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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 9, 2022 6:50:56 GMT -6
The pricing STILL offers a good value following recent options. In the last release cycle, I bought my 16" MBP with with an M1 Pro, 16 GB memory, and 1 TB drive. I can get a Studio with an M1 Max, 32 GB memory and 1 TB drive for $400 LESS than the MBP...money that could buy a very nice desktop display if needed. More I/O options as well. Or spend the $400 and get a 2 TB drive. So for the same price as my MBP I'd be getting basically double of everything. Not quite need monitor, keyboard and mouse/trackpad? Sure lots of peeps have spares, but your performance comparison certainly makes sense!
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Post by enlav on Mar 9, 2022 7:54:17 GMT -6
So for those of us that picked up an M1 Mac Mini recently, the Apple page states your trade-in value is "up to $600" with an option of putting in your serial to check the exact (or nearly exact) amount.
Sort of wished I had waited on my purchase in hindsight, but that's always a gamble with Apple. I also can't discredit that this mini has been a beast for most of my purposes. May just wait and see if anything I get down the road ends up pushing it a little two hard (Abbey Road Two, undetermined horn pack).
Not quite need monitor, keyboard and mouse/trackpad? Sure lots of peeps have spares, but your performance comparison certainly makes sense! Don't tell me I'm on the only person using a Dell keyboard on with their mac?
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Post by the other mark williams on Mar 9, 2022 11:10:39 GMT -6
AES members can buy Apple products at a discount, FYI. The issue is something is up with the portal to pay for a membership... I had no idea about this, Tony. Do you happen to know what the discount looks like? Is it available to Associate Members, or only to (full) Members?
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Post by matt on Mar 9, 2022 11:54:03 GMT -6
I paid almost $4k for my trashcan in 2017. Looks like the new Studio would run rings around it. Same here, back in 2014- and mine was a refurb. It's been a solid performer and I've gotten used to the reality that it has a lot of TBolt peripherals hanging off it (drives, interfaces, 4K monitor). So for me, a Mac Studio would just drop in place. The only caveat is that I need to make sure everything runs native on M1 architecture. Time to look into it.
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Post by Blackdawg on Mar 9, 2022 12:32:04 GMT -6
I understand why you would say that, but I swear I've seen more than one place talking about how the M2 name might be misleading and that they are actually slower chips aimed at a crowd that doesn't need high performance. Edit: medium.com/macoclock/is-waiting-for-the-m2-worth-it-c426a343286dSo it might be a bit of both. At least according to this article, the M2 might be faster than the base M1, but still slower than the M1 Pro. The Pro and Max aren't the same as just the M1. The M2 chips will follow suite. The Studio IS the Mini Pro people were anticipating. But I bet we will see a M1 Pro option in the Mini eventually. Still, if the M2 chip is increasing the core count from 8 to 10, that will be a sweet audio machine. Just will it have multi-display support and some other quirks that the Mini seemed to bypass. yes it is. It is literally the same just has more cores. That's it. Same clock speeds, same single core performance. Thus why for audio, the M1 mini is still the best deal at the moment. You do not need all the cores for audio processing or GPUs. The pro would maybe be worth it to get more years out of the system, but the Max and Ultra...hell no. You're wasting your money.
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Post by drumsound on Mar 9, 2022 12:58:05 GMT -6
AES members can buy Apple products at a discount, FYI. The issue is something is up with the portal to pay for a membership... I had no idea about this, Tony. Do you happen to know what the discount looks like? Is it available to Associate Members, or only to (full) Members? I don't yet. I just signed up. Their site is kinda funky. I was told even associate members should get the discount, but when I hit the discount link in the member portal, it tells me to make a new login. The site is a freaking feedback loop on some links and it's driving me nuts. My good friend is the St Louis chapter president and he's looking into me being upgraded to full member. I'm told the discount is very good...
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Post by svart on Mar 9, 2022 13:20:15 GMT -6
You know the prices are bad when the guys used to paying 2x-4x what a comparable PC costs are complaining about them.
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Post by donr on Mar 9, 2022 14:17:37 GMT -6
You know the prices are bad when the guys used to paying 2x-4x what a comparable PC costs are complaining about them. I've been paying around $4k each for cutting edge Macs since the Powerbook 180. With inflation, they've gotten significantly cheaper over time. The modest M1's seem like a super value for DAW use considering the power. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerBook_180
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Post by sirthought on Mar 9, 2022 14:42:08 GMT -6
The Pro and Max aren't the same as just the M1. The M2 chips will follow suite. The Studio IS the Mini Pro people were anticipating. But I bet we will see a M1 Pro option in the Mini eventually. Still, if the M2 chip is increasing the core count from 8 to 10, that will be a sweet audio machine. Just will it have multi-display support and some other quirks that the Mini seemed to bypass. yes it is. It is literally the same just has more cores. That's it. Same clock speeds, same single core performance. Thus why for audio, the M1 mini is still the best deal at the moment. You do not need all the cores for audio processing or GPUs. The pro would maybe be worth it to get more years out of the system, but the Max and Ultra...hell no. You're wasting your money. No it isn't. Single core speed isn't the sole computational need for a computer, even if you are doing just audio, which I am not. I do more graphic design work than audio, although audio is my passion. I've been fine with the M1 Pro and agree that audio production work doesn't get as much of a boost with the Max and Ultra. But we don't know how DAW development will change with this new silicon world. Comparing dollars for the feature performance is exactly the right analysis at this time. This is a worthwhile upgrade for studio owners. (And I still think a Mini can work well for most home studios.) And I'm not going to Windows anytime soon, so those comments from others are really moot.
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Post by sirthought on Mar 9, 2022 14:44:14 GMT -6
The pricing STILL offers a good value following recent options. In the last release cycle, I bought my 16" MBP with with an M1 Pro, 16 GB memory, and 1 TB drive. I can get a Studio with an M1 Max, 32 GB memory and 1 TB drive for $400 LESS than the MBP...money that could buy a very nice desktop display if needed. More I/O options as well. Or spend the $400 and get a 2 TB drive. So for the same price as my MBP I'd be getting basically double of everything. Not quite need monitor, keyboard and mouse/trackpad? Sure lots of peeps have spares, but your performance comparison certainly makes sense! I guess you didn't read my paragraph about using the $400 for just those items?
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Post by sirthought on Mar 9, 2022 14:47:31 GMT -6
The pricing STILL offers a good value following recent options. In the last release cycle, I bought my 16" MBP with with an M1 Pro, 16 GB memory, and 1 TB drive. I can get a Studio with an M1 Max, 32 GB memory and 1 TB drive for $400 LESS than the MBP...money that could buy a very nice desktop display if needed. More I/O options as well. Or spend the $400 and get a 2 TB drive. So for the same price as my MBP I'd be getting basically double of everything. People act like a good i9-12900 build with 128 gb ram is going to be much cheaper. The only thing Apple is charging a ton for is the SSD, the lack of single core performance, and everything is probably soldered in. A Windows desktop with a couple of M2s clearly wins the storage battle. If you must have a Mac for itb work where everything has not been frontloaded with hardware, this is the one to get. The m1 mini just can’t handle 88.2/96 khz (necessary to anti-alias automation) sessions loaded with modern plugs unless you’re freezing a lot of things. If you’re hitting like 80-90 % cpu, something is going to make it freeze up/stutter/grind to halt. I agree that Studio is the one to get, IMO. But your posts about the M1 hitting that kind of wall just doesn't ring true with people I know using them with serious loads.
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 9, 2022 17:24:46 GMT -6
sirthought $400 doesn’t buy a new monitor , magic keyboard and trackpad and or new external drive., but, it does get you well on the way!
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 9, 2022 17:26:47 GMT -6
I have had zero problems with my m1, personally, I think now will be a good time to scoop a good used one
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Post by seawell on Mar 9, 2022 17:52:07 GMT -6
I have had zero problems with my m1, personally, I think now will be a good time to scoop a good used one How is the plug in situation for M1? Any that you had to leave behind that aren't compatible?
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Post by recordingengineer on Mar 9, 2022 18:33:58 GMT -6
I’d like to know that too seawell. I’m in major need of a new Mac, as I’m still on a late 2013 iMac! I only use it to edit and to do quick ITB mixes at home when budget doesn’t justify studio costs. I was looking a month ago, but no iMac or Mini offered 32GB of RAM.
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 9, 2022 19:04:42 GMT -6
Peeps can check Production Experts had a searchable database. I am I’m Monterey now, was in big sur, only left Soundtoys behind.
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 9, 2022 19:06:59 GMT -6
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Post by sirthought on Mar 9, 2022 19:31:38 GMT -6
Most of my plugins are native, but most of the companies using iLok were waiting for Pace to update their development kit. This just happened, so we'll like see the stragglers come in soon.
Native UAD (or most of them), Waves, Arturia, Valhalla, Acon, Ceremony, Fabfilter, Kazrog, Liquidsonics, Toneprojects
Native in beta testing Soundtoys, Goodhertz,
Not native but run under rosetta Sonnex, iZotope,
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Post by wiz on Mar 9, 2022 19:35:55 GMT -6
I am only waiting on a couple.... Ozone... and I think Sound ID.....
I am interested to see if I notice any performance difference once not running under Rosetta (Logic Pro X)
cheers
Wiz
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Post by klangfarben on Mar 9, 2022 19:36:43 GMT -6
The pricing STILL offers a good value following recent options. In the last release cycle, I bought my 16" MBP with with an M1 Pro, 16 GB memory, and 1 TB drive. I can get a Studio with an M1 Max, 32 GB memory and 1 TB drive for $400 LESS than the MBP...money that could buy a very nice desktop display if needed. More I/O options as well. Or spend the $400 and get a 2 TB drive. So for the same price as my MBP I'd be getting basically double of everything. People act like a good i9-12900 build with 128 gb ram is going to be much cheaper. The only thing Apple is charging a ton for is the SSD, the lack of single core performance, and everything is probably soldered in. A Windows desktop with a couple of M2s clearly wins the storage battle. They are charging $800 for an extra 64GB of RAM. Not only is that charging a ton (and then some), it should actually be criminal.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Mar 9, 2022 20:13:11 GMT -6
People act like a good i9-12900 build with 128 gb ram is going to be much cheaper. The only thing Apple is charging a ton for is the SSD, the lack of single core performance, and everything is probably soldered in. A Windows desktop with a couple of M2s clearly wins the storage battle. They are charging $800 for an extra 64GB of RAM. Not only is that charging a ton (and then some), it should actually be criminal. Buying memory from Apple has always meant either; 1. I was in a total hurry. 2. Your last name is Bezos. 3. Stupidly 4 insanity 5 way way way to many drugs ( I really want to get to this point and I personally spent over 20 years with at least a single 100MH Fentanyl patch. I always bought macs with minimal memory got rid of it and started buying the biggest fastest that were supported from OWC. Hell Even Sony and Universal wouldn’t pay Apple memory prices.
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Post by klangfarben on Mar 9, 2022 21:20:52 GMT -6
They are charging $800 for an extra 64GB of RAM. Not only is that charging a ton (and then some), it should actually be criminal. Buying memory from Apple has always meant either; 1. I was in a total hurry. 2. Your last name is Bezos. 3. Stupidly 4 insanity 5 way way way to many drugs ( I really want to get to this point and I personally spent over 20 years with at least a single 100MH Fentanyl patch. I always bought macs with minimal memory got rid of it and started buying the biggest fastest that were supported from OWC. Hell Even Sony and Universal wouldn’t pay Apple memory prices. All true. However, because this is a SoC as all new macs with ARM processors are, there is no user-installable memory. Whatever memory you buy it with is the max amount of RAM it is going to have. So unlike in the past, if you need a lot of memory the only option is the fentanyl patch.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Mar 9, 2022 21:34:59 GMT -6
Buying memory from Apple has always meant either; 1. I was in a total hurry. 2. Your last name is Bezos. 3. Stupidly 4 insanity 5 way way way to many drugs ( I really want to get to this point and I personally spent over 20 years with at least a single 100MH Fentanyl patch. I always bought macs with minimal memory got rid of it and started buying the biggest fastest that were supported from OWC. Hell Even Sony and Universal wouldn’t pay Apple memory prices. All true. However, because this is a SoC as all new macs with ARM processors are, there is no user-installable memory. Whatever memory you buy it with is the max amount of RAM it is going to have. So unlike in the past, if you need a lot of memory the only option is the fentanyl patch. Yeah I was holding out hope that they would find a work around, But hey I took a Gummy 😎 it’s not Fentanyl, but better than nothing.
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Post by Bat Lanyard on Mar 9, 2022 21:44:34 GMT -6
Thought the Mac Studio and the monitor were the standouts and thought it was a better sign that they're putting out a monitor that's not $5K. $1599 isn't cheap, but knock on wood, the two Thunderbolt Displays I've had for almost ten years (one used) are still kicking strong.
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Post by the other mark williams on Mar 9, 2022 22:43:33 GMT -6
Not native but run under rosetta Sonnex, iZotope, RX9 went native this week. Ozone should be soon…
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