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Post by tonycamphd on Apr 27, 2014 12:46:14 GMT -6
just found this on utube, what do ya'll take from this?
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2014 14:09:32 GMT -6
Just listening on a laptop, so I can't make a call...but I was in VK the other day and he said they just sold a absolutely perfect mint U67 for $11,000...And what are original 251's going for now? $18K? Jeesh.
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Post by sll on Apr 27, 2014 14:19:36 GMT -6
My take is it's some great sounding mics placed rather poorly on that guitar.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Apr 27, 2014 15:31:48 GMT -6
I'd take an unmodified 67 in good condition over any 251 for guitar. The price is higher simply because lots fewer 251s were made than U67s.
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Post by tonycamphd on Apr 27, 2014 16:51:36 GMT -6
yeah i agree with sll, i thought you could really hear the quality in both mics, but the placement was mehhh..(especially on the 251), the U67 is undeniable, man those sound amazing, a diy U67 clone is on my to do list, i've already got a TSK k67 and a beeznees k6, i hope it comes close to the real deal. It'd be really cool to check every single value of every single component on say.... cowboycoalminer U67, match the tolerances to a T, and then get the Shann Mann to dial in a k67 or build one from scratch? with the same capacitance/tensioned just right, wonder if it'd be close? something tells me Scott Lieber and Jeff Steiger have both tried this, the question is, did it work?
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Post by littlesicily on Apr 27, 2014 16:56:37 GMT -6
Just listening on a laptop, so I can't make a call...but I was in VK the other day and he said they just sold a absolutely perfect mint U67 for $11,000...And what are original 251's going for now? $18K? Jeesh. Saw a 251 sell for $23k on eBay. Crazy. U67 on acgtr is fabulous. My favorite. I use it more that km54, though that's a nice option for finger picked parts.
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Post by sll on Apr 27, 2014 17:36:10 GMT -6
yeah i agree with sll, i thought you could really hear the quality in both mics, but the placement was mehhh..(especially on the 251), the U67 is undeniable, man those sound amazing, a diy U67 clone is on my to do list, i've already got a TSK k67 and a beeznees k6, i hope it comes close to the real deal. It'd be really cool to check every single value of every single component on say.... cowboycoalminer U67, match the tolerances to a T, and then get the Shann Mann to dial in a k67 or build one from scratch? with the same capacitance/tensioned just right, wonder if it'd be close? something tells me Scott Lieber and Jeff Steiger have both tried this, the question is, did it work? Hey Tony, I've not built a diy 67 yet. Dan Deurloo has though. We were just listening to it last night. It has the Beezneez K67 capsule in it. Sounds killer. Dan also has a 269 he built with a re-skinned original Neumann K67. It's darker sounding than the 67 he built. That could be attributed to a different tube and output transformer. Both are great. I have a pair of DIY U-87's I did with re-skinned 70's Neumann 87 capsules as well as Neumann 1970's output transformers. I tested it out with a real Neumann 1970's U-87 and it held it's own. I think the differences were caused by the grille size and mesh not being exactly like the genuine Neumann? There was a bit of resonance from the head basket that's different on the DIY version. Otherwise, they were pretty much spot on. My conclusion from all of this is Dan and I have some very useable great sounding DIY mics. They are not 100% the same as the originals, but so much better than anything we could buy for the price we paid for the parts. I'm now thinking of doing a 67 now after hearing Dan's last night. DIY is a disease. We need help.
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Post by cowboycoalminer on Apr 27, 2014 19:20:37 GMT -6
U 67 is hard to beat on fiddle too Sal. I like the 67 over the 251 on acoustic in that clip.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Apr 27, 2014 21:09:01 GMT -6
My problem with the AKGs, a 251 really being a C12 dressed up to look like a chrome-head tele 47, is that to me the top always sounds disembodied from the bottom and you can't really eq around it. When it works, it's great but no better than a 67 with some eq.
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Post by littlesicily on Apr 27, 2014 22:07:35 GMT -6
My problem with the AKGs, a 251 really being a C12 dressed up to look like a chrome-head tele 47, is that to me the top always sounds disembodied from the bottom and you can't really eq around it. When it works, it's great but no better than a 67 with some eq. Bob Olhsson, when would you typically reach for the 251 over the 67? In other words, what does the 251 give you that the 67/eq doesn't? I ask b/c I'm considering adding a 251 to my locker.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Apr 28, 2014 8:42:49 GMT -6
They are nice for orchestral recording in a hall and they make impressive photographs. Some pianos, especially Steinways can sound nice with them.
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Post by watchtower on Apr 28, 2014 8:48:01 GMT -6
My problem with the AKGs, a 251 really being a C12 dressed up to look like a chrome-head tele 47, is that to me the top always sounds disembodied from the bottom and you can't really eq around it. When it works, it's great but no better than a 67 with some eq. I hear exactly what you mean about "disembodied" top, and I've heard the same difference between my DiY C12 and DiY U47. However, the C12 really shines on my voice at least.
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Post by Randge on Apr 28, 2014 8:50:45 GMT -6
100% of the time I reach for a ribbon on fiddle. They are almost always thin sounding instruments to begin with, so a Royer 122 high passed properly does it for me. It takes out the nearly 3k harshness that I don't want to hear. If it is a dark instrument, I can always use a moderate eq shelf and open it up.
R
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Post by Randge on Apr 28, 2014 8:54:40 GMT -6
My vote is for the 67 over the 251 in that clip as well. Low mids are more intact.
R
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Post by littlesicily on Apr 28, 2014 10:16:30 GMT -6
...and they make impressive photographs. LOL
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Post by tonycamphd on Apr 28, 2014 10:29:30 GMT -6
they make impressive photographs. lol, geez Mr Olhsson...i have 2 more Tim Campbell CT12 capsules coming, i was planning on building a pair of Elam 251 clones... the good news is, if i don't like it for some reason, i can very easily modify the circuit, and have a nice stereo pair of AKG C12 clones, either way i end up with a pair of one type, and a single of the other. The C12 with all its extension seems a little bright for digital recording IMV, i figured the elam with the slightly neutered top would be perfect? I'm liking my ribbon at the 12th w/over the shoulder C12 in combo a lot on acoustic though.
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Post by littlesicily on Apr 28, 2014 10:41:59 GMT -6
Yeah, the 251 sound for pop is kinda a thing... or I could save a lot of money and get a Manley ref c for pop vocals. I think that;'s the mic of choice for Dr. Luke and Max M.
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 28, 2014 10:45:20 GMT -6
I think that's what David Hodges used on Emerson Harts new record...
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 28, 2014 10:46:24 GMT -6
Or - now that Blackspade isn't selling them anymore - you could try Oliver Archut's Tab 251 thingy...
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 28, 2014 10:47:28 GMT -6
www.tab-funkenwerk.com/id134.htmlLooks like there are several dealers out there. I'm not going to link a particular one (because he decided not to come to RGO), but they street for about $2699
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Post by jcoutu1 on Apr 28, 2014 11:15:13 GMT -6
Yeah, the 251 sound for pop is kinda a thing... or I could save a lot of money and get a Manley ref c for pop vocals. I think that;'s the mic of choice for Dr. Luke and Max M. I've seen some videos of Dr. Luke with a Korby system too.
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Post by littlesicily on Apr 28, 2014 11:17:02 GMT -6
Just found an Dr. Luke / Waves interview with him saying he uses the Ref C on every artist. I remember using one several years ago and it was good... of course a brighter sounding "pop" mic. My mix guy has one and is gonna let me try it out.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Apr 28, 2014 11:26:44 GMT -6
2 minutes or so into this, they jump in the studio with a Korby. Or it at least looks like a Korby to me.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Apr 28, 2014 11:27:07 GMT -6
Or right in the screenshot.
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Post by littlesicily on Apr 28, 2014 11:45:41 GMT -6
Or right in the screenshot. yup, that's a Korby. I had the Kat5 a few years ago and that's when I first met Shannon.
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