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Post by paulcheeba on Jul 1, 2023 10:17:24 GMT -6
One thing I think makes a substantial difference is great connectors and cables. It makes the mics look classic. Tape op seems to make a huge impact still. They just reviewed the Wellspring which has been sold out since. I agree with the connectors. That’s why we make our own cable and connectors for many of our mics. I also eventually want to make a swivel mount connector for the b87, B67 mics. Your swivel connectors look amazing. I would have them in all the pictures. |
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Post by gmichael on Jul 1, 2023 16:50:23 GMT -6
So many good ideas and reality checks. Thanks so much guys. I won't quote replies etc in this post as it will get too long. Josh, I really appreciate your perspective and points, they make sense and give me a ton of stuff to think over. Ward and Ward, yep there are two of you lol. thanks so much for the time you have both devoted to this so far. Your points of view and exposure in the industry are really helpful. Moose, thanks for your thoughts just now. I also know Fletcher though not as you do. In my early days, he helped me a lot to avoid the poison and actually make stuff rather than simply talk about it all the time. He is an interesting dude and we have enjoyed some fin trade show banter as well. Your points are thought provoking. It is interesting that everyday, I hear of people that haven't even heard of us and yet they but microphones form others that we have made parts for for the entire life of the said product. I fell this is an area where we have neglected somewhat and probably need to not neglect coming forth. We need an advertising budget that is made from real dollars, not just word of mouth. we also really need to use the expertise of others and not try to carry every torch. Over the coming months, we hope to branch out using many of these suggestions. that bring me to another question for your all. Do you still read the Mags? Is it worth advertising there? What other forms of advertising should we consider? And don't worry John K, I plan on advertising here at RGO as I feel the forum really deserves the support. Thanks again. Ben Under 35's don't read and the ones that do, do not read well by traditional expectations with very rare exceptions. Instagram and Ticktok advertising is how to reach massive audiences.
Printed magazines are so limited and really expensive, choosing the right rag to dump that kind of cash is a bit of an obstacle course. While the US might be hyper focused on itself I think SoS is less boutique and niche than TapeOp, which I find the writing in to be
underwhelming and often remiss of pertinent details. It's not a terrible rag but it's not exactly the pinnacle either. I would consider an ad in TapeOp a risk greater than any potential return, unless the focus of the campaign is purely proliferating brand recognition and identity. There is no getting around YT info-torials that are produced to an established standard that has the production quality to align with brand identity and not compromise any attempts with underfunded unprofessional well meaning feel good pieces. There are more than a few top Australian producers and mixers I could put you in touch with to discuss a potential role in helping present these type of infomercials, I can think only 2 standout guys who have the presence and status in conjunction with the strength of character and reputation that would be excellent candidates. I'm talking about engineer/producer types but there are also a few folks I see on the bigger calls consistently who also possess that on camera appeal and are highly regarded by folks from all over. I think it has to start as close to home as possible and with an ensemble of personalities that can appeal to a wider demographic than just the old boys in forums.
As for the older established folks with a brand name that has enormous mileage to offer, you've got one in here that would reflect the Australian end of things with a degree of influence that cannot be looked past. ( No, I'm not his agent!lol)
Bypass the usual suspects who now make their living from product endorsements and lecturing circuits and avoid the wankers in love with the sound of their own voice, look at serious people and study their intentions in the work they have done and the few carefully chosen endorsements they have out there already. I think magazine/printed media is down the track from a brand identification campaign. First you have to build that, then consider using printed media to start influencing potential buyers.
Sell yourself to those who can influence en masse and you have a great ground game without risking it all on a hail mary type campaign via printed media. It's too risky a venture early in a campaign where things that might need tweaking once feedback from in the wild starts rolling in. This project needs it's own Project Manager to insulate you from ancillary service providers and help you keep a focus on what you want from everything not just want those hired want to influence you to do in their own interests.
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Post by Ward on Jul 1, 2023 17:27:42 GMT -6
So many good ideas and reality checks. Thanks so much guys.SNIP Ward and Ward, yep there are two of you lol. thanks so much for the time you have both devoted to this so far. Your points of view and exposure in the industry are really helpful. Thanks again. Ben Oh no . . . talk about a surprise plot twist! You're very welcome, by the way. Great chatting with you. |
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Post by ericn on Jul 1, 2023 18:13:58 GMT -6
The problem with the magazines today is 90% understand it’s pay to play, another 5% see your ad within 3 pages of your review and suspect it’s pay to play, so 95% read the review without taking it completely seriously.
However they do a great job of getting a whole bunch of people to actually read that list of features you and your dealers put up, a couple of vendors I know have actually pushed a few pieces for review to cut down returns because people don’t normally read anymore.
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Post by paulcheeba on Jul 1, 2023 22:45:44 GMT -6
TBH the biggest hype is a big thread on the Purple site if you can hook them in. I started a little appreciation thread about Coil that turned into a monster. Soyuz have thanked me for name checking them so much. Olympic, Advanced Audio etc. some well placed shootouts are probably the best free advertising and I never got paid I just wanted to share the love.
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Post by chessparov on Jul 1, 2023 23:20:03 GMT -6
Bingo!  Chris |
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Post by mics on Jul 2, 2023 17:38:44 GMT -6
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Post by ab101 on Jul 2, 2023 17:45:29 GMT -6
I like the BN with Australia and "since 2002" underneath - sort of horizontally. I am not sure I would "bold" the BN - hard to say without seeing it on metal.
Great work, Ben!
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Post by reddirt on Jul 2, 2023 18:03:58 GMT -6
The B N Font Needs to be more "Pro" Ben - hand it over to a graphic designer; I like the inclusion of Australia since 2002.
Cheers, Ross
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Post by gmichael on Jul 2, 2023 18:06:53 GMT -6
The fonts and font combinations are all wrong to me.
Combining fonts requires a particular level of refined discernment.
While I do like the concept of the hexagon, none of the concepts say anything at all.
I'd start over only keeping the outer most hexagon and bin everything else
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Post by chessparov on Jul 2, 2023 18:20:48 GMT -6
I like the BN with Australia and "since 2002" underneath - sort of horizontally. I am not sure I would "bold" the BN - hard to say without seeing it on metal. Great work, Ben! My vote out of what's here includes.. "Australia"/since 2002. With the cursive print version of Beesneez. Give a nod to the Roaring 20's/Early 30's. I don't have enough (well any LOL!) background to judge how much better an "Outside Pro's" version might be. But IMHO you HAVE to A/B whatever you cone up with a seasoned Pro's advice/actual Art Work. Chris |
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Post by gmichael on Jul 2, 2023 18:24:17 GMT -6
The B N Font Needs to be more "Pro" Ben - hand it over to a graphic designer; I like the inclusion of Australia since 2002. Cheers, Ross I agree the fonts are terrible but before spending money on a well screened and interviewed graphic artist , they really need a minimum of 5 fleshed out ideas. Think of the graphic artist as hiring a mix engineer. You need to get it to 95-97% realised and have the graphics person go after those remaining 1%'s. Anything less and you will spend an extraordinary amount of money on graphics and still not have what you need or want.
Been down this rabbit hole and it can get into the 0,000's and wind up with wish in one hand and shit in the other unless approached desively
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Post by gmichael on Jul 2, 2023 18:28:55 GMT -6
I like the BN with Australia and "since 2002" underneath - sort of horizontally. I am not sure I would "bold" the BN - hard to say without seeing it on metal. Great work, Ben! My vote out of what's here includes.. "Australia"/since 2002. With the cursive print version of Beesneez. Give a nod to the Roaring 20's/Early 30's. I don't have enough (well any LOL!) background to judge how much better an "Outside Pro's" version might be. But IMHO you HAVE to A/B whatever you cone up with a seasoned Pro's advice/actual Art Work. Chris The cursive font won't age well, it's already a very dated unaesthetically balanced additive to the design, if the hexagon is the base design element. I'm not convinced the hexagon works completely. Look at the Heiserman logo, that was most likely done on Canva ( the graphical contents are premium content for subscribers) and fully tweaked by a GA. It's a very modern unique logo that is cleverly conceptualised and no distracting curly font antiquation. This modern BN logo should not be harkening to an era in which it did not exist, imo
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Post by paulcheeba on Jul 2, 2023 18:44:10 GMT -6
I prefer The Other Mark’s one - 2 above the AI where the BN is bolder than than the hex, not the colours but the layout.
The fonts at the moment clash for me.
Why not use Fiverr to get you in the zone.
Or can we see the original logo in black or blue to refresh?
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Post by ericn on Jul 2, 2023 20:27:08 GMT -6
I prefer The Other Mark’s one - 2 above the AI where the BN is bolder than than the hex, not the colours but the layout. The fonts at the moment clash for me. Why not use Fiverr to get you in the zone. Or can we see the original logo in black or blue to refresh? Hey now, you have been around way to many managers, A&R reps and we can’t forget that “friend who plays —-“ but we all know is really a coke dealer 😎 |
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Post by paulcheeba on Jul 2, 2023 22:36:53 GMT -6
I prefer The Other Mark’s one - 2 above the AI where the BN is bolder than than the hex, not the colours but the layout. The fonts at the moment clash for me. Why not use Fiverr to get you in the zone. Or can we see the original logo in black or blue to refresh? Hey now, you have been around way to many managers, A&R reps and we can’t forget that “friend who plays —-“ but we all know is really a coke dealer 😎 How is that relevant? I personally don’t think it’s advanced so where do all the best world famous Australian Chefs and Vineyards get their logos. I’m pretty sure they don’t do it themselves. Just for a reset how about seeing the original in a non-bright red in case it’s the colour. I Already thought the bold BN that stood out of the Hexagon was well presented it just was weak in colour. WTF has that got to do with A&R - though mine were Derek Green, Jac Holzman and Seymour Stein. So not sure what coke dealing has to do with it? |
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Post by paulcheeba on Jul 2, 2023 22:38:52 GMT -6
P.S. not having rivets really helps the smaller size logos.
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Post by mics on Jul 2, 2023 23:07:10 GMT -6
P.S. not having rivets really helps the smaller size logos. I couldn’t agree more. The rivets or screw make it too Tankish. (Great word huh!! I was thinking brushed metal with grey lettering. |
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Post by copperx on Jul 3, 2023 0:28:02 GMT -6
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Post by paulcheeba on Jul 3, 2023 1:12:37 GMT -6
Second one down is really good. I think once it’s on a microphone people will make the association.
I would have centralised the BN but I’d give those to a designer with a small budget and see what he can do.
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Post by mics on Jul 3, 2023 1:55:57 GMT -6
I like the second one down too. I think the Bee overstates it a bit but other than that, if the BN are centred and we find a font we like.....
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Post by thehightenor on Jul 3, 2023 1:58:05 GMT -6
About the origin of the phrase “bees’ knees” — I haven’t done the research, but assume that it’s a variation of the British slang “the business”. If you describe something as “It’s the business”, it means exactly the same thing as “It’s the bees’ knees”. the business noun British slang : a very good or impressive person or thing “Since he's won the tournament, he thinks he's the business.” “You should see their new office. It's the business.” I always presumed that's why Ben called his mics that name. They're the bees knees. Wasn't it always a play on words? |
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Post by mics on Jul 3, 2023 3:38:26 GMT -6
Here's roughness at it's best. I have had my graphic designer read the thread too but I don't want him to have free reign just yet as these ideas are gold. I love the reverse colouring of the hex so I'd like to keep that but how about the name written this way (with a cool letter design of course) IMG_1701.HEIC (1.01 MB) |
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Post by ab101 on Jul 3, 2023 10:28:33 GMT -6
Personally, I do not think the bee is necessary. The main theme of the logo in my opinion is to do no harm.
The company name is BeesNeez. (With a capital B and N.) It is the knee of the bee where the pollen is stored and at least to some, is why the phrase bees knees (neez) is so cool. For instance, the knee moves in the Charleston when the phrase was populat. But depicting the bees knee is not a good idea either as frankly it is not all that attractive - unless maybe it is simplified with a bent line.
So, I would avoid the depicting of an entire bee personally. And I would avoid anything that would lead to any more arguments, to maximize the "do no harm" idea of a logo.
The BN is classy in itself. I like the second one as well, but without the bee.
The logo does not need to convey anything other than the logo identification of the manufacturer. It just should not take away from the aesthetic of the beautiful microphone.
My 2 cents.
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Post by lowlou on Jul 3, 2023 11:10:24 GMT -6
A graphic design agency should work on this. A rebranding, maybe ?
good luck
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