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Post by popmann on Oct 24, 2013 22:04:32 GMT -6
Anyway--now, it's set up as a stereo room reverb and dual mono tape delay for most everything. Sometimes, I need a second reverb and use a software delay.
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Post by cenafria on Oct 28, 2013 3:29:22 GMT -6
I'd like to see an outboard, high quality hp/lp filter box in banks of 8 for a decent price. I'm probably going to build the harrison ford filter box, it's not cheap, but supposed to have a ton of vibe harrison 32 style? I use these all the time in the studio's console (Harrison 32 series). I find them very useful and effective. Come to think about it, one of the reasons I use the Harrison's preamps so much (these are the ones with the Jensen 115k) is because of the filters (and eq). If I didn't have them, I'd get my hands on those Harrison Ford filters. These filters are not subtle however. Sweeping the low pass almost sounds like sweeping a synth's filter. |
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Post by henge on Oct 28, 2013 6:52:21 GMT -6
I've been using it for almost a decade (if you count the Rumour before it) for room reverbs. I also have a soft spot for it's tape delay algorithm--but, EchoBoy is more flexible-KSP8 more "hifi". I have a PCM91 I use for long'ish "lead" reverbs....which honestly sits on one preset a huge majority of the time--"Vocal Magic". The KSP8 handles drum and "band room" type ambiences. I've mentioned elsewhere, that it's input matrix is true stereo--so, if you send into the left channel, the reverb happens some say 90% on the left. I do a lot of panning INTO the reverb to create space and movement. Most software reverbs don't have a true stereo input matrix. Which is why I admit it's a "me thing"--it doesn't sound better to use it on some single track. But if it's on a bus with a whole band being sent to various panned positions....most software falls down for me. It's like they are made to work on a single instrument. Like I have no issues with using an impulse reverb to add an ambience to a guitar track. But, over the years, I've developed this way of working where various elements are sent to the aux buss with different panning than their pan pot....and I really like it....and clients do....and I've not yet been able to nail that with software. I remeber when I had a Pc2x...and seeing how much of their "reality" was not in the sample, but in the cabinet modelling (for EPs) and room ambiences....then they announce they would make the reverb units--I bought a Rumour....loved it...so eventually got a KSP8 to integrate with my old Akai DPS24, which had an ADAT port and LOUSY internal FX. Intended to sell it and go software when I moved to Cubase full time....but, I couldn't find anything that worked for me. I've been thinking about this from when you brought it up a while ago. Seeing that with soft verbs you can have as many as you want, can't the type of panning into verb technique you use be achieved with multiple instances of the same verb on many instruments? |
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Post by popmann on Oct 28, 2013 9:44:01 GMT -6
You mean running as an insert on every channel? Not at all. It will ALWAYS follow the panning of the track then**. You could run pairs of mono reverbs with the same settings...and then the aux channel itself fed back to the other side by a small percentage. But, I refuse to deal with that routing mess.
Plus, Aether has full stereo, and I couldn't dup the sound. Everytime I thought I'd be close, I'd switch back-nope.
**does seem like one I tried (maybe Altiverb) had some kind of internal panning?
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Post by Ward on Oct 30, 2013 15:30:45 GMT -6
Anyone else thing the new Neumann TLM107 is clearly targeted at the latest AKG C414s?
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 30, 2013 21:57:01 GMT -6
Hmm, that's interesting ward. I'm not familiar with the new 414's, just the old ones. In the less than a minute I tried the TLM 107, it reminded me of the 103 or the U87, crisp, and good. If it was $1100 or better yet, $999, it would be much more interesting. The quality is there, but you pay for the name a bit. I think better mics can be had at their MSRP.
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 30, 2013 22:47:46 GMT -6
Don't know if anyone has said it, but a Neumann U67 and U47 to original specs...
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 30, 2013 23:39:32 GMT -6
Don't quite follow you John.
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Post by popmann on Oct 31, 2013 8:04:04 GMT -6
Don't know if anyone has said it, but a Neumann U67 and U47 to original specs... He means new gear he wish was made. |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 31, 2013 9:18:38 GMT -6
Thanks Popmann, appreciate the help.
Yes John, I've wondered that too. Neumann trades on their reputation, constantly referring to their classic mics, yet they don't seem to have the corporate will to truly make them again. Who cares what the cost will be, if they really do it right, they'll be back ordered for years.
I've had a lot of guitars over time, 59' Les Paul neck/68 body, original Fender Esquire (51' I believe), original Gretch Country Club Custom from 62', mid-sixties Jazz Bass, 70's Tele's and Strats, and on.. so I have references to what are now classics, that were just current or not so old guitars at the time. Fender makes some new guitars today that are every bit as good as they've ever been, I know, because I've played the originals when they were new, or close to new, so why not Neumann? Neumann has a fading opportunity, some original Neumann/Telefunken employees are still alive and really know their stuff, they could easily hire them on as consultants.
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 31, 2013 11:52:55 GMT -6
Like new ideas? I thought he just meant new gear...
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 31, 2013 12:44:11 GMT -6
Could be old gear re-made too, mods to old gear, or new ideas, it's all good.. I still want something competitive with a Burl Bomber A/D for under $800, I can dream can't I ;-)
I wouldn't mind a manual on how the hell to put those frickin' rubber bands back on the shock mount.
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Post by Ward on Oct 31, 2013 12:48:01 GMT -6
SNIP so why not Neumann? Neumann has a fading opportunity, some original Neumann/Telefunken employees are still alive and really know their stuff, they could easily hire them on as consultants. That's not really a bad idea. Pass the craft down to a new generation of experts before the old generation is dead. Perhaps that is what has made (Neumann) Gefell so strong. They have passed down their techniques and knowledge along the way, ensuring that the real legacy of Georgs Neumann was protected and preserved. How else did they emerge from the Cold War as such a powerhouse?? Of course, they've also innovated as well. Some of their more recent designs show tremendous innovation and evolution from their own history. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 31, 2013 13:19:05 GMT -6
From my understanding, Neumann thinks their current line is better.
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Post by popmann on Oct 31, 2013 16:20:30 GMT -6
Well, it IS better, from a spec standpoint. This is no different than solid state being a better way to amplify a signal than a tube...99% of amplifiers are solid state. Just not for GUITAR. While most of technology pushes for improvement and perfection in numbers...sometimes a certain tech hits on important imperfections for a given art. Can you imagine asking a painter to give up the canvas and oils and horsehairs for a little plastic wand and touch screen with FAR more flexible color selection? Anyway...
In the spirit of "why can't they make X like they used to"...my wish if for tubes. Vacuum tubes. Not even CLOSE to as good as they were in the 50s-80s. I would give you NOS tube market value for the ability to buy consistent new production tubes locally (or online if I suppose that's necessary). My "Burl AD fund" is about to get raided to buy up all the NOS tubes I can find for the gear I own so the quest is OVER for me an maybe for some time after I pass for whomever gets the gear. I don't WANT to....I want to just place an order for new tubes. It would STILL be expensive...but, I wouldn't feel the need to have as many spares if I could go down to British Audio down the road or Ferg's or Corner and pick up a new X or Y when there's trouble. But, I can't. So I'm gonna be a hoarder? Ehh...
This relates because A) I take back anything I wished for before--this is what I want. and B)tubes, unfortunately seem to be mysteriously worse than they were--like LDC microphones. I swear--it's not a company. It's beyond that. I've experienced it with different companies. I think there's got to be something at component level happening. If I hadn't heard it equally on solid state mics, I'd actually blame tubes. But, I don't think the knowledge is there. Certainly not married to the desire. Korby does a fine, fine job, IME. I think this is to a level that the AES needs to have some kind of all hands red alert. Call in everyone who is a mic expert...old and younger...to come in and debate and create...but, as of now, I kinda think it's not unlike those NOS tubes. I think 12ax7s (little preamp tubes) are going for $100-250 now. New is $8-20. Old mics are still a steal percentage wise.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 31, 2013 19:10:13 GMT -6
Tubes are tricky business, and I hear you on this popmann. It would be great if there was some consistency in quality. I had a THD guitar amp that allowed you to switch to any tube without re-biasing. So, I tried all sorts of tubes, many, rare, vintage NOS and highly prized, as well as newer brands. I preferred EL34's, and despite researching and finding the more prized and highly rated tubes, the best sounding EL34 was a new Russian one. Perhaps they're still doing it the old way there, I don't know.
I have a friend with two original U47's, and he claims one sounds better than the other. I wonder if it's the tube making the difference. I'll have the chance to try them at some point.
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Post by lolo on Oct 31, 2013 20:14:50 GMT -6
Could be old gear re-made too, mods to old gear, or new ideas, it's all good.. I still want something competitive with a Burl Bomber A/D for under $800, I can dream can't I ;-) I wouldn't mind a manual on how the hell to put those frickin' rubber bands back on the shock mount. Try the Ross Martin ADC, received mine a week ago. Even tho mine only worked for 40 minutes, it blew my mind. Sounded like it had some serious balls. Hehe. Hopefully I can find the issue today, because i need to mix through this baby. Hopefully just a faulty cable. The sound of this thing is worth alot more. |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 31, 2013 21:13:30 GMT -6
Thanks Laurence, I've been thinking on that. I hope you get yours up and running, keep us posted on the Ross Martin thread.
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Post by popmann on Nov 2, 2013 10:59:29 GMT -6
Tubes are tricky business, and I hear you on this popmann. It would be great if there was some consistency in quality. I had a THD guitar amp that allowed you to switch to any tube without re-biasing. So, I tried all sorts of tubes, many, rare, vintage NOS and highly prized, as well as newer brands. I preferred EL34's, and despite researching and finding the more prized and highly rated tubes, the best sounding EL34 was a new Russian one. Perhaps they're still doing it the old way there, I don't know. I have a friend with two original U47's, and he claims one sounds better than the other. I wonder if it's the tube making the difference. I'll have the chance to try them at some point. Was the new Russian one an SED? That's what prompted my latest NOS search--those are now going for NOS prices....they sold their name, but some say are still making tubes under a different name. NOS EL34s are out all together. Marshall guys have chewed through them--they're easily $3-400 pair now IF you can find them. Which is why the SED factory was important, as the best current productions. Regardless...the tube makes a TON of difference re:mic. Unfortunately, 12ay7s I need for my Bassman circuit amps are completely torn through by people putting them in cheap Chinese LDCs. You would know them by the 6072 designation used in the C12.  THere are mic makers who've used lesser used tubes JUST because they can still get NOS ones in enough quantity to fill orders. ....but, the VHT is also...well, NOS tubes make the biggest difference in circuits intended for them. I have a modern custom EL84 amp...it's got NOS power tubes and V1 preamp now--but, it's subtle compared to the Plexi and Bassman circuits. However, a more traditional DrZ (Vox style circuit) it night and day with NOS. I've not swapped the tubes in my C3/122 yet....which is the other thing that sparked the hunt. The thing that I wonder is CAN they be made. Which is not unlike the LDC thing being wished about here. I am NOT a vintage snob. At all. But, those two things were better, IMO, by a noticeable amount in the past. ANyway-I think they make seperate but equal LDCs now--but, it takes $4k+ to get there, and it IS still different if you do want "that sound". Tubes, I don't think that's true. They're compromised in direct comparison. Newer amp designs work around that to some degree...but, there, it's less about "that sound" and more about better. My Reinhardt is on it's last set of SEDs...I hope I can find more. But, BobR said they're not good if you just pull 100....that even them-he had to pay someone to hand test and pick through them to get ones that sounded good and were reliable. I'm even open to the idea of a solid state drop in replacement. There are pedal circuits that can break up a diode better than a lot of new tubes...anyway-practicing today on the Reinhardt and thought about your comment about "russian tubes".... |
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Post by Ward on Nov 3, 2013 9:40:22 GMT -6
Popmann, you can substitute 12aw7's for 12ay7's. They are lower gain than the 12ax7, like the 12ay7 and make little to no difference to the sound of your bassman style amp. I've done it many times with my Voxes and blackface Fenders. Never been an issue. And using a good 12aw7 in there is always preferably to using a crappy 12ay7
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Post by popmann on Nov 3, 2013 10:28:19 GMT -6
I have never heard of such a tube. Google has trouble with it, too. I really just use 5751s...which add more gain, but for guitar that's OK-AT7s change the tone a bit too much, despite meeting the gain half way....the one I use for bass, I just keep a modern (EH I think?) 12ay7 in it. Too brittle for guitar...but, that's fine for a bass with flat wounds, you know?
Shoot me a link of where I might find your rec....I'm always up for some good tube experimentation.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Nov 3, 2013 10:47:39 GMT -6
Popmann, I opened up my storage case and took a photo of the left over tubes I have. I think I sold the THD with the Russian tube, so I'm not able to be sure which one it was. Of those, there are 2 made in Great Britain EL84's, a Mullard EL 34, a Russian 6CA7EH, a made in Russia Electro Harmonix EL34 and an EL-34B made in China , and an RCA made in USA 604? (hard to read) Radiotron. Of these, I swear the Chinese one slays the others, including the NOS Great Britain Mullard. I used to own Duane Allman's marshall 100, (from the Live at the Fillmore era, with the original 2X 4 X12 stack from 1968, so my reference is the best Marshall ever made that you'll never hear, it was stolen...ugh. Everyone preferred the Chinese EL34, which defied convention, but there it was. maybe it was just luck.. Attachments:
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Post by Ward on Nov 3, 2013 12:41:50 GMT -6
I have never heard of such a tube. Google has trouble with it, too. I really just use 5751s...which add more gain, but for guitar that's OK-AT7s change the tone a bit too much, despite meeting the gain half way....the one I use for bass, I just keep a modern (EH I think?) 12ay7 in it. Too brittle for guitar...but, that's fine for a bass with flat wounds, you know? Shoot me a link of where I might find your rec....I'm always up for some good tube experimentation. Data sheet on vacuum tubes: frank.pocnet.net/vademecum0.html You'll see the 12 aw7 listed there. Some basic info: www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_12aw7.html And don't forget the venerable 12au7: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12AU7 |
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THere are mic makers who've used lesser used tubes JUST because they can still get NOS ones in enough quantity to fill orders.
