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Post by tonycamphd on Dec 18, 2014 11:10:33 GMT -6
The ceiling height is what always blows me away about the tracking rooms of major studios. The wall materials of wood and stone are available to anybody, and many people with large homes have basements as long and wide as the tracking room. It's the ceiling height that's the show stopper. For you acoustics experts: Has there been any acoustics research regarding acoustic solutions to emulate the benefits of the high ceiling without having one? I'd be interested in any thoughts on the subject. Thanks again to John for the photos. I'm not an acoustician by any stretch of the imagination 8) But i can say with utter certainty that high ceiling are the shit! If you are stuck with a lower ceiling "lifting" it would be the best answer. "lifting" just means absorbing as much reflective energy as possible to make it appear to be gone....which in reality is VERY difficult to do, the human ear is way beyond sophisticated, and extremely hard to fool, if you can close your eyes and talk or sing and not sense the ceiling above your head, you should be thrilled! because in all likelihood "close" is all you will get unfortunately. If you can get 4" of owens 703 up there, and some sort of anechoic pyramid/cone style foam (with some respectable weight to it) on top of it (very good at redirecting reflections deeper into the absorption, flat 703 reflects a lot of high freqs back at you), and then use mics with good nulling patterns aimed top side, you can get away with a low ceiling, but the "air" that's achieved with a high ceiling is all but impossible to fake ime(and that's not even talking about ambient micing). I'd also add that if you think your going to achieve that "air" with a plugin, hardware, or even real plates or chambers, you're fooling yourself, the room is KING! If you have a budget for the real thing, make it happen, your life will be beautiful 8) If you're in a basement that has drywall on the lid, PULL IT OFF, and use those cavities to absorb, the deeper you can make the insulation the better ime. and for the love of god get rid of that wall to wall carpet 8) hope this helps
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Post by jcoutu1 on Dec 18, 2014 11:13:25 GMT -6
so, whats it like playing acoustic through a real 670...? cheers Wiz That's the real question... how good is the Fairchild? Should I sell my car and kids to get one? Haha
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Post by swurveman on Dec 18, 2014 11:19:21 GMT -6
The ceiling height is what always blows me away about the tracking rooms of major studios. The wall materials of wood and stone are available to anybody, and many people with large homes have basements as long and wide as the tracking room. It's the ceiling height that's the show stopper. For you acoustics experts: Has there been any acoustics research regarding acoustic solutions to emulate the benefits of the high ceiling without having one? I'd be interested in any thoughts on the subject. Thanks again to John for the photos. I'm not an acoustician by any stretch of the imagination 8) But i can say with utter certainty that high ceiling are the shit! If you are stuck with a lower ceiling "lifting" it would be the best answer. "lifting" just means absorbing as much reflective energy as possible to make it appear to be gone....which in reality is VERY difficult to do, the human ear is way beyond sophisticated, and extremely hard to fool, if you can close your eyes and talk or sing and not sense the ceiling above your head, you should be thrilled! because in all likelihood "close" is all you will get unfortunately. If you can get 4" of owens 703 up there, and some sort of anechoic pyramid/cone style foam (with some respectable weight to it) on top of it (very good at redirecting reflections deeper into the absorption, flat 703 reflects a lot of high freqs back at you), and then use mics with good nulling patterns aimed top side, you can get away with a low ceiling, but the "air" that's achieved with a high ceiling is all but impossible to fake ime(and that's not even talking about ambient micing). I'd also add that if you think your going to achieve that "air" with a plugin, hardware, or even real plates or chambers, you're fooling yourself, the room is KING! If you have a budget for the real thing, make it happen, your life will be beautiful 8) If you're in a basement that has drywall on the lid, PULL IT OFF, and use those cavities to absorb, the deeper you can make the insulation the better ime. and for the love of god get rid of that wall to wall carpet 8) hope this helps Thanks Tony.
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Post by henge on Dec 18, 2014 11:47:18 GMT -6
Very cool thread!! Loving seeing the studio. Thanks Johnkenn
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 18, 2014 11:53:51 GMT -6
The ceiling height is what always blows me away about the tracking rooms of major studios. The wall materials of wood and stone are available to anybody, and many people with large homes have basements as long and wide as the tracking room. It's the ceiling height that's the show stopper. For you acoustics experts: Has there been any acoustics research regarding acoustic solutions to emulate the benefits of the high ceiling without having one? I'd be interested in any thoughts on the subject. Thanks again to John for the photos. I'm not an acoustician by any stretch of the imagination 8) But i can say with utter certainty that high ceiling are the shit! If you are stuck with a lower ceiling "lifting" it would be the best answer. "lifting" just means absorbing as much reflective energy as possible to make it appear to be gone....which in reality is VERY difficult to do, the human ear is way beyond sophisticated, and extremely hard to fool, if you can close your eyes and talk or sing and not sense the ceiling above your head, you should be thrilled! because in all likelihood "close" is all you will get unfortunately. If you can get 4" of owens 703 up there, and some sort of anechoic pyramid/cone style foam (with some respectable weight to it) on top of it (very good at redirecting reflections deeper into the absorption, flat 703 reflects a lot of high freqs back at you), and then use mics with good nulling patterns aimed top side, you can get away with a low ceiling, but the "air" that's achieved with a high ceiling is all but impossible to fake ime(and that's not even talking about ambient micing). I'd also add that if you think your going to achieve that "air" with a plugin, hardware, or even real plates or chambers, you're fooling yourself, the room is KING! If you have a budget for the real thing, make it happen, your life will be beautiful 8) If you're in a basement that has drywall on the lid, PULL IT OFF, and use those cavities to absorb, the deeper you can make the insulation the better ime. and for the love of god get rid of that wall to wall carpet 8) hope this helps Tone is right it can help a bit, add a bit of diffusion as well, but there is nothing like a real high ceiling ! I like my 15 ft but man 35-50 is unreal and why there is nothing like a real studio!
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Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 18, 2014 12:55:21 GMT -6
" JimWilliams said, the Bombshelter.". Too much Jim!
How'd it sound?
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 18, 2014 13:32:24 GMT -6
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 18, 2014 13:33:48 GMT -6
I'm terrible at guestimating height...maybe 50 is too high...maybe 35-50...
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Post by nobtwiddler on Dec 18, 2014 13:45:21 GMT -6
Years ago, in the early 80's I had a old unused for years 1000 gal oil tank on the studio property. Had a friend cut in half for me in the center. Once we opened it up, I washed it out quite a few times over the next few months so I could work in it. The residual smell was initially too much for me to be in there for but a few minutes at a time. Anyhow, long story short. I attached (welded) one cheap dynamic (Radio Shack) mic to each end of the tank...then ran old "Lionel" train track to braces I placed in the bottom of the tank. These braces were used to keep the train track about 1 foot above the tank floor in case and water got inside the tank. (although we did have a few drain holes) The track ran the entire length of the tank end to end, with Lionel end stop bumpers at each end. We then place a old Lionel train on the track with a flatbed car behind it....attached to the flatbed car was a heavy duty 6 x 9 Mindblower car speaker. The cables for audio, speaker, and train control, were all wired up and run thru the filler hole out the top of the tank. Tank was then buried under the entrance to our horse stable, which was very close to the studio. This way we could dig a short trench for all the cables right up to the studio building.
In a nutshell, it sounded amazing for almost 10 years, and worked perfectly, until it didn't. Haha Moving the train back and forth along the track would change the reverb time, and sound as well as the stereo image of the verb. Or you could use just one side of the chamber. Also you could get some crazy sounds with the train in motion! It was cool, and if there was a easy way to get in and out of this thing, then I would have made an attempt to fix it, but I'd have to rent a backhoe again, dig it up, cut it open. Wasn't worth it at that point... But it was a really great effect when it was working, and totally unique to our studio!
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 18, 2014 13:51:12 GMT -6
Years ago, in the early 80's I had a old unused for years 1000 gal oil tank on the studio property. Had a friend cut in half for me in the center. Once we opened it up, I washed it out quite a few times over the next few months so I could work in it. The residual smell was initially too much for me to be in there for but a few minutes at a time. Anyhow, long story short. I attached (welded) one cheap dynamic (Radio Shack) mic to each end of the tank...then ran old "Lionel" train track to braces I placed in the bottom of the tank. These braces were used to keep the train track about 1 foot above the tank floor in case and water got inside the tank. (although we did have a few drain holes) The track ran the entire length of the tank end to end, with Lionel end stop bumpers at each end. We then place a old Lionel train on the track with a flatbed car behind it....attached to the flatbed car was a heavy duty 6 x 9 Mindblower car speaker. The cables for audio, speaker, and train control, were all wired up and run thru the filler hole out the top of the tank. Tank was then buried under the entrance to our horse stable, which was very close to the studio. This way we could dig a short trench for all the cables right up to the studio building. In a nutshell, it sounded amazing for almost 10 years, and worked perfectly, until it didn't. Haha Moving the train back and forth along the track would change the reverb time, and sound as well as the stereo image of the verb. Or you could use just one side of the chamber. Also you could get some crazy sounds with the train in motion! It was cool, and if there was a easy way to get in and out of this thing, then I would have made an attempt to fix it, but I'd have to rent a backhoe again, dig it up, cut it open. Wasn't worth it at that point... But it was a really great effect when it was working, and totally unique to our studio! Now, that's awesome.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 18, 2014 14:15:32 GMT -6
Love it nobtwiddler! Now that is cool.
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Post by winetree on Dec 18, 2014 15:28:46 GMT -6
My first studio was in a town village. It was the original concrete phone company building. It had solid 15" concrete walls and 25' high concrete ceiling with a completely floating studio built inside. There was enough rebar inside the shell to stop any cell phone transmission once inside . A trap door and a ladder lead down into a large concrete vault where all the telephone lines from the city once ran into. I placed a movable speaker on a track and two mics inside for an echo chamber. There were also 2 tiled bathrooms, one large and one small, that were used as live recording rooms, mostly for vocals, sax, and effects. With only a Master Room spring reverb at the time, we found many ways to use the natural reverbs.
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Post by ben on Dec 18, 2014 16:38:29 GMT -6
Have you been able to sit in studio c for a bit? If I ever get to Nashville, I so want to hear that room!
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 18, 2014 16:53:29 GMT -6
I could live with little studio "B"!
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 18, 2014 16:53:51 GMT -6
Meant to get some pics inside there. I've had some stuff mixed in there before. Honestly, it's kind've weird in there. There's no thump...
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Post by Calvin on Dec 18, 2014 17:42:43 GMT -6
Meant to get some pics inside there. I've had some stuff mixed in there before. Honestly, it's kind've weird in there. There's no thump... Oh, that's not the room for me, then. I NEEDS ME SOME THUMP. Gotta feel that whaaaack in the chest when those mains get crankin'. That's the best part about being in a great studio! Well, that, and the great music that can be made.
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 18, 2014 17:51:39 GMT -6
That was C I was talking about...Not really a tracking room...but I think there's a video floating around of an acoustic performance in there.
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