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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 7, 2018 11:02:04 GMT -6
pretty cool, thanks drsax. How do you do your multiple headphone setup? I only need one or two at a time, but I'd like to know what other people do. I'll probably need something else eventually. Maybe a headphone amp?
I had a Burl A-D here one week and liked it a lot. With all the clones and "style" of preamps and mics becoming available, I sure wish someone would make a $600 A/D -D/A that rivals a Burl.
My Stam SA73 really has a great real deal Neve type sound, so it can be done. Perhaps converters are more difficult to do at lower price points.
I briefly heard the BLA clock, and it was a definite spacial improvement, giving a much better stereo image.
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Post by drsax on Feb 7, 2018 11:15:13 GMT -6
pretty cool, thanks drsax. How do you do your multiple headphone setup? I only need one or two at a time, but I'd like to know what other people do. I'll probably need something else eventually. Maybe a headphone amp? I had a Burl A-D here one week and liked it a lot. With all the clones and "style" of preamps and mics becoming available, I sure wish someone would make a $600 A/D -D/A that rivals a Burl. My Stam SA73 really has a great real deal Neve type sound, so it can be done. Perhaps converters are more difficult to do at lower price points. I briefly heard the BLA clock, and it was a definite spacial improvement, giving a much better stereo image. If I need one or two headphone mixes I can run right from the Apollo headphone outs, and if I need more, I have my Apollo hooked up to a Furman headphone system - stereo mix plus four seperate sends. Or I can also go out of my Apollo 16’s from the 4 UA Console cues if needed. I got my Burl used for 1600. It’s well worth it and has a nice clock in it. The Burl clock is an improvement over the Apollo. You may not need the BLA. I clock my whole system from The Burl and it sounds great. It clocks everything - itself plus Lynx Hilo, Apollo 8, 2 Apollo 16’s, an Apollo twin and my Bricasti Reverb which is connected digitally. I tested all my units as Master clock. The Burl and Lynx both sounded great. I preferred the Burl the most of them all
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 7, 2018 14:05:52 GMT -6
Very helpful drsax, thanks!
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Post by BenjaminAshlin on Feb 7, 2018 14:12:45 GMT -6
Hmm, now you guys have me thinking maybe a Symphony's not such a great idea. I'd love to do the BLA mod with a Micro Clock, just can't afford those kinds of things right now. I've been told it can surpass the Symphony with the right mods. I'd love to hear it for myself at my place. Just to be clear I was talking about the last generation Apogee with firewire. Apparently they now write there own drivers and don't rely on Apples core audio. I would actually like to know what the Symphony mk1 runs like on USB? On the Apollo Twins lack of digital out. I completely agree.
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Post by guitfiddler on Feb 7, 2018 14:51:34 GMT -6
pretty cool, thanks drsax. How do you do your multiple headphone setup? I only need one or two at a time, but I'd like to know what other people do. I'll probably need something else eventually. Maybe a headphone amp? I had a Burl A-D here one week and liked it a lot. With all the clones and "style" of preamps and mics becoming available, I sure wish someone would make a $600 A/D -D/A that rivals a Burl. My Stam SA73 really has a great real deal Neve type sound, so it can be done. Perhaps converters are more difficult to do at lower price points. I briefly heard the BLA clock, and it was a definite spacial improvement, giving a much better stereo image. If I need one or two headphone mixes I can run right from the Apollo headphone outs, and if I need more, I have my Apollo hooked up to a Furman headphone system - stereo mix plus four seperate sends. Or I can also go out of my Apollo 16’s from the 4 UA Console cues if needed. I got my Burl used for 1600. It’s well worth it and has a nice clock in it. The Burl clock is an improvement over the Apollo. You may not need the BLA. I clock my whole system from The Burl and it sounds great. It clocks everything - itself plus Lynx Hilo, Apollo 8, 2 Apollo 16’s, an Apollo twin and my Bricasti Reverb which is connected digitally. I tested all my units as Master clock. The Burl and Lynx both sounded great. I preferred the Burl the most of them all Curious on the Bricasti hooked up digitally? I still have mine patched through analog then being converted on my converters. Sounds way better than any plugin, but just curious as to how it sounds going in digital vs. analog? Did you do comparisons? Almost ready to make a move on the Burl after hearing it on many sources, I think that is the direction I want to go in.
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Post by drsax on Feb 8, 2018 0:17:55 GMT -6
If I need one or two headphone mixes I can run right from the Apollo headphone outs, and if I need more, I have my Apollo hooked up to a Furman headphone system - stereo mix plus four seperate sends. Or I can also go out of my Apollo 16’s from the 4 UA Console cues if needed. I got my Burl used for 1600. It’s well worth it and has a nice clock in it. The Burl clock is an improvement over the Apollo. You may not need the BLA. I clock my whole system from The Burl and it sounds great. It clocks everything - itself plus Lynx Hilo, Apollo 8, 2 Apollo 16’s, an Apollo twin and my Bricasti Reverb which is connected digitally. I tested all my units as Master clock. The Burl and Lynx both sounded great. I preferred the Burl the most of them all Curious on the Bricasti hooked up digitally? I still have mine patched through analog then being converted on my converters. Sounds way better than any plugin, but just curious as to how it sounds going in digital vs. analog? Did you do comparisons? Almost ready to make a move on the Burl after hearing it on many sources, I think that is the direction I want to go in. The Bricasti sounds excellent either way. I’ve used it both ways. I wouldn’t sweat it. The digital may sound a hair better, but with decent conversion it’s not a huge difference. Casey himself has said, given the choice, use the digital connection, but it’s nothing to get caught up on - the analog is still sounds outstanding.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 8, 2018 7:37:33 GMT -6
I’m thrilled with he Smkii I got. It has revealed how much better it is over the months I’ve had it...while I think it sounded objectively better on day 1 in comparison to the BF Apollo and D-Box, I can tell with the results I’m getting that it’s even better than I thought it was. Is it the best? I have no idea - but I absolutely have no gas for conversion. Also - if you’re recording 30 channels at a time, there might be better solutions...maybe more reliable solutions. I still think Symphony control sucks ass. I’ve yet to be able to figure out the fix send thing as they only show how to do it in Logic and what seems logical to me to do in Cubase and Pro Tools never works. As for Burl - I guess it’s just a subjective thing - but I thought the Burl stuff could get a little glassy...Pretty sure it’s pushing the transformers hat causes it. I think you either like that or you don’t. I don’t particularly.
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Post by indiehouse on Feb 8, 2018 9:00:22 GMT -6
I’m thrilled with he Smkii I got. It has revealed how much better it is over the months I’ve had it...while I think it sounded objectively better on day 1 in comparison to the BF Apollo and D-Box, I can tell with the results I’m getting that it’s even better than I thought it was. Is it the best? I have no idea - but I absolutely have no gas for conversion. Also - if you’re recording 30 channels at a time, there might be better solutions...maybe more reliable solutions. I still think Symphony control sucks ass. I’ve yet to be able to figure out the fix send thing as they only show how to do it in Logic and what seems logical to me to do in Cubase and Pro Tools never works. As for Burl - I guess it’s just a subjective thing - but I thought the Burl stuff could get a little glassy...Pretty sure it’s pushing the transformers hat causes it. I think you either like that or you don’t. I don’t particularly. So, if you only had a digital out on a UAD twin, wouldn't you be forced to use the Twins AD conversion over the Symphony's? I think I'd want a digital in, that way I'd use the Symphony's AD conversion and run digital out to the digital in of the Twin, and then I'd be able to use UAD Console and run reverb on my input without having to deal with the convoluted routing and latency. Of course, then you'd probably have to monitor off the Twin, unless you could run digital out from the Twin to the Symphony in order to use it's DA. I have no idea if that would work or not. I tried to run my Apollo 16 into the Symphony via Thunderbolt, and that didn't work at all.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 8, 2018 9:20:12 GMT -6
The plot thickens. If I ever got the Symphony MKII, I'd use my Apollo satellite with it. I assume that's not an issue.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 8, 2018 21:21:40 GMT -6
I’m thrilled with he Smkii I got. It has revealed how much better it is over the months I’ve had it...while I think it sounded objectively better on day 1 in comparison to the BF Apollo and D-Box, I can tell with the results I’m getting that it’s even better than I thought it was. Is it the best? I have no idea - but I absolutely have no gas for conversion. Also - if you’re recording 30 channels at a time, there might be better solutions...maybe more reliable solutions. I still think Symphony control sucks ass. I’ve yet to be able to figure out the fix send thing as they only show how to do it in Logic and what seems logical to me to do in Cubase and Pro Tools never works. As for Burl - I guess it’s just a subjective thing - but I thought the Burl stuff could get a little glassy...Pretty sure it’s pushing the transformers hat causes it. I think you either like that or you don’t. I don’t particularly. So, if you only had a digital out on a UAD twin, wouldn't you be forced to use the Twins AD conversion over the Symphony's? I think I'd want a digital in, that way I'd use the Symphony's AD conversion and run digital out to the digital in of the Twin, and then I'd be able to use UAD Console and run reverb on my input without having to deal with the convoluted routing and latency. Of course, then you'd probably have to monitor off the Twin, unless you could run digital out from the Twin to the Symphony in order to use it's DA. I have no idea if that would work or not. I tried to run my Apollo 16 into the Symphony via Thunderbolt, and that didn't work at all. That’s what I would do. Use the Symphony in standalone. Optical into the twins digital in and then out of its mythical digital output into the Symphony digital in to use its da. Best of all worlds.
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Post by indiehouse on Feb 8, 2018 21:34:31 GMT -6
So, if you only had a digital out on a UAD twin, wouldn't you be forced to use the Twins AD conversion over the Symphony's? I think I'd want a digital in, that way I'd use the Symphony's AD conversion and run digital out to the digital in of the Twin, and then I'd be able to use UAD Console and run reverb on my input without having to deal with the convoluted routing and latency. Of course, then you'd probably have to monitor off the Twin, unless you could run digital out from the Twin to the Symphony in order to use it's DA. I have no idea if that would work or not. I tried to run my Apollo 16 into the Symphony via Thunderbolt, and that didn't work at all. That’s what I would do. Use the Symphony in standalone. Optical into the twins digital in and then out of its mythical digital output into the Symphony digital in to use its da. Best of all worlds. I didn't realize it already had a digita in! BLA adds a digital out? Oh man. That's sweet.
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Post by Guitar on Feb 8, 2018 21:52:58 GMT -6
That’s what I would do. Use the Symphony in standalone. Optical into the twins digital in and then out of its mythical digital output into the Symphony digital in to use its da. Best of all worlds. I didn't realize it already had a digita in! BLA adds a digital out? Oh man. That's sweet. Not as sweet as it sounds... BLA only adds a 2-channel optical SPDIF out that mirrors the main outputs. Not so hot for 8CH ADAT stuff really just seems like a way to sub-in a different DAC. If that's all you need, that's great though.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 8, 2018 22:29:52 GMT -6
For $450. No thanks. Maybe I can see if I can pay svart to do it for me.
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Post by Guitar on Feb 8, 2018 22:49:11 GMT -6
For $450. No thanks. Maybe I can see if I can pay svart to do it for me. Hey that's what I paid for my Twin Silver Duo... whoops! SMD rework is a tough road.... but that's still a pretty hefty asking price for the job!
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Post by indiehouse on Feb 9, 2018 6:26:23 GMT -6
For $450. No thanks. Maybe I can see if I can pay svart to do it for me. Yeah, that's steep. Especially since the whole setup would be just to use their Console software and some no latency verb. Bummer.
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Post by svart on Feb 9, 2018 8:10:24 GMT -6
For $450. No thanks. Maybe I can see if I can pay svart to do it for me. Add a parallel digital out to the master outputs? They probably just split off the I2S datastream going to the main DAC(s) and go to a chip like I used in my A/D which converts I2S to SPDIF/AES. The problem lies in how to set the IC up to know what it's getting. The one I use is not automatic syncing. From what I found back when I designed my A/D, the auto-syncing was a bit more jittery as it needed to reclock the input clock. That's why I did it manually. Probably not bad enough to hear or care about, but it's a thing to know. I might have a few of those chips left in my stockpile. I'll have to check. I still think COAX digital is a better solution though. Those optical transceivers are kinda flaky.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 9, 2018 16:25:49 GMT -6
Oh - it wouldn't bother me if it weren't optical.
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 14, 2018 4:48:48 GMT -6
Have you thought about picking up a used sf apollo?They have sodif and adat I/o, so you could track through your symphony pass to sf on spdif, use ua plugs and return to symphony on adat ?
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 14, 2018 8:20:14 GMT -6
I have. They’re still around $1000 though...just a lot for a dongle. Got to weight whether it’s worth it or not.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 14, 2018 8:40:25 GMT -6
keep watching, I'd bet someone sells one for $750 soon. Only thing, be sure it's a thunderbolt version.
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 14, 2018 8:46:18 GMT -6
I've seen duos for less than a grand.
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Post by indiehouse on Feb 14, 2018 8:57:26 GMT -6
Don't know if it's going to work like that or not. If the Symphony is the interface (connected via Thunderbolt), then I don't think you can also have the Apollo connected via thunderbolt at the same time, which is what you need in order for Console to work. I wasn't able to get it to work when I ran my Apollo into my Symphony. Maybe if you had two thunderbolt ports on a Mac, but it didn't work when I daisy chained.
Besides, $750 is still waay too much to pay just to run UAD plugins while tracking.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 14, 2018 9:03:05 GMT -6
That's good to know indiehouse.
Way down the road I've thought I might like a Symphony MKII and I'd keep my Quad satellite for plug-ins. I didn't consider the interface might be disappointing though. I use Logic, is that any better with the MKII?
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Post by indiehouse on Feb 14, 2018 10:00:25 GMT -6
That's good to know indiehouse. Way down the road I've thought I might like a Symphony MKII and I'd keep my Quad satellite for plug-ins. I didn't consider the interface might be disappointing though. I use Logic, is that any better with the MKII? I think you've misunderstood me. The Satellites work fine, I have one. I'm talking about the Apollo and how it communicates with Console for tracking with plugs.
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Post by drsax on Feb 14, 2018 10:45:00 GMT -6
For those wanting the Apollo workflow, and the Symphony ADDA, unless you’re needing lots of channels, I would think the symphony in standalone mode via the Apollo ADAT connection would be a great solution. IMO paying less than a grand for a great workflow is well worth it. With a larger I/O configuration though it wouldn’t be worth it.
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