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Post by adamjbrass on Mar 29, 2019 6:50:44 GMT -6
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,937
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Post by ericn on Mar 29, 2019 7:03:51 GMT -6
Few know more about loudspeakers than Dave Gunness.
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Post by svart on Mar 29, 2019 7:06:36 GMT -6
A year later I am still extremely happy with my Dynaudio LYD-48s. The move from two-way to three-way has paid big dividends in sorting out the midrange; and the low end on these speakers is deep and tight and seems to translate reliably well. I am recording electric roots music--violin, guitar, bass, piano, drums, percussion--and have not noticed any problems with electric guitars. My guitarist noticed a significant difference (for the better) in monitoring the first time we did a session here, and the speakers are very revealing if there is some flaw in the guitar tone. I have to say this was my best gear purchase in recent months. Same. Svart is looking to spend more than the LYD48s cost but they're some kickass monitors. They're gonna be with me for quite awhile. I'm not necessarily against the LYD48's, but I've tried working on Dynaudio stuff in the past and didn't care for the Dynaudio sound that their earlier monitors had. Of course this is 10+ years ago and I have no idea how they sound now though. I guess I do figure if I'm spending up to 6K on a monitor I'll try to find the last monitor system I'll ever buy.. If I even buy them. I'm not sure I really *need* them to be honest. I just hate that there is only 1 real pro audio store in my area and they sell mainly the same stuff as GC an everything else needs to be "ordered" with prepayment.. I could also spend thousands shipping monitors from elsewhere to listen in my studio and still not be able to decide..
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Post by Quint on Mar 29, 2019 7:17:45 GMT -6
A year later I am still extremely happy with my Dynaudio LYD-48s. The move from two-way to three-way has paid big dividends in sorting out the midrange; and the low end on these speakers is deep and tight and seems to translate reliably well. I am recording electric roots music--violin, guitar, bass, piano, drums, percussion--and have not noticed any problems with electric guitars. My guitarist noticed a significant difference (for the better) in monitoring the first time we did a session here, and the speakers are very revealing if there is some flaw in the guitar tone. I have to say this was my best gear purchase in recent months. Same. Svart is looking to spend more than the LYD48s cost but they're some kickass monitors. They're gonna be with me for quite awhile. You Lyd 48 guys feeling the need for a sub(s)?
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Mar 29, 2019 8:24:43 GMT -6
Same. Svart is looking to spend more than the LYD48s cost but they're some kickass monitors. They're gonna be with me for quite awhile. I'm not necessarily against the LYD48's, but I've tried working on Dynaudio stuff in the past and didn't care for the Dynaudio sound that their earlier monitors had. Of course this is 10+ years ago and I have no idea how they sound now though. I guess I do figure if I'm spending up to 6K on a monitor I'll try to find the last monitor system I'll ever buy.. If I even buy them. I'm not sure I really *need* them to be honest. I just hate that there is only 1 real pro audio store in my area and they sell mainly the same stuff as GC an everything else needs to be "ordered" with prepayment.. I could also spend thousands shipping monitors from elsewhere to listen in my studio and still not be able to decide.. What I don’t get is why the LYD 48 doesn’t have the Dynaudio mid dome! If I’m going 3 way Dyn, I want the dome!!
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Post by mcirish on Mar 29, 2019 9:04:47 GMT -6
Same. Svart is looking to spend more than the LYD48s cost but they're some kickass monitors. They're gonna be with me for quite awhile. You Lyd 48 guys feeling the need for a sub(s)? I have a sub for my LYD48 but I tend to never turn it on unless I'm checking things 40hz and below. Otherwise, the LYD's seem to give me a pretty accurate picture. I especially like the mids. The crossover point stays out of the way where the vocal lives. 490 & 5.6K are the crossover points of the LYD48. The KH310 has crossover points of 650 and 2k. That would seem a little more of an issue to me, but like all things, it really depends on how well they implemented it.
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Post by ragan on Mar 29, 2019 9:17:44 GMT -6
Yeah I’ve never felt the need for a sub. But then I don’t really like mixing with subs in general.
And like mcirish just said, the mids are fantastic on these. They sold me on the LYD48s in less than an hour.
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Post by Quint on Mar 29, 2019 9:24:00 GMT -6
Yeah I’ve never felt the need for a sub. But then I don’t really like mixing with subs in general. And like mcirish just said, the mids are fantastic on these. They sold me on the LYD48s in less than an hour. I'm definitely interested in these. I need to get done with my studio remodeling before I can get into demoing monitors though. I need to bring this topic up with Jeff Hedback.
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rigo
Full Member
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Post by rigo on Mar 30, 2019 12:34:45 GMT -6
I have not felt the need for a sub with the LYD48s. The bass is surprisingly deep and very tight with these monitors. I believe that I am hearing a much more accurate picture of the low end than previously in my small control room; woofiness and boominess in the kick and bass are obvious when present. I'll know a lot more when I go to master the current album but, for now, I am happy with and confident in how the low end is sounding.
It sounds like you are able and intending to spend a lot more money than the Dynaudios cost, so you may find something that will kick the butts of these monitors; but I am finding them a pleasure to work with, both in tracking and mixing.
Good luck with your search...
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Post by svart on Apr 3, 2019 7:57:40 GMT -6
So I'm back to thinking about this. I really like the Neumann KH310D because it's 3 way, has a dome midrange, and has digital input, but some reviews complain about an issue getting guitars sounding right and translating with these. Others say they have no issues at all, but I still keep reading personal accounts with issues with guitars, especially heavy guitars. Multiple people who I don't really know have told me they've had no issues with this, so maybe it was a problem in the past that got fixed, but I've still seen some recent online chatter about problems with guitar translation. I can afford a set of refurbs, which I don't know if I can return or not.. Barefoot MM45 look amazing and the price is good if they're used, but the lack of digital input is a big downer. Also, I want to audition them, but I don't want to borrow them from a retailer just to return them and buy used because I'm not going to pay full retail price.. Focal SM9 or Trio6BE look good to me as well, but again, no digital inputs are a big downer, and again I'm only able to afford used, so tricking a retailer into letting me borrow some to try out and then returning them only to buy used is pretty dishonest and I don't want to do that. I'm just not a big Adam monitors fan. A friend of mine had some and I couldn't stand the planar tweeter sound at all. I have a friend bringing some Barefoot footprints by the studio next week to see how big a difference they are from my JBL's and maybe that will help sway me to upgrade or stay with what I have.. Looking forward to hearing what you think of the Footprints. Sometimes I get the itch to switch from my One15's and these are on my list, alongside the MM45's and ATC SCM20's. Also, the LYD48's seem interesting to me. I hear good things about them. So we shot out the Barefoot footprints last night in the studio. Impressions: Pros: Detailed Full sounding MEME is cool and the NS10 setting does get a similar sound to real NS10's Midrange has a very pronounced area of frequencies that could be very useful to figure out midrange problems (similar to how NS10's accentuate midrange issues) Cons: Sweet spot is about a 6"x6" area at about 4ft away. Missing a bit of definition in the low end. The side subwoofers give a good punchy low end, but there is something (articulation?) missing between them and the midrange. The midrange accentuation fatigues the ear within minutes. MEME NS10 setting does not quite get the shouty attitude of real NS10's. Frequency response and detail were not drastically different to my old JBL LSR4328P setup, just slightly different in the mids. The biggest issue I had was that the sweet spot was extremely small. Even moving your head a small amount collapses the mix by a very, very drastic amount. If you move more than a foot, the sound starts getting very phasey and strange. If you're like me and you have racks of gear to bend over to tweak knobs on, you'll never be able to judge what you're doing and you'll need to move back and forth to the sweet spot to hear anything you do. This makes me really afraid of going to bigger barefoots that use the same ring-radiator type tweeters, which have a notorious penchant for beaming. This was extremely eye opening that I'm so used to using monitors that have waveguides and extremely wide sweet spots that I don't think I can go with something that doesn't have waveguides. Now I'm even more hesitant to "upgrade" because I truly expected something drastically different, even from Barefoot's lowest (but still $$$$) model. I'm afraid of spending 5K and not really getting anything for it.
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Post by dankin on Apr 3, 2019 9:23:24 GMT -6
I have the same impression/issues with the footprints. I can't get in to the laser beam sweet spot, having now been used to the Amphions. The MM45 are my favorite of the barefoots. Still on the bright side though. I don't know how people sit in front of overly bright monitors all day, even at low levels. I guess it comes down to everybody's ears being different, but monitors with edgy mids leave me feeling like my ears where assaulted all day. I'm seriously considering going back to proacs for that reason. I do use Ns10s, but mine are off to the side, and I just use them for a low level reference when I'm about 90% on a mix.
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Post by svart on Apr 3, 2019 9:44:30 GMT -6
I have the same impression/issues with the footprints. I can't get in to the laser beam sweet spot, having now been used to the Amphions. The MM45 are my favorite of the barefoots. Still on the bright side though. I don't know how people sit in front of overly bright monitors all day, even at low levels. I guess it comes down to everybody's ears being different, but monitors with edgy mids leave me feeling like my ears where assaulted all day. I'm seriously considering going back to proacs for that reason. I do use Ns10s, but mine are off to the side, and I just use them for a low level reference when I'm about 90% on a mix. I was thinking about the mm45's, used of course. Do you find they're beam-y like the footprints?
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Post by svart on Apr 4, 2019 11:08:54 GMT -6
I dunno. I found a refurb set of KH310D at Alto for relatively decent prices. Waveguides, domed tweeter and midrange (wide sweet spot), digital input.. Sounds like exactly what I want. Maybe I should just bite the bullet and see what happens.
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Apr 4, 2019 12:09:27 GMT -6
I dunno. I found a refurb set of KH310D at Alto for relatively decent prices. Waveguides, domed tweeter and midrange (wide sweet spot), digital input.. Sounds like exactly what I want. Maybe I should just bite the bullet and see what happens. They are special, not quite an ATC Big PMC or Quested. They don’t play loud enough for some, mids are that Dyn dome or a copy. Waveguide helps in a lot of rooms, with stereo subs mighty impressive.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Apr 5, 2019 6:13:30 GMT -6
Looking forward to hearing what you think of the Footprints. Sometimes I get the itch to switch from my One15's and these are on my list, alongside the MM45's and ATC SCM20's. Also, the LYD48's seem interesting to me. I hear good things about them. So we shot out the Barefoot footprints last night in the studio. Impressions: Pros: Detailed Full sounding MEME is cool and the NS10 setting does get a similar sound to real NS10's Midrange has a very pronounced area of frequencies that could be very useful to figure out midrange problems (similar to how NS10's accentuate midrange issues) Cons: Sweet spot is about a 6"x6" area at about 4ft away. Missing a bit of definition in the low end. The side subwoofers give a good punchy low end, but there is something (articulation?) missing between them and the midrange. The midrange accentuation fatigues the ear within minutes. MEME NS10 setting does not quite get the shouty attitude of real NS10's. Frequency response and detail were not drastically different to my old JBL LSR4328P setup, just slightly different in the mids. The biggest issue I had was that the sweet spot was extremely small. Even moving your head a small amount collapses the mix by a very, very drastic amount. If you move more than a foot, the sound starts getting very phasey and strange. If you're like me and you have racks of gear to bend over to tweak knobs on, you'll never be able to judge what you're doing and you'll need to move back and forth to the sweet spot to hear anything you do. This makes me really afraid of going to bigger barefoots that use the same ring-radiator type tweeters, which have a notorious penchant for beaming. This was extremely eye opening that I'm so used to using monitors that have waveguides and extremely wide sweet spots that I don't think I can go with something that doesn't have waveguides. Now I'm even more hesitant to "upgrade" because I truly expected something drastically different, even from Barefoot's lowest (but still $$$$) model. I'm afraid of spending 5K and not really getting anything for it. Just wondering - did you try the Footprints a bit further away? When I got mine I had the same situation, wound up pulling my desk out further from the front wall to get a bit more distance away from them and it helped out with the tight sweet spot. When I’m at the studio I can’t put them on the meter bridge, they have to be a bit further back. I think it’s funny when I see “studio” pics of these monitors 1.5 feet away from people’s faces 🧐 The Meme thing was cool at first, but I ultimately found it pretty useless in practice, unplugged it and put it back in the box and put my NS-10’s back up for when I need to switch to them. I’m at about 50/50 at this point and get what I need from each speaker. Spacial, dimention, placement, bottom, and reverb/delay tails from the Barefoots. Vocal level, drum punch, mid eq’s all on the 10’s. I’m just so used to them, I can’t quit them! But the Barefoots are a welcome addition and keep me from having to guess.
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Post by svart on Apr 5, 2019 6:33:37 GMT -6
So we shot out the Barefoot footprints last night in the studio. Impressions: Pros: Detailed Full sounding MEME is cool and the NS10 setting does get a similar sound to real NS10's Midrange has a very pronounced area of frequencies that could be very useful to figure out midrange problems (similar to how NS10's accentuate midrange issues) Cons: Sweet spot is about a 6"x6" area at about 4ft away. Missing a bit of definition in the low end. The side subwoofers give a good punchy low end, but there is something (articulation?) missing between them and the midrange. The midrange accentuation fatigues the ear within minutes. MEME NS10 setting does not quite get the shouty attitude of real NS10's. Frequency response and detail were not drastically different to my old JBL LSR4328P setup, just slightly different in the mids. The biggest issue I had was that the sweet spot was extremely small. Even moving your head a small amount collapses the mix by a very, very drastic amount. If you move more than a foot, the sound starts getting very phasey and strange. If you're like me and you have racks of gear to bend over to tweak knobs on, you'll never be able to judge what you're doing and you'll need to move back and forth to the sweet spot to hear anything you do. This makes me really afraid of going to bigger barefoots that use the same ring-radiator type tweeters, which have a notorious penchant for beaming. This was extremely eye opening that I'm so used to using monitors that have waveguides and extremely wide sweet spots that I don't think I can go with something that doesn't have waveguides. Now I'm even more hesitant to "upgrade" because I truly expected something drastically different, even from Barefoot's lowest (but still $$$$) model. I'm afraid of spending 5K and not really getting anything for it. Just wondering - did you try the Footprints a bit further away? When I got mine I had the same situation, wound up pulling my desk out further from the front wall to get a bit more distance away from them and it helped out with the tight sweet spot. When I’m at the studio I can’t put them on the meter bridge, they have to be a bit further back. I think it’s funny when I see “studio” pics of these monitors 1.5 feet away from people’s faces 🧐 The Meme thing was cool at first, but I ultimately found it pretty useless in practice, unplugged it and put it back in the box and put my NS-10’s back up for when I need to switch to them. I’m at about 50/50 at this point and get what I need from each speaker. Spacial, dimention, placement, bottom, and reverb/delay tails from the Barefoots. Vocal level, drum punch, mid eq’s all on the 10’s. I’m just so used to them, I can’t quit them! But the Barefoots are a welcome addition and keep me from having to guess. With my mixer and desk, they were about 3-5ft away depending on whether I was leaning over the mixer or not. I also found that further away made the issue much worse. The sweet spot was much wider the closer I got to the speaker. Leaning over the mixer and putting my ears within about 1.5-2ft, I could move my head around quite a bit more, but of course my mixer and desk make this impossible to do practically. I could see these working OK on a small desk if a person was just mouse/keyboard monitor and completely ITB.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Apr 5, 2019 7:16:29 GMT -6
Man that’s so different than my experience.
I’ve gotta say, I’ve heard 3 different pairs of these monitors in 3 vastly different rooms and the experience was very different every time. The only real constant was the mid forward thing that they have. Which I dig.
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Post by svart on Apr 11, 2019 7:45:05 GMT -6
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 11, 2019 8:23:04 GMT -6
Good, the biggest fans of that mid always remind me it takes a good 24-48 hours of break in to shine so give them some pink noise while at work for a couple of days before you really sit down with them.
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Post by svart on Apr 11, 2019 8:48:22 GMT -6
Good, the biggest fans of that mid always remind me it takes a good 24-48 hours of break in to shine so give them some pink noise while at work for a couple of days before you really sit down with them. Absolutely on the list of things to do with them.
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Post by Johnkenn on Apr 11, 2019 8:48:55 GMT -6
Neighbors will love that
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Post by svart on Apr 11, 2019 9:30:53 GMT -6
I'm thinking the pets will love it more.
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Post by brenta on Apr 11, 2019 12:59:56 GMT -6
I’ve never needed to do it myself, but one trick to reduce the annoyance of blasting sound 24/7 while braking in speakers is to wire one out of polarity and put them face to face, and most of the sound will cancel out.
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Post by svart on Apr 13, 2019 14:29:53 GMT -6
Got the Neumanns today..
First impression was that they weren't terribly different from my JBL monitors..
But I sat down with a mix I did before and started again, and damn if I can't hear all kinds of things that weren't noticable before. Tiny details, frequencies that I never noticed, etc.
But the tonality is similar thankfully.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 13, 2019 19:45:58 GMT -6
Got the Neumanns today.. First impression was that they weren't terribly different from my JBL monitors.. But I sat down with a mix I did before and started again, and damn if I can't hear all kinds of things that weren't noticable before. Tiny details, frequencies that I never noticed, etc. But the tonality is similar thankfully. The little details typically mean your hearing a better speaker, when it’s a complete different sound it’s usually a different voicing. So there’s that.
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