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Post by aremos on May 19, 2020 11:55:20 GMT -6
Still tracking on Pro Tools 10 HD3 Accel (10.3.10 on OS 10.9.5) ... & "trying", now, to mix, same computer (cheese grater) - different drive, on PT Ultimate (2019.6 on Sierra).
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2020 12:34:30 GMT -6
The other issue is code bloat and revolving teams of ever worse programmers working on plugins that try to jam in more and more features and truly sound no better and often worse than what was popular 5-10 years ago. There’s no reason anything can’t be as efficient as Reaper and Logic. There’s no reason for things to be much more cpu hungry than Tokyo Dawn Labs, Cytomic, Overloud. These neural network amp sims and crazy impulse responses still sound fake as shit without a ton of blending, reverb, and distortion. Getting them to sound realistic takes more man hours than micing up an amp. Paying for many of them costs more than studio time. The same with Brainworx crazy channel strips yet the dynamics sections still suck. Yet I know people who buy every hyped up new plugin and amp sim and they could have just bought hardware or upgraded their monitoring and done better work with free plugins, that often sound better than what they just paid for. Hello Slick EQ.
Final Cut was well on the way to being the standard and had a huge market share until X iirc. X set it back. Now it is just one of many. Apple could have take the professional market’s money but they didn’t. Just like they chucked good computer design to the wind after Jobs got ill. The white plastic MacBook after they fixed the plastic cracking issue was laid out awesomely like an old Thinkpad back when they were made by IBM. Many of the MacBook Pros contemporary to it were actually worse computers and defective by design. The design just got worse and worse. The touchbar is cute but impedes functionality.
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Post by bradd on May 19, 2020 13:58:25 GMT -6
I'm on a 2013 Mac Book Pro that still runs great and I have no plans to update anytime soon. I haven't installed the latest version of Logic or whatever Apple's latest OS is called, but I haven't found Apple's updates to be a problem for the last seven years. I think it's like anything software related. If you stay one OS/DAW version behind the latest, you don't run into problems. I should be able to get at least ten years out of this system and that's the best I will have ever done in terms of longevity. Oh my friend you are are a dreamer, you do realize that a 2011 MBP i7 like mine (3 generations before yours) is no longer supported for OS upgrades! Now what makes this lots of fun is you think, Oh I can still use the thing for email and other basic tasks! Maybe but I can’t log into my bank or the kids school and even iCloud can be funky because I’m using a no longer supported browser. Worse news they don’t cut off one generation at a time, sometimes 2 or 3. I just don't see this being any different on a Logic/Apple set up than any other. On my last system (Samplitude on an ADK built PC), I ran into the same issue, but it was about six years in. I don't see any reason why I can't ride Logic 10.4 for 2-3 more years. The problem that people run into is the constant need to upgrade. Once you get a stable system that does what you need to it to do, don't upgrade unless the upgrade provides a tangible benefit. I still recall going to Blackbird a few years ago and they were running PT 6 when PT 9 was the latest.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 19, 2020 14:25:19 GMT -6
The other issue is code bloat and revolving teams of ever worse programmers working on plugins that try to jam in more and more features and truly sound no better and often worse than what was popular 5-10 years ago. There’s no reason anything can’t be as efficient as Reaper and Logic. There’s no reason for things to be much more cpu hungry than Tokyo Dawn Labs, Cytomic, Overloud. These neural network amp sims and crazy impulse responses still sound fake as shit without a ton of blending, reverb, and distortion. Getting them to sound realistic takes more man hours than micing up an amp. Paying for many of them costs more than studio time. The same with Brainworx crazy channel strips yet the dynamics sections still suck. Yet I know people who buy every hyped up new plugin and amp sim and they could have just bought hardware or upgraded their monitoring and done better work with free plugins, that often sound better than what they just paid for. Hello Slick EQ. Final Cut was well on the way to being the standard and had a huge market share until X iirc. X set it back. Now it is just one of many. Apple could have take the professional market’s money but they didn’t. Just like they chucked good computer design to the wind after Jobs got ill. The white plastic MacBook after they fixed the plastic cracking issue was laid out awesomely like an old Thinkpad back when they were made by IBM. Many of the MacBook Pros contemporary to it were actually worse computers and defective by design. The design just got worse and worse. The touchbar is cute but impedes functionality. Final cut was only on it’s way to be the low end standard, AVID has and still is the standard for Local Broadcasters, Post and Film. At its peak I always had to laugh when an Apple guy would talk about how such and such major release that was shot on film was done entirely on FCP, really? It was always transferred on an AVID!
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Post by Bob Olhsson on May 19, 2020 14:33:18 GMT -6
Final Cut was actually beginning to be adopted by broadcasters because most of their employees already used it at home. Avid required very expensive hardware while Final Cut ran native and was much more solid than Premier before Apple pooped in the pond with X and OS compatibility.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 19, 2020 15:07:54 GMT -6
Final Cut was actually beginning to be adopted by broadcasters because most of their employees already used it at home. Avid required very expensive hardware while Final Cut ran native and was much more solid than Premier before Apple pooped in the pond with X and OS compatibility. Bob That may have been true by you, but none of my old clients would touch it except for guys in the trucks doing quick edits. Unlike audio guys video guys stations in particular always want turnkey and support, something Apple couldn’t deliver. AVID still means they have a phone number of somebody who will answer at 5 AM, they like that. Even the station who bought into things like the Cube or that Horrible Panasonic Postbox all ended up on AVID. Most think learning AVID is part of the job. In fact about a month ago I had an email from the kid’s teacher who had just got a job at a station in SD asking me what was a good resource to learn AVID after a year of us fighting over the fact she wanted to teach Premier or FCP and me fighting for the cheap native AVID app ( AVID also has a nice ED program).
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Post by the other mark williams on May 19, 2020 15:41:35 GMT -6
Final Cut was actually beginning to be adopted by broadcasters because most of their employees already used it at home. Avid required very expensive hardware while Final Cut ran native and was much more solid than Premier before Apple pooped in the pond with X and OS compatibility. Absolutely. The transition from from FCP7 --> FCPX is probably the single biggest software mistake Apple has made in the past 10 years. Well, I suppose Apple Maps would put up a respectable fight for that ignominious title. If the FCPX debacle isn't currently being studied in MBA programs, it ought to be. It is without question what allowed the rise of Premier. Having said that, FCPX is--after many years--beginning to garner respect and a larger user base. Three trends I've noticed over the past year that I think are leading to an increase in FCPX use: - There are currently more Premier users than I've ever seen who are growing weary of Adobe's subscription model. (At the same time, Adobe is seeing record profits, so I don't expect them to change their business model.)
- The growing ubiquity of video, and hence more new video editors/creators than ever before.
- The greater and greater need for speedier and speedier turnaround. If you film an event but don't have something posted within 24hrs (or sometimes even 4hrs), you've missed the boat. FCPX is a fast NLE in which to cut.
Due to point #1 above, Davinci Resolve is also seeing a requisite growth in users (especially with it being cross-platform). Due to point #3 above, Resolve introduced its Cut Page last year, which borrows from the FCPX paradigm of sifting through footage and cutting it together quickly. I'd like to learn Resolve this year if I can find the time. Anyway, interesting stuff. So many changes. And the pace of change is sometimes unsettling for me personally.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on May 19, 2020 16:04:27 GMT -6
I don't want to name names but I understand from a knowledgeable source that one of the networks was just about to switch to both Mac and final cut when Apple completely blew it.
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Post by prene1 on May 19, 2020 20:32:24 GMT -6
I will be staying PT HDX here for the foreseeable future. The aggravation and lost time in changing things up far outweighs the aggravation of AVID. You gotta pick your battles, and a new DAW that's native (almost certainly) will not be a good battle for me. I follow you on IG sir. Your setup has all those 96 I/O and you've invested into to HD(X) system. After HD ..... I said enough. I went all UA X series. I had to get ultimate to work with my D-Command and D-Control. Still stuck with 32 I/O, and that's a HUGE reason I have to leave. I'm going your route with analog and I need all my ins and outs readily available.
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Post by drbill on May 19, 2020 23:21:16 GMT -6
I will be staying PT HDX here for the foreseeable future. The aggravation and lost time in changing things up far outweighs the aggravation of AVID. You gotta pick your battles, and a new DAW that's native (almost certainly) will not be a good battle for me. I follow you on IG sir. Your setup has all those 96 I/O and you've invested into to HD(X) system. After HD ..... I said enough. I went all UA X series. I had to get ultimate to work with my D-Command and D-Control. Still stuck with 32 I/O, and that's a HUGE reason I have to leave. I'm going your route with analog and I need all my ins and outs readily available. Cool! Good luck!
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Post by soundintheround on May 20, 2020 8:43:00 GMT -6
If you looking for a DAW in 2020, I would say you should have UA LUNA on your shortlist. I haven't tried it yet but I think that will be a big DAW going forward.
Just like any recording setup, you may need to purchase a computer that the DAW manufacture recommends Apple/PC, number of cores, OS etc.
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Post by Omicron9 on May 20, 2020 9:04:36 GMT -6
Please, this is not to start an OS war; it's just one person's opinion/preferences/whatever. I've been on Windows for over 20 years. Two years ago, I tried switching to Mac only to use Logic. I was/am still happy with Windows. Using the Mac was beyond maddening for me. I gave it a year, then I'd had enough. Mostly because of the OS, but Apple's business practices are now borderline criminal IMO. If you've not used Windows 10, I'd recommend you do before declaring that you don't like Windows. I've been using it on three machines since it was released and never had a single crash or hang. Far more stable than Mac OS (again, in my experience only). And far far FAR more usable and user-friendly than Mac OS. Again..... just one person's opinion; not presented as fact. Just posting this as a suggestion to try Windows 10. Kind regards, -09 Wait a second. . . . did you want to start an OS war or didn't want to start an OS war? Cos your post says let's not, and then you dive right in. It's like throwing a live grenade into a crowd of people and blaming the grenade for folks getting hurt. Doesn't make sense. That's why I used phrases like "just my opinion," "only in my experience," and so on three times in my post. I was attempting to bring another opinion (because that's all it is in my case; it's not a fact or meant to be) to the discussion. Is this forum not about sharing opinions and experiences? I had hoped that hearing from another viewpoint might be helpful to someone in a similar situation. Maybe not. My apologies if it seemed anything other than just sharing an opinion. Regards, -09
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Post by Guitar on May 20, 2020 9:26:55 GMT -6
This thread makes me want to go fishing. Just opened this big ole' can of worms.
Kidding! RGO is very mature for the most part.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 20, 2020 9:58:28 GMT -6
This thread makes me want to go fishing. Just opened this big ole' can of worms. Kidding! RGO is very mature for the most part. The thing is none of the DAW’s mentioned are going to keep you from making a decent record, neither is your choice of OS. Hell Garage band is almost as useful as PT 3 was!
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Post by the other mark williams on May 20, 2020 10:17:55 GMT -6
This thread makes me want to go fishing. Just opened this big ole' can of worms. Kidding! RGO is very mature for the most part. The thing is none of the DAW’s mentioned are going to keep you from making a decent record, neither is your choice of OS. Hell Garage band is almost as useful as PT 3 was! I’ve never liked GarageBand much (though I suppose I’ve not given it much of a chance), but if St. Vincent can make albums with it, then holy smokes, it’s capable enough.
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Post by Guitar on May 20, 2020 10:57:44 GMT -6
Yep, Fiona Apple's new record was Garage Band as well as a lot of Grimes early stuff. Can't argue with the results.
You could make a record in Audacity. What the hell. Why not. Just that live to tape thing with overdubs and minimal editing, no gridding.
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Post by notneeson on May 20, 2020 10:58:31 GMT -6
Changing DAW is a huge chore in my book, I sympathize with the OP.
I have Reason, Audacity, and Audition and dabbling in them only reaffirms how quick and comfortable I am on PTHD. Free time is probably my scarcest commodity, even now.
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Post by Guitar on May 20, 2020 11:05:17 GMT -6
Almost 20 years later I am STILL learning Cubase and getting faster with it. And every year, there are new features. I agree with sticking with what you know as long as is feasible.
I tried to record with Fruity Loops once, I couldn't even figure out how to arm a track. It was embarrassing. But no one was around. It's a beginner-friendly DAW.
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Post by chessparov on May 20, 2020 13:35:17 GMT -6
This thread makes me want to go fishing. Just opened this big ole' can of worms. Kidding! RGO is very mature for the most part. Perfect line for me to make an entrance! When you're in the mood to make a "simple demo", you may like Bremmer's Multitrack Studio. There's a Lite version, where you can try it out. For my "practice recordings", I just use Multitrack Studio usually first-then edit in Audacity. It has very nice stock effects. Not saying they're "UA level", but they'll give an idea of the song/performance. For those that really want to stay el cheapo, you could start in Audacity, then "Master" the stereo mix in MultitrackStudio Lite. VERY easy to use. Even I can use it! The poster child, for anyone can become a Chess Master! Much of this thread is "above my head", but I did "highlight read" it, and appreciate everyone's contributions. Chris P.S. IMHO MultitrackStudio is a nice suggestion, to give your musician friends "getting into" recording. They have one version, for only about $60. Reaper is great, but it's more like building your Muscle Car, in the garage.
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Post by aremos on May 20, 2020 14:18:07 GMT -6
Changing DAW is a huge chore in my book, I sympathize with the OP. I have Reason, Audacity, and Audition and dabbling in them only reaffirms how quick and comfortable I am on PTHD. Free time is probably my scarcest commodity, even now. What's the Reason for the Audacity to Audition something else? There's no Logic to it.
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Post by notneeson on May 20, 2020 14:21:59 GMT -6
Changing DAW is a huge chore in my book, I sympathize with the OP. I have Reason, Audacity, and Audition and dabbling in them only reaffirms how quick and comfortable I am on PTHD. Free time is probably my scarcest commodity, even now. What's the Reason for the Audacity to Audition something else? Ha! In case you're really asking: Reason has been my sampler/soft synth platform for a long time and I enjoy it for that. Audacity is free and handy once in a while (batch mp3 export on audio book editing gigs for example) and finally, I got a day job almost 2 years ago in creative services/production/branding and have an Adobe sub through work.
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Post by the other mark williams on May 20, 2020 14:53:07 GMT -6
Changing DAW is a huge chore in my book, I sympathize with the OP. I have Reason, Audacity, and Audition and dabbling in them only reaffirms how quick and comfortable I am on PTHD. Free time is probably my scarcest commodity, even now. What's the Reason for the Audacity to Audition something else? There's no Logic to it. And what’s YOUR Cubasis for Digital Performing...nah, never mind. Not working...
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Post by aremos on May 20, 2020 15:00:09 GMT -6
It's based on the Vision i had that PT is a CakeWalk in the park
On a side note, I didn't know Cakewalk still existed. Remember when we were on Vision & friends on Windows used the Cakewalk thing.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 20, 2020 15:05:15 GMT -6
What's the Reason for the Audacity to Audition something else? There's no Logic to it. And what’s YOUR Cubasis for Digital Performing...nah, never mind. Not working... Well in my case the answer is Logic-al, I’m not a fruity loop, I may Need at least a Session One or two. I don’t fear the Reaper, even if it is indeed on my RADAR. I’m just a Pro Tool who likes to record Garage bands!
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Post by the other mark williams on May 20, 2020 15:11:00 GMT -6
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