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Post by christopher on Jun 4, 2019 11:11:09 GMT -6
Apple used to make the best records too
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Post by m03 on Jun 4, 2019 11:13:42 GMT -6
Apple used to make the best records too I'm a big fan of their core fruit business.
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Post by Guitar on Jun 4, 2019 11:44:46 GMT -6
I really like how they partnered with McDonalds to provide the "Big Mac" which really solidifies their image as an anti-vegetarian brand.
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Post by brenta on Jun 4, 2019 12:17:21 GMT -6
I was imagining that price WITH retina screen... at that point, it’s way too much but possibly a drunken purchase. That’s a hangover that would take me years to recover from.
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Post by sirthought on Jun 4, 2019 12:57:30 GMT -6
The argument of the $6000 guitar being played twice a week is laughable. First, it's likely a collectable which means the price can fluctuate with the collectors market. You might make money with never having played it once. The Mac Pro only depreciates. Second, probably every one on my street has a computer that can achieve music creation on some level. People are creating on their phones. Whereas the person with $6000 guitar is more like I know a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy who owns one. It's really not that common. Yeah we're more hardcore users, but most of us still would pause to spend $6k on a guitar to get the job done.
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Post by svart on Jun 4, 2019 13:01:36 GMT -6
If $18,000 of a top priced Mac is just for RAM, I fail to see how PC's are going to be so much cheaper. Isn't RAM to feed them going to cost the same? Not sure what you mean. 32gb of ddr4 is about 100$, which would make 1.5TB about 4700$ without a bulk discount.
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Post by pope on Jun 4, 2019 13:08:57 GMT -6
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Post by christopher on Jun 4, 2019 13:19:53 GMT -6
Man... you could upload a whole HD into Ram. e:I guess 4k video guys..
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Post by Guitar on Jun 4, 2019 13:22:10 GMT -6
This reminds me of the '90s when computers were really expensive, and an extra few MB of RAM was a few hundred bucks or something.
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Post by christopher on Jun 4, 2019 13:25:15 GMT -6
I already track in 96/32fp, mostly on accident lol. (24bit converters)
But at a certain point do we decide to dare venture beyond 24bit? I mean, is there a point where its like.. why not?
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Post by drbill on Jun 4, 2019 13:53:01 GMT -6
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Post by rowmat on Jun 4, 2019 13:54:50 GMT -6
See if you get any change out of $20K for a fully maxxed out Mac Pro with a 6K monitor... I’m betting you won’t.
I just saw the RAM prices.
Okay make that $30K!
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Post by svart on Jun 4, 2019 13:55:30 GMT -6
This reminds me of the '90s when computers were really expensive, and an extra few MB of RAM was a few hundred bucks or something. Which is kinda funny, because I just installed a new NVMe drive which uses direct PCI lanes instead of SATA, and it's faster than the DRAM I had in my fist computers that ran at 25MHz.. In another 20 years there will be no RAM because it'll be direct storage. It's also funny that in the 80's my parents bought a computer for me to type school work.. I could only type about 3 pages before it ran out of ram and I had to print the pages and clear the memory and type the next 3 pages, etc.. I kept losing my work so they decided to buy more RAM.. And we weren't well off at all, so I remember the argument they had about the price of RAM for this computer.. Going from 56kB to something like 512kB was almost 1000$.. which back then was not only unheard of because home-computers weren't a huge thing, and there was no competition at all. You had one source for the RAM because it was all proprietary. There were no pinout standards like DIMM, SIMM, etc. My mother won the argument and we got the RAM and my dad had to work extra shifts to make up for it, because 1K back in the 80's would be like 3-4K now.
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Post by svart on Jun 4, 2019 14:07:22 GMT -6
Your link doesn't work. Besides, here's some ECC (dear god why would you want to use ECC?) for 110$ per 16GB. yeah it's 2x what I originally quoted, but it's ECC so you gotta spend more to get slower RAM.. www.neweggbusiness.com/product/product.aspx?item=9b-1x5-000k-00261But hey, if you want to spend 18K on RAM alone, then cool. It's your money if you got it to spend. Just don't try to tell me that I'm getting something extra by spending that much, because I'm not.
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Post by drbill on Jun 4, 2019 14:22:18 GMT -6
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Post by lando on Jun 4, 2019 14:29:58 GMT -6
Isn't the point that it has to be in 128 GB chunks to max out the memory since there are 12 memory slots? Hence the bizarre price?
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Post by drbill on Jun 4, 2019 14:32:31 GMT -6
Isn't the point that it has to be in 128 GB chunks to max out the memory since there are 12 memory slots? Hence the bizarre price? maybe you could explain that to svart? obviously most (all) of us don't need that much RAM, but if you are going to bemoan the price of the maxed out apple product, you must judge the compared PC product with the same specs, no?
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Post by svart on Jun 4, 2019 14:33:58 GMT -6
Isn't the point that it has to be in 128 GB chunks to max out the memory since there are 12 memory slots? Hence the bizarre price? I'm not sure it's the point, but nobody really makes 128GB sticks and almost no programs can really page out 1.5TB of ram anyway, so it's almost just a vanity move to buy that much RAM. Using cheaper sticks is the way to go until 128GB sticks come down in price, which they'll surely do in a few years as more machines out there can utilize them. Even servers don't use 128GB sticks because it's hard to deal with that kind of density through DDR ports. It's much faster and more reliable to use smaller sticks in more slots.
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Post by Guitar on Jun 4, 2019 14:35:43 GMT -6
That's also more RAM that can go bad. I wouldn't want to have to troubleshoot that system.
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Post by lando on Jun 4, 2019 14:50:20 GMT -6
Isn't the point that it has to be in 128 GB chunks to max out the memory since there are 12 memory slots? Hence the bizarre price? I'm not sure it's the point, but nobody really makes 128GB sticks and almost no programs can really page out 1.5TB of ram anyway, so it's almost just a vanity move to buy that much RAM. Using cheaper sticks is the way to go until 128GB sticks come down in price, which they'll surely do in a few years as more machines out there can utilize them. Even servers don't use 128GB sticks because it's hard to deal with that kind of density through DDR ports. It's much faster and more reliable to use smaller sticks in more slots. I'm not saying that me (or probably anyone else in the audio world either) needs 1,5 TB memory...but is there a PC that can handle that amount when using 32GB sticks? It would need 48 memory slots. Generally I've found that people argue that Apples prices are crazy high, and they are premium no doubt, but when you add the exact components that they have picked (or similar premium quality) gets much closer to the apple prices, and not 1/10 or 1/4 of the price. I'm by no means an expert though! Regarding Hackintosh: I would never trust a Hackintosh for professional work myself, since so much can go wrong in a simple OS-update (and sometimes the OS needs to be updated). I've read a myriad of horror stories , although I'm sure that many people have working Hackintosh systems aswell.
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Post by svart on Jun 4, 2019 15:00:28 GMT -6
I'm not sure it's the point, but nobody really makes 128GB sticks and almost no programs can really page out 1.5TB of ram anyway, so it's almost just a vanity move to buy that much RAM. Using cheaper sticks is the way to go until 128GB sticks come down in price, which they'll surely do in a few years as more machines out there can utilize them. Even servers don't use 128GB sticks because it's hard to deal with that kind of density through DDR ports. It's much faster and more reliable to use smaller sticks in more slots. I'm not saying that me (or probably anyone else in the audio world either) needs 1,5 TB memory...but is there a PC that can handle that amount when using 32GB sticks? Generally I've found that people argue that Apples prices are crazy high, and they are premium no doubt, but when you add the exact components that they have picked (or similar premium quality) gets much closer to the apple prices, and not 1/10 or 1/4 of the price. I'm by no means an expert though! Regarding Hackintosh: I would never trust a Hackintosh for professional work myself, since so much can go wrong in a simple OS-update (and sometimes the OS needs to be updated). I've read a myriad of horror stories , although I'm sure that many people have working Hackintosh systems aswell. I'd have to look and see if there are any boards that can handle 128GB sticks. There aren't many, simply because it's not useful. I know Bill wants to argue that it wouldn't be apples to apples in terms of specs and he wants to *gotcha* me with semantics, but nothing ever is equal that way. I showed you can get 1.5TB for a lot cheaper which was a direct retort to the "but 1.5TB HAS to cost 18K$" and I showed that it doesn't and that the cost is a result of apple's design choices, not that there aren't other options available to get you there. I don't believe that technical points should or could properly be argued. Only results can be compared properly. I can buy a ferrari to be equal to another ferrari in a race, or I can just supercharge a corvette for a lot cheaper and go the same speed.. So could a lot of folks, but those who buy ferraris do so because they want to show off the name.
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Post by drbill on Jun 4, 2019 16:49:32 GMT -6
I'm not saying that me (or probably anyone else in the audio world either) needs 1,5 TB memory...but is there a PC that can handle that amount when using 32GB sticks? Generally I've found that people argue that Apples prices are crazy high, and they are premium no doubt, but when you add the exact components that they have picked (or similar premium quality) gets much closer to the apple prices, and not 1/10 or 1/4 of the price. I'm by no means an expert though! Regarding Hackintosh: I would never trust a Hackintosh for professional work myself, since so much can go wrong in a simple OS-update (and sometimes the OS needs to be updated). I've read a myriad of horror stories , although I'm sure that many people have working Hackintosh systems aswell. I'd have to look and see if there are any boards that can handle 128GB sticks. There aren't many, simply because it's not useful. I know Bill wants to argue that it wouldn't be apples to apples in terms of specs and he wants to *gotcha* me with semantics, but nothing ever is equal that way. I showed you can get 1.5TB for a lot cheaper which was a direct retort to the "but 1.5TB HAS to cost 18K$" and I showed that it doesn't and that the cost is a result of apple's design choices, not that there aren't other options available to get you there. I don't believe that technical points should or could properly be argued. Only results can be compared properly. I can buy a ferrari to be equal to another ferrari in a race, or I can just supercharge a corvette for a lot cheaper and go the same speed.. So could a lot of folks, but those who buy ferraris do so because they want to show off the name. My point is that if you want to ignore Apple's specs, then it's not an apples to apples (sorry, bad unintended pun) comparison. The point is not whether Apples implementation is smart or cost effective. Just that if you want to slam their ridiculously high price with a PC version, put the same RAM into the PC version. And if you do, it's not going to seem so cheap. To do otherwise makes you come off as disingenuous. And BTW, I never said that 1.5TB of ram had to = $18k.
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Post by jampa on Jun 4, 2019 17:03:44 GMT -6
All I know is I got a Mac Mini and upgraded the RAM to 32GB myself - for half the price of what Apple quoted me for in their store.
It took me 15min to do and I can see how people wouldn't be comfortable pulling brand new machines apart to do it.
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Post by Blackdawg on Jun 4, 2019 17:21:58 GMT -6
All I know is I got a Mac Mini and upgraded the RAM to 32GB myself - for half the price of what Apple quoted me for in their store. It took me 15min to do and I can see how people wouldn't be comfortable pulling brand new machines apart to do it. This is a good point. Likely the best course of action will be to buy as much processor as you can afford. Then buy everything else yourself. Im an Nvidia guy myself so would do RTX cards. Add RAM as you want and HD space as you want. THAT is the beauty of a MODULAR MAC PRO! Thank god its back.
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Post by christopher on Jun 4, 2019 17:37:58 GMT -6
It will be interesting to see how this plays out. The PCIe slots are new and allow for double GPUs edge connectors in one slot. I’m not sure if Nvidia will make use of that. The GPUs they released are supposedly like double 2080ti computing power in one slot, so max out all the slots, it’s insane the amount of computing power. I do expect the waves ai version of CLA shortly ;p
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