on an outboard anything ever. Pug-fugly. Like Stryper designed it with MacPaint and only the system fonts. |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107
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Post by ericn on Nov 29, 2022 10:33:13 GMT -6
Come on, man . . . that's awful harsh. Just like his capsules if you have a singer that gets above a mezzo forte. Before he was in the mic biz, repairs were his game and I know of a few people he NEVER repaired of RETURNED gear to. It'll be a cold day in hell when someone pries my Drawmer 1960 out of steely grip. Drawmer used to get the recognition it deserves. agreed So you’re saying he was a highly regarded mic tech🤪. I mean thinking back what independent mic tech other than Klaus didn’t have that rep? |
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Post by drumsound on Nov 29, 2022 11:27:47 GMT -6
Just like his capsules if you have a singer that gets above a mezzo forte. Before he was in the mic biz, repairs were his game and I know of a few people he NEVER repaired of RETURNED gear to. agreed So you’re saying he was a highly regarded mic tech🤪. I mean thinking back what independent mic tech other than Klaus didn’t have that rep? Not just mics. I know he has had pieces belonging to friends of mine for over a decade. They figure a law suit would be the only way to deal with it, but don't have the time or effort to launch it. |
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