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Post by rocinante on Feb 15, 2018 1:14:58 GMT -6
Jeff,
Will you be selling sectional pieces as well e.g. just the outputs, or just the summing, or just an input, or an 8 input channel section, 16, etc...?
Of course this looks awesome and you should pat your back with beer.
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Post by guitfiddler on Feb 15, 2018 5:47:55 GMT -6
Jeff, Will you be selling sectional pieces as well e.g. just the outputs, or just the summing, or just an input, or an 8 input channel section, 16, etc...? Of course this looks awesome and you should pat your back with beer. I’m drinking a beer for Jeff right now! Lol |
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 15, 2018 19:50:35 GMT -6
For a lot of demos, I don’t run through the vp28s because it’s just another step, real-time bounce that takes time if I need to make small changes (and I’m not getting paid enough lol)...but I just finished the first mix of a song on an EP I’m doing...so I hooked ‘em up and made a bounce with and without...and man, they really do add a heft, punch, glue and detail that you don’t get without going through that last step. I can’t wait to see how the summing mixer will compare...of course this will be over multiple channels compared to just the 2-Bus, so it should be even more goodness. So jsteiger - does the amount of saturation just depend on how hard you’re going in? I guess you could have a rack of VP28s or Heiders going IN to the summing mixer too, huh? |
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Post by Quint on Feb 15, 2018 20:03:18 GMT -6
For a lot of demos, I don’t run through the vp28s because it’s just another step, real-time bounce that takes time if I need to make small changes (and I’m not getting paid enough lol)...but I just finished the first mix of a song on an EP I’m doing...so I hooked ‘em up and made a bounce with and without...and man, they really do add a heft, punch, glue and detail that you don’t get without going through that last step. I can’t wait to see how the summing mixer will compare...of course this will be over multiple channels compared to just the 2-Bus, so it should be even more goodness. So jsteiger - does the amount of saturation just depend on how hard you’re going in? I guess you could have a rack of VP28s or Heiders going IN to the summing mixer too, huh? I guess I would have a couple of questions along those same lines for Jeff. I'm guessing that this unit does NOT use passive summing with makeup gain? There looks to be active electronics on every input card and then active tranny electronics on the four output busses (L+R A and L+R B). If all of that is correct, what might the resulting difference in sound be between the CAPI summing mixer and doing something like running 16 DA output channels through 16 individual VP26s/VP28s into a passive summing mixer and then using a pair of VP28s for makeup gain? I realize that it will obviously sound "different". I'm just curious how much "different" it will sound and how different the circuit flow might essentially be? |
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Post by Blackdawg on Feb 16, 2018 15:30:13 GMT -6
For a lot of demos, I don’t run through the vp28s because it’s just another step, real-time bounce that takes time if I need to make small changes (and I’m not getting paid enough lol)...but I just finished the first mix of a song on an EP I’m doing...so I hooked ‘em up and made a bounce with and without...and man, they really do add a heft, punch, glue and detail that you don’t get without going through that last step. I can’t wait to see how the summing mixer will compare...of course this will be over multiple channels compared to just the 2-Bus, so it should be even more goodness. So jsteiger - does the amount of saturation just depend on how hard you’re going in? I guess you could have a rack of VP28s or Heiders going IN to the summing mixer too, huh? I guess I would have a couple of questions along those same lines for Jeff. I'm guessing that this unit does NOT use passive summing with makeup gain? There looks to be active electronics on every input card and then active tranny electronics on the four output busses (L+R A and L+R B). If all of that is correct, what might the resulting difference in sound be between the CAPI summing mixer and doing something like running 16 DA output channels through 16 individual VP26s/VP28s into a passive summing mixer and then using a pair of VP28s for makeup gain? I realize that it will obviously sound "different". I'm just curious how much "different" it will sound and how different the circuit flow might essentially be? I bet that would be sweet! I know I am hoping to have a bunch of ML2s in TAC 500 chassis that also have insert points. This way i have basically a full API fader channel and can add all other outboard effects via the inserts. Then the main output of the ML2s feed the CAPI summing mixer. Seems like the most compact and affordable(plus major fun of soldering!) way to have your own 2-32ch analog mixer. That's my longer term plan and goal for my mixing setup. |
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Post by matt@IAA on Feb 16, 2018 20:29:47 GMT -6
For a lot of demos, I don’t run through the vp28s because it’s just another step, real-time bounce that takes time if I need to make small changes (and I’m not getting paid enough lol)...but I just finished the first mix of a song on an EP I’m doing...so I hooked ‘em up and made a bounce with and without...and man, they really do add a heft, punch, glue and detail that you don’t get without going through that last step. I can’t wait to see how the summing mixer will compare...of course this will be over multiple channels compared to just the 2-Bus, so it should be even more goodness. So jsteiger - does the amount of saturation just depend on how hard you’re going in? I guess you could have a rack of VP28s or Heiders going IN to the summing mixer too, huh? I guess I would have a couple of questions along those same lines for Jeff. I'm guessing that this unit does NOT use passive summing with makeup gain? There looks to be active electronics on every input card and then active tranny electronics on the four output busses (L+R A and L+R B). If all of that is correct, what might the resulting difference in sound be between the CAPI summing mixer and doing something like running 16 DA output channels through 16 individual VP26s/VP28s into a passive summing mixer and then using a pair of VP28s for makeup gain? I realize that it will obviously sound "different". I'm just curious how much "different" it will sound and how different the circuit flow might essentially be? I don’t know how this product works but my guess is it’s a 2520 doing active combining amplifier duty. |
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Post by forgotteng on Feb 17, 2018 9:17:51 GMT -6
I can't wait to see this come to market. I use my VP28's on every mix.
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Post by rocinante on Feb 18, 2018 0:13:19 GMT -6
Running each channel through a vp28 is going to sound thicker albeit it might be noisier (please correct me if I'm wrong Jeff). Im not sure it was designed for it but I am certain that with a little modification it could be done.
Every card looks like it has an amp circuit for each of their duties.
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Post by rocinante on Feb 18, 2018 0:14:45 GMT -6
This uses Jeff's ACA summing so no need for the stereo vp28s to sum through.
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Post by bartacusad on Feb 18, 2018 8:42:45 GMT -6
Jeff, Will you be selling sectional pieces as well e.g. just the outputs, or just the summing, or just an input, or an 8 input channel section, 16, etc...? Of course this looks awesome and you should pat your back with beer. From the discussions I’ve had with him the smallest version of the summing mixer will be an 8x2. |
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Post by bartacusad on Feb 18, 2018 8:49:53 GMT -6
For a lot of demos, I don’t run through the vp28s because it’s just another step, real-time bounce that takes time if I need to make small changes (and I’m not getting paid enough lol)...but I just finished the first mix of a song on an EP I’m doing...so I hooked ‘em up and made a bounce with and without...and man, they really do add a heft, punch, glue and detail that you don’t get without going through that last step. I can’t wait to see how the summing mixer will compare...of course this will be over multiple channels compared to just the 2-Bus, so it should be even more goodness. So jsteiger - does the amount of saturation just depend on how hard you’re going in? I guess you could have a rack of VP28s or Heiders going IN to the summing mixer too, huh? I guess I would have a couple of questions along those same lines for Jeff. I'm guessing that this unit does NOT use passive summing with makeup gain? There looks to be active electronics on every input card and then active tranny electronics on the four output busses (L+R A and L+R B). If all of that is correct, what might the resulting difference in sound be between the CAPI summing mixer and doing something like running 16 DA output channels through 16 individual VP26s/VP28s into a passive summing mixer and then using a pair of VP28s for makeup gain? I realize that it will obviously sound "different". I'm just curious how much "different" it will sound and how different the circuit flow might essentially be? If you have 16 VP28’s then I say give it a try. Otherwise, the SumBus will be extremely more cost efficient. There is nothing like this on the market and I can tell you firsthand it blows away eveything I’ve tried. (Inward Connections Mix 690, Burl Vancouver, all versions of Dangerous). |
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 18, 2018 9:28:30 GMT -6
I guess I would have a couple of questions along those same lines for Jeff. I'm guessing that this unit does NOT use passive summing with makeup gain? There looks to be active electronics on every input card and then active tranny electronics on the four output busses (L+R A and L+R B). If all of that is correct, what might the resulting difference in sound be between the CAPI summing mixer and doing something like running 16 DA output channels through 16 individual VP26s/VP28s into a passive summing mixer and then using a pair of VP28s for makeup gain? I realize that it will obviously sound "different". I'm just curious how much "different" it will sound and how different the circuit flow might essentially be? If you have 16 VP28’s then I say give it a try. Otherwise, the SumBus will be extremely more cost efficient. There is nothing like this on the market and I can tell you firsthand it blows away eveything I’ve tried. (Inward Connections Mix 690, Burl Vancouver, all versions of Dangerous). I’m a little jelly you’ve gotten to play with it.  Damnit jsteiger when can I pick one up? |
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Post by matt on Feb 18, 2018 9:32:28 GMT -6
looking to get away from the Sigma 2.5 or so years ago. . . . .[the] box with the 2622 input channels was hands down the unanimous choice Did it beat the Sigma? The only thing I might really miss is MIDI control of channel level; I've recently added it to my mix template and it's very cool. |
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Post by bartacusad on Feb 18, 2018 12:15:57 GMT -6
looking to get away from the Sigma 2.5 or so years ago. . . . .[the] box with the 2622 input channels was hands down the unanimous choice Did it beat the Sigma? The only thing I might really miss is MIDI control of channel level; I've recently added it to my mix template and it's very cool. Level control is what the DAWtomation is for 👍🏻 |
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Post by matt@IAA on Feb 18, 2018 13:52:39 GMT -6
For a lot of demos, I don’t run through the vp28s because it’s just another step, real-time bounce that takes time if I need to make small changes (and I’m not getting paid enough lol)...but I just finished the first mix of a song on an EP I’m doing...so I hooked ‘em up and made a bounce with and without...and man, they really do add a heft, punch, glue and detail that you don’t get without going through that last step. I can’t wait to see how the summing mixer will compare...of course this will be over multiple channels compared to just the 2-Bus, so it should be even more goodness. So jsteiger - does the amount of saturation just depend on how hard you’re going in? I guess you could have a rack of VP28s or Heiders going IN to the summing mixer too, huh? I guess I would have a couple of questions along those same lines for Jeff. I'm guessing that this unit does NOT use passive summing with makeup gain? There looks to be active electronics on every input card and then active tranny electronics on the four output busses (L+R A and L+R B). If all of that is correct, what might the resulting difference in sound be between the CAPI summing mixer and doing something like running 16 DA output channels through 16 individual VP26s/VP28s into a passive summing mixer and then using a pair of VP28s for makeup gain? I realize that it will obviously sound "different". I'm just curious how much "different" it will sound and how different the circuit flow might essentially be? Also... as you switch channels on and off of a passive summing mixer the bus impedance changes, so the gain staging of the makeup amplifier changes too. ACA has gain based on the bus resistors and the feedback resistor so it’s going to sum and output based on what you put into it in an automatic way. A hot signal coming in gets added without really changing the summing stage’s amplification, while a passive with makeup getting a hot signal wont get as much makeup gain added. If that makes sense. |
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Post by rocinante on Feb 19, 2018 12:32:51 GMT -6
Jeff, Will you be selling sectional pieces as well e.g. just the outputs, or just the summing, or just an input, or an 8 input channel section, 16, etc...? Of course this looks awesome and you should pat your back with beer. From the discussions I’ve had with him the smallest version of the summing mixer will be an 8x2. Well i hope he might do just sections like aca stuff he has. Like just the output. Or just the input. Or just the channel card. You know stuff to mod stuff with. |
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Post by kilroyrock on Feb 19, 2018 22:16:08 GMT -6
I'm curious what the ballpark on something like this is with the DIY aspect? 500? 1500?
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Post by jsteiger on Feb 19, 2018 22:24:24 GMT -6
This is only preliminary but a complete 32x4 SumBus kit will be around $115 per channel. When you go down in input channel count, the cost per channel does go up since the carcass and related is required.
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Post by guitfiddler on Feb 21, 2018 12:37:18 GMT -6
More pics and info please...LOL
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Post by Blackdawg on Feb 21, 2018 18:11:52 GMT -6
This is only preliminary but a complete 32x4 SumBus kit will be around $115 per channel. When you go down in input channel count, the cost per channel does go up since the carcass and related is required. That's not too bad. Can you mix and match the channels? Like the single stereo channels you have with pan control with the dual stereo channels? |
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Post by jsteiger on Feb 21, 2018 18:21:42 GMT -6
This is only preliminary but a complete 32x4 SumBus kit will be around $115 per channel. When you go down in input channel count, the cost per channel does go up since the carcass and related is required. That's not too bad. Can you mix and match the channels? Like the single stereo channels you have with pan control with the dual stereo channels? As of now...no. It would require additional faceplate skins and a new rear input panel. Everything else would work fine internally. If there is enough demand I will but believe me, this has already been an undertaking of massive proportions as it is. |
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Post by noah shain on Feb 21, 2018 22:57:38 GMT -6
That's not too bad. Can you mix and match the channels? Like the single stereo channels you have with pan control with the dual stereo channels? As of now...no. It would require additional faceplate skins and a new rear input panel. Everything else would work fine internally. If there is enough demand I will but believe me, this has already been an undertaking of massive proportions as it is. Will they be scalable Jeff? Start with 16 and add as you want, say? |
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Post by c0rtland on Feb 22, 2018 0:07:18 GMT -6
That's not too bad. Can you mix and match the channels? Like the single stereo channels you have with pan control with the dual stereo channels? As of now...no. It would require additional faceplate skins and a new rear input panel. Everything else would work fine internally. If there is enough demand I will but believe me, this has already been an undertaking of massive proportions as it is. And we appreciate it! |
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Post by jsteiger on Feb 22, 2018 0:49:57 GMT -6
As of now...no. It would require additional faceplate skins and a new rear input panel. Everything else would work fine internally. If there is enough demand I will but believe me, this has already been an undertaking of massive proportions as it is. Will they be scalable Jeff? Start with 16 and add as you want, say? Yeah man. With the SBT1 single channels (rotary level control) the smallest is 8x2 up to 16x4 in 8 channel increments. With the SBT2 dual channels (pushbutton switches only) the smallest is 8x2 up to 32x4 in 8 channel increments. |
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Post by guitfiddler on Feb 22, 2018 6:13:36 GMT -6
What are silver dots?
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Damnit 
