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Post by mulmany on Mar 30, 2019 7:52:50 GMT -6
My TG is arriving today. Excited to see what it can do.
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Post by spock on Mar 30, 2019 7:55:49 GMT -6
I got to try out the mic on my voice after getting home from work and it's quite impressive! I have a baritone voice that can go from deep to nasal to spacey very quickly, (people usually say it sounds something like Jim Morrison or Paul Banks with excursions into not quite as nasal as Smashing Pumpkins and dreamy like Slowdive or maybe a bit of softer Blue Oyster Cult territory). My voice also tends to include some interesting overtones when I sing a certain way, and those can be a challenge to capture. I've had trouble finding a mic that really works well with my voice and can capture the low voice parts well while also not sounding nasal or too sibilant and, at the same time, working well for my more shogaze/spacey voices and overtone content. I have, believe it or not, settled on a Rode NT1 as the most complimentary option for quite a while because it is basically fairly neutral (not like the NT1A, btw). However, the NT1 does seem a bit cold and can also be a little nasal (though it does the dreamy thing well). I also usually end up using a ton of pop filtering and a windscreen with it to get to be less bright. As you might have gathered, I am excited because the TG mic works very well for all of that and, of course, sounds much nicer than the NT1. So far I do like both program A and B, but think B would usually work better for my voice (Ragan's too, I think). It seems to me that it has a pretty neutral quality as well on the flat setting in program B, but it also manages to have a nice and very flattering character of its own. It doesn't get harsh when I sing more nasal, can be detailed enough yet still warm for the dreamy sounds, and handles the baritone low end very well. It also still feels like it's a faithful representation of how I actually sound (or at least how I sound in my head!). I don't think program A would work as well for some of my singing styles, but I do think it works pretty well for the dreamy or fear the reaper-esque styles I mentioned. I do think that mode can get sibilant, though, for me, so I do have to be more careful and will also try a windscreen at some point to see what that does. I do find that a lot of the settings really do not match my voice well, but that is totally fine because they are likely good for other sources. For me, the settings that sound really nice are in the cardioid pattern: System B Flat, no HPF System B Position 1 (all the way left) no HPF System B Position 1, 50hz HPF System A Position 1, no HPF System A Flat (situational) I was running all of these through a REDD.47 > Hairball 1176 > RS124 > Dangerous AD+ with transformer disengaged. Sometimes I also left out the 1176 and I also tried with just the REDD.47. All combos sounded good but with varying degrees of dynamic control/output level of course. I will be trying my Sowter Stam 1073MPA soon as well. I think that is likely to also be a nice and flattering combination. So, onto things we've talked about that some people haven't loved. 1. The Red Light: I actually really like this feature. It's not that bright, so you don't notice it much at all when you have another light on. However, it's actually extremely useful when you are in dim light (as I often am, because it seems to help me get into the music more deeply). With the light on in dim light you can see exactly where the capsule is, and I think that's quite a nice feature. It helps with positioning and/or singing technique. Does it look cool aesthetically? In the dark, I think so. In the light? Neutral opinion. 2. The Shock Mount: It is a little tricky to get the mic in there and the location of the latches is not ideal for facilitating that either. However...not sure there's actually a better place for the latches, and I do much prefer it to one of those horrendous cage of rubber bands designs that make me nervous. I may just use a Rycote, however, as I tend to prefer those over most any other shockmount. 3. Fiddly Switches: Well, yes. I did spend a lot of time fiddling with switches out of the box. However, I was able to easily determine which settings were a definite "nope" for my voice and which ones will be useful. I can foresee having to practice a bit more to determine exactly when to use each setting that I do like, but that's music for you. It's a lot better than having only one option, in my opinion. One thing that initially confused me is that you need to use the small provided screwdriver to switch in the pad or the omni setting. I see, though, this is necessary to get the mic into most shock mounts. Not a big deal. I will likely be in cardioid most of the time. However, I did enjoy the discovery that I can move my hand behind the mic in omni mode to varying distances and create a pretty great flanging/ADT effect. I'll definitely be using that trick. Well, that was longwinded. Anyway, I am quite pleased so far and looking forward to trying it on guitars and drums. shoe the REDD.47 combo with the TG Mic is magic, It’ll be interesting what you find with your 1073; the Abbey Road drums vs vintage U47 was through 1081s. Beyond the 20+ sounds from the mic and then adding preamp type to the equation you’ve got so much latitude to find something the suits a source, or more then one viable setting as you’ve found. It’s interesting that you gravitated to System B & setting 1 for your voice. System B is what we call more pristine or cleaned up from A. For my wife’s voice, it’s System A, setting 4 or 3 into REDD.47 and RS124. As much as she loves the REDD mic, she’s crazy for the TG, because what she was hearing in the cans-in her words- “inspires me to sing”. Fwiw she’s Laura Nero meets Joni, and here voice is uber clean/clear. System B setting 2 for an Adam Levine type voice over a dense Maroon 5 type track hands down. System A settings 5 (low cut 90,) 4, or System B (low cut 50) are all excellent on acoustic guitar. Drums, System B, PAD, settings 4 or 5. Bass cab System B, PAD, settings 5, 4 or 1. There’s room to roam with this microphone.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Mar 30, 2019 8:06:33 GMT -6
That was really interesting Ragan, thanks for doing this. It's funny, I just got the Stam SA67 and wasn't used to the character it has, then when I heard the MK67 on your tracks, I recognized similar qualities. The vocal gets compressed into a smaller space, but becomes very listenable somehow. Just listening to the TG using B, I think it's a fuller warmer sound, but in the track, the 67 seems to work.
The TG does proves its mettle here though, so it's more about compatibility I guess. When you get some time, maybe try spock's other setting suggestions, just in case.. My SA67 really likes female voices, go figure. I haven't had a lot of time with it yet.
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Post by ragan on Mar 30, 2019 8:30:19 GMT -6
That was really interesting Ragan, thanks for doing this. It's funny, I just got the Stam SA67 and wasn't used to the character it has, then when I heard the MK67 on your tracks, I recognized similar qualities. The vocal gets compressed into a smaller space, but becomes very listenable somehow. Just listening to the TG using B, I think it's a fuller warmer sound, but in the track, the 67 seems to work. The TG does proves its mettle here though, so it's more about compatibility I guess. When you get some time, maybe try spock's other setting suggestions, just in case.. My SA67 really likes female voices, go figure. I haven't had a lot of time with it yet. We must have drastically different listening environments, Martin. I can’t imagine either of the TG clips coming across as fuller or warmer than the MK67. Subjective stuff I suppose but the TG always sounds more strident and more scooped to me. I really liked the electric guitar and drum clips we’ve heard of the TG but that wasn’t going to be my primary use for it. For my part, I just can’t seem to make friends with the TG’s top end, no matter what setting I have it on. And not just on my voice, on acoustic guitar as well. I would always be fighting it. I have no doubt it will be a great fit for folks that want a bright sound, maybe the same people who really dig the REDD mic. Thus far for me though it’s not a love match.
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Post by sirthought on Mar 30, 2019 8:34:34 GMT -6
I liked the MK67 on Ragan's voice, but I can also hear that compression Martin suggests. I think a lot of vintage-leaning mics will have that, so it's certainly not a problem, but just different. The TG just sounds bigger naturally, so any other processing - the preamp, the compressor, etc - has to be considered somewhat. That's a bit of a curveball to learn how to adapt for the one mic, but I think the TG just kind of explodes in a way.
The B system sounded better this time too, but I wouldn't give up on A. I might suggest trying A with either 1 or 4 and one of the HPF. I think 4 has more of that natural roll off on the highs like your 67 has. You might also experiment with standing a bit further back from the mic.
When we've tried it so far, vocalists were minimum 18 inches away and sometime three feet. No harshness or sibilance that I could notice.
Comparisons aside, I thought the vocal take on the TG was certainly very good.
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Post by chessparov on Mar 30, 2019 9:33:43 GMT -6
Yes, on more singing distance from the TG. For best results, I need to be at least a foot away from my Soundelux U195-when it's in "flat setting". Chris
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 30, 2019 12:17:09 GMT -6
Haven’t gotten a chance to listen to the clips yet, but as you can hear from my vocal clips, I didn’t really find it strident on my voice at all. In fact, my only concern was maybe there wasn’t enough mids compared to the Upton. But we all have different mics that fit us better. Who knows, maybe I’ll get it and find the same thing with the new one. It’s absolutely ok to have different opinions - otherwise everyone would think we are all just shills. Lol Isn’t the prevailing thought on the MK67 that it’s really dark? Which is good on your voice, Ragan
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Post by ragan on Mar 30, 2019 12:26:43 GMT -6
Haven’t gotten a chance to listen to the clips yet, but as you can hear from my vocal clips, I didn’t really find it strident on my voice at all. In fact, my only concern was maybe there wasn’t enough mids compared to the Upton. But we all have different mics that fit us better. Who knows, maybe I’ll get it and find the same thing with the new one. It’s absolutely ok to have different opinions - otherwise everyone would think we are all just shills. Lol Isn’t the prevailing thought on the MK67 that it’s really dark? Which is good on your voice, Ragan Yeah for sure. From listening to a lot of comparisons of the MK67 with original U67s and now a couple with the reissue, the MK67 is a dB or two lower above 10-12k. That's a guess based on averages though. Some original U67s are as mellow or mellower than the MK67, or at least according to some folks who have both. Either way, yeah, its mellow top suits my voice well. And as for the TG, it's not mids I'm concerned about, it's the 10k-ish range. There's just a lot of it. Somewhat similar to the very bright/airy (pick whichever descriptor you like) REDD mic (based on clips and user feedback...I haven't used the REDD mic). Maybe that's just the sonic profile Wade steers towards in general. Which a lot of people like, especially in pop music (a la the similarly voiced Sony C800). And yeah, John, on your clips, the TG didn't really sound strident at all. Maybe not quite as smooth as the Shannupton but not problematic at all. The male vocal in the VK video has a hardness to the top that I never dug but I was hoping that was one of the TG's EQ boosts. I'm still gonna play with the TG more before making a decision on keeping it or not. It's a unique mic that deserves a good bit of experimentation.
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miklo
Junior Member
Posts: 52
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Post by miklo on Mar 30, 2019 12:38:31 GMT -6
On your clips, I much preferred the TG mic. I'll admit I love the sound of modern processed vocals that you hear on the radio as well.
I have both a c800g and the new TG mic(just got it in) I'm in the process of moving into a new studio room.
As soon as the move is complete I'll post comparison clips of the two.
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Post by drbill on Mar 30, 2019 13:02:06 GMT -6
I'd agree with you on that Ragan. And ditto Chad's comments. This same quality is what I've heard on the TG on some of the other clips posted. The TG is a decidedly modern sound no doubt. The 67 - a good fit for you. With a little Pultec HF EQ curve, you'd get the best of both worlds - that killer vintage compression vibe with all the dimension and character - AND a brighter tone. THAT's the sweet spot everyone is looking for. Listening on Grace m905 and JBL 708P's...
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Post by mulmany on Mar 30, 2019 13:08:40 GMT -6
What's the smell of the mic box? I can't put my finger on it!
Looking to have my wife do a vocal test with it tonight. Then will be working with a folk'y S.S. next.
I have not figured out what I think of the light just yet... It's also much lighter then I would think for a mic of this size.
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Post by ragan on Mar 30, 2019 13:16:13 GMT -6
What's the smell of the mic box? I can't put my finger on it! Looking to have my wife do a vocal test with it tonight. Then will be working with a folk'y S.S. next. I have not figured out what I think of the light just yet... It's also much lighter then I would think for a mic of this size. It’s almost like aromatic cedar but like with some Pine Sol and general intensity added.
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Post by Guitar on Mar 30, 2019 13:50:30 GMT -6
Hey Ragan I thought some of those TG mic clips were too sibilant sounding, which is not a good trait for an untreated vocal mic. When you do a mix and carve and boost the vocal, sure, you're going to probably end up needing a de-esser but needing one with a flat mic is a bad sign in my opinion.
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Post by spock on Mar 30, 2019 14:16:48 GMT -6
Guitar FLAT isn’t flat, it’s a curve in of itself, the naming convention comes from the console; the TG Mic doesn’t have an issue with sibilance. It has a variety of sounds available from it, topping out at 30 in reality when counting what 50 Hz does to the curved. When ragan went to System B (not sure the settings) vs his MK mic it they were close in my opinion.
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Post by chessparov on Mar 30, 2019 14:24:38 GMT -6
System B and Pultec style EQ (as per Dr. Bill) will be excellent IMHO. I wonder how going through UA610/710 might work out. Chris
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Post by spock on Mar 30, 2019 15:08:46 GMT -6
System B and Pultec style EQ (as per Dr. Bill) will be excellent IMHO. I wonder how going through UA610/710 might work out. Chris . Tube pre makes a great pairing, the REDD.47 I can confirm. I wonder what preamps ragan is using for each mic.
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Post by ragan on Mar 30, 2019 15:12:44 GMT -6
System B and Pultec style EQ (as per Dr. Bill) will be excellent IMHO. I wonder how going through UA610/710 might work out. Chris . Tube pre makes a great pairing, the REDD.47 I can confirm. I wonder what preamps ragan is using for each mic. Oh, I think I listed it above but Great River MP-2NV.
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Post by lpedrum on Mar 30, 2019 15:24:26 GMT -6
Subjective stuff I suppose but the TG always sounds more strident and more scooped to me. For my part, I just can’t seem to make friends with the TG’s top end, no matter what setting I have it on. And not just on my voice, on acoustic guitar as well. I would always be fighting it. I have no doubt it will be a great fit for folks that want a bright sound I know you've only had the TG for a couple of days--but those are NOT the words I was hoping to hear. Pretty damning.
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Post by spock on Mar 30, 2019 15:30:02 GMT -6
. Tube pre makes a great pairing, the REDD.47 I can confirm. I wonder what preamps ragan is using for each mic. Oh, I think I listed it above but Great River MP-2NV. Cool, what others do you have, just curious...
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Post by drbill on Mar 30, 2019 15:36:34 GMT -6
When ragan went to System B (not sure the settings) vs his MK mic it they were close in my opinion. Man.....sorry. I'd have to disagree 110%. Setting B was worse than setting A on Ragan's vocals IMO. Pinched and cutting in comparison to the 67. I honestly don't know what to say if you think they sound close. Again, Grace M905 D/A and JBL 708's with Sub. The mic may be incredibly awesome in some situations (maybe with a tube pre and a manley vary-mu?), but most of the clips I've heard - especially vox - have not been to my taste.
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Post by indiehouse on Mar 30, 2019 15:37:11 GMT -6
Subjective stuff I suppose but the TG always sounds more strident and more scooped to me. For my part, I just can’t seem to make friends with the TG’s top end, no matter what setting I have it on. And not just on my voice, on acoustic guitar as well. I would always be fighting it. I have no doubt it will be a great fit for folks that want a bright sound I know you've only had the TG for a couple of days--but those are NOT the words I was hoping to hear. Pretty damning. Why is that damning? That’s a pretty strong and objective word.
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 30, 2019 15:47:58 GMT -6
For real. It’s almost like everyone is pretending like the clips I posted didn’t happen.
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Post by ragan on Mar 30, 2019 16:26:53 GMT -6
I am not in any way the final word on this mic. I was just wanting to share some real world perspective. I was super intrigued by the TG precisely *because* it sounded so unique in the Chandler demos. Making a U87 sound like a telephone effect and whatnot. I still think the drum OH clips Chandler put out sound phenomenal. And that sentiment has been echoed by early users.
And it should be noted that I have a pretty hard to record voice in some ways. It’s just bright and kinda loud, which is why I’ve always gravitated towards mics that can handle that pointiness and elegantly tame it. I’m gonna keep experimenting but I feel like the TG just isn’t a great match for my voice. It’s a uniquely voiced bright mic and I have kind of a uniquely voiced bright voice. Sum them and there’s just too much 10-12k in my view. And that’s the extent to which I mean to comment, just from one dude with one voice’s perspective.
Indeed, check out John’s clips again. I think they sounded great.
I mentioned acoustic guitar too. I’ll post some clips of that as well. In that case, the TG still sounds quite bright but it’s more of a taste thing. The top reminds me of an SDC in that application. Could be right up someone’s alley.
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Post by ragan on Mar 30, 2019 16:33:40 GMT -6
Oh, I think I listed it above but Great River MP-2NV. Cool, what others do you have, just curious... Only other pair of anything worthy mentioning is the Stam 1073MPA with Sowters. I’m squarely a Neve sonics guy so those 4 channels are my go-to.
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 30, 2019 16:59:02 GMT -6
Having been a Ragan fanboy since our early apollo gs thread days, personally, I think his current set up with his mk67, gr pre sounds unbeatable and just works for him, so as said above, it’s always the emotion of his vocal you experience .
I get the gear fever and fun of trying a new mike, but trust your gut, if it doesn’t feel right, it won’t be right and none of us need those feelings stepping up to the mike.
This is about what pairs best with you not a criticism of the TG mike.
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