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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 10:55:42 GMT -6
@martin I think ST are just not Monterey certified yet , you could go to its website to confirm. Quint you can get applecare for an apple refurb computer but I don’t think private used. Aren’t you just extending the direct support , call/email and the warranty out three years : seemed like a good idea and not costly vide the new m1/soc computers as they were unproven. It is transferable though, so if you find a used apple with applecare, it can be transferred to you by the current owner through apple. Can you elaborate on any of the other questions I had, since you're an Applecare customer? It sounds like you have Applecare+, correct? What is the difference between that and Applecare? Any opinions on the grey market concerns?
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 6, 2022 12:02:31 GMT -6
I don’t know that I know, I think plus is the extended support you pay extra for, the non plus the basic 1 year warranty and 90 day support .
I have never bought grey so can’t really say but if you were buying an established architecture I’d say great but while I think the new m1 soc will be fine, we don’t know so buying refurb from apple directly with full warranties and the option of extending it makes more sense to me .
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Post by plinker on Feb 6, 2022 12:55:43 GMT -6
“We’ve been trying to reach you about your extended Applecare warranty” Buying insurance for something you can afford to replace is throwing money away. The odds are very much against the buyer. Perhaps I am misunderstanding you, but if you can increase the warranty duration by 200% for a cost of roughly a tenth of that: how is that a bad deal? When I say that "the odds are very much against the buyer", I'm looking at this strictly from an insurance/actuarial perspective. Every company, it doesn't matter which one, that provides extended warranties and such are selling insurance. The company has all the data on all the products, both brand new and older models, that they are selling (e.g., % failure, likelihood that a customer will actually make a claim, etc). The company prices the insurance so that they make a profit, which means that, statistically, the average customer is taking a loss on the insurance.
Now, I can't afford to replace my house if it is destroyed, so I have homeowners insurance. I am, statistically, losing money on that deal. However, I can't afford to replace it, and I have a wife and kids, so I can't just go live in a tent.
Also, I can't afford to pay out-of-pocket in case I am dealt the blow of catastrophic illness. So, I have health insurance that covers it. I am, statistically, losing money on that deal too.
I can afford to buy a new Mac Mini should mine die unexpectedly, so I do not have insurance on it. Note, that almost all electronic problems are going to happen in the first 30 days, and the default warranty covers that.
From a non-insurance/actuarial perspective Apple gets two big things from their AppleCare (and related) programs: - Profit: cost is calculated based on large data sets, so they will always clear a certain percentage of profit. They push AppleCare on new purchases for this reason (both in-store, and follow-up emails). They made good money on this.
- More sales: some people want peace of mind when they buy a new product. I totally get that, and so does Apple. AppleCare provides that and, as a result, they sell more goodies.
I'm certainly not against anyone paying for peace-of-mind, or using the included tech support to the fullest -- you might even be coming out ahead if it saves you time and frustration!!!
So, please rock on and I apologize for derailing.
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Post by plinker on Feb 6, 2022 13:00:07 GMT -6
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Post by jacobamerritt on Feb 6, 2022 14:56:15 GMT -6
What's up with Soundtoys Kcat? I use their Echboy Jr. all the time and wouldn't want to lose it. That things just works and takes only seconds to dial in. IIRC I can use my Sountoys stuff on my M1, just not 'certified' yet. I'll have to double check though!
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 15:12:21 GMT -6
That was a good read. Thanks. I'm not too worried about accidental damage on a Mini. I'm also not someone who typically buys extended warranties either. Hmmm. I'm gonna have to think about this, but I'm inclined to not purchase Applecare+ after reading that article. Also, I'm still not clear on what it costs to actually purchase Applecare+? That article talks about the costs of repair, that essentially are like a deductible. However, it doesn't talk about what it would cost to purchase Applecare+ for a Mac Mini or any other Mac. Where can I find that? That info would help with my decision.
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 6, 2022 15:24:36 GMT -6
plinker all good I was just wondering if you had an actual bad experience with apple warranty, not the idea of extended warrenty in general. I normally don’t buy extended warranties but did with my m1 mini due to its new architecture.
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Post by brenta on Feb 6, 2022 15:26:00 GMT -6
“We’ve been trying to reach you about your extended Applecare warranty” Buying insurance for something you can afford to replace is throwing money away. The odds are very much against the buyer. I actually can’t afford to replace a $4k laptop lol. Buying it once was a stretch. I know Apple is making a profit on selling AppleCare but it seemed like a good idea with that kind of investment. It also covers accidental damage, such as drops or spilling a beer on the keyboard, although there are deductibles for that. Its basically a guarantee that the computer is going to work like new for the first three years no matter what. It also raises the resell value of the computer during the coverage period since the warranty is transferrable.
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 15:28:54 GMT -6
I'm also still concerned about buying used, as far as grey market is concerned. I'm not opposed to buying used, but there doesn't seem to be a good way to know if a used Mac was purchased grey market or not.
Given that nothing on these new Macs are user replaceable/repairable, I'd hate to unknowingly buy a used grey market Mac Mini and then find out that no one here in the US is willing to repair it and that I have to ship it to who knows where to get it repaired. The extra cost and time associated with all of that scares me away from buying used unless I have some way of determining that a used Mini is definitely NOT grey market.
Thoughts?
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Post by brenta on Feb 6, 2022 15:50:13 GMT -6
I'm also still concerned about buying used, as far as grey market is concerned. I'm not opposed to buying used, but there doesn't seem to be a good way to know if a used Mac was purchased grey market or not. Given that nothing on these new Macs are user replaceable/repairable, I'd hate to unknowingly buy a used grey market Mac Mini and then find out that no one here in the US is willing to repair it and that I have to ship it to who knows where to get it repaired. The extra cost and time associated with all of that scares me away from buying used unless I have some way of determining that a used Mini is definitely NOT grey market. Thoughts? Buy a used one that has AppleCare+ and have the warranty transferred to you.
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Post by plinker on Feb 6, 2022 15:57:58 GMT -6
That was a good read. Thanks. I'm not too worried about accidental damage on a Mini. I'm also not someone who typically buys extended warranties either. Hmmm. I'm gonna have to think about this, but I'm inclined to not purchase Applecare+ after reading that article. Also, I'm still not clear on what it costs to actually purchase Applecare+? That article talks about the costs of repair, that essentially are like a deductible. However, it doesn't talk about what it would cost to purchase Applecare+ for a Mac Mini or any other Mac. Where can I find that? That info would help with my decision. Yeah, it does seem like a deductible -- weird, huh?!
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Post by brenta on Feb 6, 2022 16:14:37 GMT -6
That was a good read. Thanks. I'm not too worried about accidental damage on a Mini. I'm also not someone who typically buys extended warranties either. Hmmm. I'm gonna have to think about this, but I'm inclined to not purchase Applecare+ after reading that article. Also, I'm still not clear on what it costs to actually purchase Applecare+? That article talks about the costs of repair, that essentially are like a deductible. However, it doesn't talk about what it would cost to purchase Applecare+ for a Mac Mini or any other Mac. Where can I find that? That info would help with my decision. I think AppleCare+ is $99 for a Mac Mini. You can price out any configuration including AppleCare on the Apple website.
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 16:15:56 GMT -6
One other thing. I've seen a lot of back and forth about what would be the best SSD size to get.
I think I've decided that 256gb is too small, so it's down to 512gb or 1tb. What are people recommending at this point? I don't mind spending the money for the 1tb if there is a good reason to do so, but I'd also be good with spending less if there is no good reason to go over 512gb.
I know I've seen talk in this thread about there being reason to oversize the SSD because of the swap files or allowing the SSD to run faster with the extra space or something like that. What is the latest thought on this?
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 6, 2022 16:29:25 GMT -6
What's up with Soundtoys Kcat? I use their Echboy Jr. all the time and wouldn't want to lose it. That things just works and takes only seconds to dial in. IIRC I can use my Sountoys stuff on my M1, just not 'certified' yet. I'll have to double check though! Which os, I think soundtoys is big sur certified only.
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 6, 2022 16:31:28 GMT -6
Am running m1 mini 256, 16 gig ram, zero problems, I reloaded just what I wanted and run external drives .
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 16:38:01 GMT -6
Am running m1 mini 256, 16 gig ram, zero problems, I reloaded just what I wanted and run external drives . Actually, wasn't it maybe you that mentioned something about a larger drive working better/faster for some reason?
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 6, 2022 16:50:25 GMT -6
Think is was mark Williams , it’s theoretically true , I just haven’t noticed any problems but I am aware of not putting too much on the one Drive.
I am also using onyx from time to time and sleep mode to let the Mac do its self cleaning.
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Post by dok on Feb 6, 2022 17:02:25 GMT -6
As someone who has supported Macs in an enterprise environment for over a decade, just get the AppleCare+, especially if you're getting a 1.0 version of the device. Hardware problems and recalls do happen down the line, even with a company with a robust and mature manufacturing process like Apple. It makes these repairs really painless and quick. I've had only one warranty repair with AppleCare on my personal devices in that last decade and no accidental damage, and even so I still think it's a good purchase.
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Post by plinker on Feb 6, 2022 17:07:31 GMT -6
I'm also still concerned about buying used, as far as grey market is concerned. I'm not opposed to buying used, but there doesn't seem to be a good way to know if a used Mac was purchased grey market or not. Given that nothing on these new Macs are user replaceable/repairable, I'd hate to unknowingly buy a used grey market Mac Mini and then find out that no one here in the US is willing to repair it and that I have to ship it to who knows where to get it repaired. The extra cost and time associated with all of that scares me away from buying used unless I have some way of determining that a used Mini is definitely NOT grey market. Thoughts? I bought my daughter's first iPhone from a second-hand broker -- one of the more reputable ones. The first one had a problem and they refunded me. The second one had a problem with bluetooth that we didn't realize until much later. Ultimately, it was not worth the lower cost.
Last Summer I bought my Mac Mini M1 from Apple's refurbished site, and saved about $150. I think I paid $800 for the 16/512 configuration. I'm really happy with it. No problems, and it came with the same warranty as a new one. When Apple says "100% Certified" they mean it. I think they are mostly items that were bought, then returned/exchanged within 30 days due to changes in purchase preferences.
I just looked at the refurbished site, and didn't see any M1 Minis -- all Intel. I recommend the Apple refurbished. Check it frequently, as new stock comes in.
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Post by plinker on Feb 6, 2022 17:18:07 GMT -6
Quint: you asked about SSD configurations. I think 512 is the point of diminishing returns.
Because: - You only really need to have space for System/OS files and Applications to run off the internal drive. 512 will go a long way towards that.
- You can purchase high-speed external storage for much less than internal. It's not as fast as internal storage, but it's so fast that it's really hard to tell the difference. I've been rocking one of these since I bought my M1: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08F1VVBL9/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
That external drive, though not Thunderbolt, is still really fast! For loading audio files and everything else, it's so fast that I don't even think about it. Zip, bang, done!
I'm going to use that external drive until TB drives come down, then go with TB on my M1 Mini.
I hope this helps.
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 17:20:33 GMT -6
I'm also still concerned about buying used, as far as grey market is concerned. I'm not opposed to buying used, but there doesn't seem to be a good way to know if a used Mac was purchased grey market or not. Given that nothing on these new Macs are user replaceable/repairable, I'd hate to unknowingly buy a used grey market Mac Mini and then find out that no one here in the US is willing to repair it and that I have to ship it to who knows where to get it repaired. The extra cost and time associated with all of that scares me away from buying used unless I have some way of determining that a used Mini is definitely NOT grey market. Thoughts? I bought my daughter's first iPhone from a second-hand broker -- one of the more reputable ones. The first one had a problem and they refunded me. The second one had a problem with bluetooth that we didn't realize until much later. Ultimately, it was not worth the lower cost.
Last Summer I bought my Mac Mini M1 from Apple's refurbished site, and saved about $150. I think I paid $800 for the 16/512 configuration. I'm really happy with it. No problems, and it came with the same warranty as a new one. When Apple says "100% Certified" they mean it. I think they are mostly items that were bought, then returned/exchanged within 30 days due to changes in purchase preferences.
I just looked at the refurbished site, and didn't see any M1 Minis -- all Intel. I recommend the Apple refurbished. Check it frequently, as new stock comes in.
Yeah, I like the idea of refurbished, as it is considered as new by Apple, for all intents and purposes, and at a discounted price. I actually saw a pretty great deal on both a used 512gb and a used 1tb Mini on B&H a couple of days ago, but the grey market thing scared me off.
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 17:40:03 GMT -6
Quint: you asked about SSD configurations. I think 512 is the point of diminishing returns.
Because: - You only really need to have space for System/OS files and Applications to run off the internal drive. 512 will go a long way towards that.
- You can purchase high-speed external storage for much less than internal. It's not as fast as internal storage, but it's so fast that it's really hard to tell the difference. I've been rocking one of these since I bought my M1: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08F1VVBL9/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
That external drive, though not Thunderbolt, is still really fast! For loading audio files and everything else, it's so fast that I don't even think about it. Zip, bang, done!
I'm going to use that external drive until TB drives come down, then go with TB on my M1 Mini.
I hope this helps.
Beyond the idea that a bunch of empty space on the OS is beneficial (I don't quite get why that might be or if this is even a legit concern), I also do like the idea of a larger drive to host VI sample libraries internally, as opposed to on external drives. Now, if you've seen the other thread about a slave computer, that I've been recently posting in, you'll see that I've been considering hosting VI sample libraries on my PC and just using a Mac for hosting Luna. However, I suppose I don't mind spending a little more to get a large enough internal SSD to also host sample libraries in addition to the OS, in the hopes that I may actually be able to just host samples and play VIs on the Mac too, instead of doing the slave PC thing I had mentioned before. I've been a little skeptical of the ability of the M1 Mini to do this for me but, if it actually could do so, spending an extra $200 to test that theory might be worth it to me if it means I don't end up even having to mess with the whole slave PC situation at all. It would also save me some money on the other peripherals I was going to have to buy to run a two computer setup. So, based on my comments in this post, would you still recommend a 512gb, or might it be worth going with the 1tb? Fyi, the plan has always been to use external drives for audio recording files, but I really prefer sample libraries to be hosted internally for fastest speeds, regardless of whether I'm doing it on a PC or a Mac. Or maybe I don't understand how this new silicon architecture works and, external sample libraries would work just fine without any latency concerns?
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 6, 2022 17:41:37 GMT -6
go tp apple ands configure the m1 you are interested in , you can pick AppleCare there and see the price. I had both a 256 and 512, didn't notice much difference, you just have to be aware of how much storage capacity you have and manage it.
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Post by Mister Chase on Feb 6, 2022 17:45:51 GMT -6
I'm right at 500gb of my 1tb internal drive on my M1 mini when it comes to essential software and a handful of video projects. It all depends on how "robust" your studio life is, for personal or wide array of clients etc.
If there is really any truth to the possibility of Pro/Max Mini's I would personally wait(I will upgrade if that becomes the case).
The VSTi's Ive used hosted on the internal drive load crazy fast.
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Post by Quint on Feb 6, 2022 18:03:44 GMT -6
I'm right at 500gb of my 1tb internal drive on my M1 mini when it comes to essential software and a handful of video projects. It all depends on how "robust" your studio life is, for personal or wide array of clients etc. If there is really any truth to the possibility of Pro/Max Mini's I would personally wait(I will upgrade if that becomes the case). The VSTi's Ive used hosted on the internal drive load crazy fast. Fast load times are always nice, but VI latency is the most important to me. How are you liking the latency performance of VI sample libraries hosted on the internal SSD? A 1tb internal SSD would definitely provide enough space for the OS and sample libraries. 512gb would provide enough space for all of this too, but with a lot less remaining space leftover. Audio files were always going to be hosted on external drives anyway, so that's not really of any consideration for me, as far as internal storage is concerned. I go back and forth on the M1 Max/Pro thing. I debate about waiting, but I don't know that I will need that kind of processing power and I don't know that I would want to spend that much either. If I end up needing that much power, I still have my PC around for slave duties.
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