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Post by sozocaps on May 14, 2016 20:13:35 GMT -6
I really need a good tube mic... I tracked today with a "clone" it worked but DAMN so did I !!!! to get it to work... I'm almost ready to hunt down a vintage mic, there is nothing new that excites me, I'm so NOT sure about all these clones, I NEED a great mic for tracking. I need a homerun, I have NO time to waist on lots and lots of trial and error and tweeking and blow a session.
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,967
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Post by ericn on May 14, 2016 20:50:14 GMT -6
Call Shannon! I repeat Call Shannon!
Again Call Shannon!
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Post by tasteliketape on May 14, 2016 20:59:02 GMT -6
What Eric said
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Post by jin167 on May 14, 2016 21:41:25 GMT -6
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Post by drbill on May 14, 2016 23:55:32 GMT -6
RMS269 if you like Neumann, Mid-forward, Do anything, Elegant mics.
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Post by Shannon on May 15, 2016 1:40:44 GMT -6
I really need a good tube mic... I tracked today with a "clone" it worked but DAMN so did I !!!! to get it to work... I'm almost ready to hunt down a vintage mic, there is nothing new that excites me, I'm so NOT sure about all these clones, I NEED a great mic for tracking. I need a homerun, I have NO time to waist on lots and lots of trial and error and tweeking and blow a session. What kinda flavor you. Looking for. ? 269 ish or ?
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,967
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Post by ericn on May 15, 2016 12:32:05 GMT -6
While I can't argue that a 67 isn't a great mic, the thing is, is it the right mic ? I consider Shannon a freind, of course so is the pres of Sennhieser USA and almost every other major mic manufacturer so it's all equal bias. Shannon as kewel as he is online when it comes to mics it's no BS, it's all about finding and getting it right. Even if I were looking for a classic Shannon would be one of my first calls because he's one of a handful of guys who are going to know what's out there. Shanon is the one guy who handles Martina's mic, Dolly's (now Jeff's ) mic amongst others. So MR Capacitor talk to MR Mic DR!!!
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Post by Randge on May 15, 2016 13:02:45 GMT -6
Buy a Miktek CV-4 and let Shannon go to town on it.
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Post by svart on May 15, 2016 13:39:17 GMT -6
I'll agree with all these. If you decide to go DIY, I'd suggest the U47 clones.. The Theirsch capsule, TAB/AMI transformer and NOS tube are the way to go. I cannot even say how versatile and lovely a sound my U47 clone has given me.
After visiting Shannon, seeing his lab, geeking out on his gear and ideas.. If I wasn't a DIY person, I'd get him to do all my mic work. The guy loves what he does and he's got some SERIOUS big names sending him mics to work on. That right there says a lot about his caliber of work.
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Post by Martin John Butler on May 15, 2016 20:49:40 GMT -6
Want to just plug and play, don't feel like messing around, get the Soyuz 0-17, $3,500, and you're done. It's a world class giant killer, chosen constantly over mint vintage mics in blind shootouts done by major league producers.
If you need to go the less expensive route, get the new design Blackspade UM-18R or UM-18B, (redline or blueline Thiersch M7 capsule). At $1900, it sports almost identical parts to mics 2-3 times more expensive, really. It sounds like a 3/4 U47, 1/4 M-49 blend, no need to change capsules, or tweak anything, no sibilance, clean, big, plenty of gain, the low end is full, not boomy, the top end is smooth, similar to a C-12 in a way. Blackspade are sticklers for high end service and detail, their quality control is second to none. I've dealt with them many times now and have never encountered better advice or service.
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Post by sozocaps on May 15, 2016 21:23:34 GMT -6
The mic sounds pretty good on this clip.. but never know until you get one in your hands...
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Post by joseph on May 15, 2016 21:56:13 GMT -6
General budget and voices you typically record?
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Post by gouge on May 15, 2016 22:08:09 GMT -6
To be the devils advocate I have 3 questions.
1. What if it's not a tube mic you seek.
2. What if it's your acoustics that are making you work hard.
3. What if you are too close to the mic
Might not be the same for you but I found I stopped disliking gear once I got the acoustics sorted and asked singers to step back a little.
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Post by Martin John Butler on May 15, 2016 22:18:11 GMT -6
https%3A//soundcloud.com/martin-john-butler/long-road-back-master Here's a finished production with the Soyuz 0-17 vocal mic, ( a preview before I do a video).
Remember, this was done in my living room, untreated, straight into my Dizengoff D4 preamp, no Sta-Level, no LA2, no Urei, No Chandlers, and the so so converters on the UAD Apollo. Imagine this thing on a first class signal path, whoa..
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Post by gouge on May 15, 2016 22:58:17 GMT -6
Can you do a vid with an sm57. Not trying to be silly.
Sure there are killer mics but even a lowly sm57 doesn't require trying hard to get to work.
in your space you've used bunches of mics. How many did you need to fight. They've all sounded quite good to me.
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Post by gouge on May 15, 2016 23:05:57 GMT -6
As an example, look at how you are using the soyuz, you are using it off axis.
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Post by thehightenor on May 15, 2016 23:54:45 GMT -6
I really need a good tube mic... I tracked today with a "clone" it worked but DAMN so did I !!!! to get it to work... I'm almost ready to hunt down a vintage mic, there is nothing new that excites me, I'm so NOT sure about all these clones, I NEED a great mic for tracking. I need a homerun, I have NO time to waist on lots and lots of trial and error and tweeking and blow a session. Tracking what? If it's vocals that aren't yours then you'll need a mic locker of different mics because there's no one perfect mic for any given singer. If it's a mic for you then you need to organise as many demos as you can musta the energy for. I wasted a whole heap of money buying a BLUE Bottle mic system with the three vocal caps without demoing on my voice and I hated the results! I realised I needed to demo mics to find the perfect fit and after a lot of time and hassle ended up with a Wunder CM7 which is a U47 clone but IMHO a wonderful mic which sounds incredible on my vocals and requires virtually nothing in the way of processing to fit perfectly in a mix and fantastic on acoustic guitar too. It takes time and money (although there are great bargains out there and great mic modders) to build a great mic locker there's no short cuts IME.
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Post by jin167 on May 16, 2016 3:25:49 GMT -6
While I can't argue that a 67 isn't a great mic, the thing is, is it the right mic ? I consider Shannon a freind, of course so is the pres of Sennhieser USA and almost every other major mic manufacturer so it's all equal bias. Shannon as kewel as he is online when it comes to mics it's no BS, it's all about finding and getting it right. Even if I were looking for a classic Shannon would be one of my first calls because he's one of a handful of guys who are going to know what's out there. Shanon is the one guy who handles Martina's mic, Dolly's (now Jeff's ) mic amongst others. So MR Capacitor talk to MR Mic DR!!! Fair point. But in my view although there are many great mics to choose from in the market including Shannon's only a handful of them will retain their value. If you have been keeping your eyes on the price of a U67 you'll know what I mean.
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Post by Randge on May 16, 2016 4:57:50 GMT -6
They have peaked and it wou
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Post by tskguy on May 16, 2016 7:57:42 GMT -6
Hi all,
Don't forget about Dany B's M7 or even (shameless plug) My Hk 47.. I prefer them both over the other M7 47 options out there. My personal u47 just killed a tfunk 47 in a shoot out.. It was built around Danys dual tube boards and cinemag transformer with my hk47 variant.
Eric
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Post by sozocaps on May 16, 2016 8:07:58 GMT -6
also FWIW the 87ai capsule and the 67 are the same capsule... the 87i had a different capsule (4 conductor)... just change out the guts with tube guts and I would think you can get very close no ?
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Post by Martin John Butler on May 16, 2016 8:08:28 GMT -6
gouge said, "in your space you've used bunches of mics. How many did you need to fight. They've all sounded quite good to me."
Thanks gouge. The most plug and play was the Soyuz. It didn't matter where the heck you sang from, the pickup pattern felt just right. Natural body movements didn't affect the tone negatively. Because I was testing, I had no processing on the Soyuz at all, just straight into my preamp, and then some reverb, that's it. I imagine with a finer system, a good board, a 1073, a Sta-Level that thing would be scary good.
The Blackspade UM-18R only needed a little EQ, there was no need for Dessing or tweaking the highs, it just doesn't need any help there, it's incredibly non-sibilant, but it doesn't do that by attenuating frequencies, it's just a better design all around than so many "affordable" high end clones I've heard. I'd describe it as more intimate sounding when comparing to the Soyuz.
I personally wouldn't prefer an Sm57 for vocals, but in a great studio with great gear, it can sound as good as anything if it's the right fit for a vocalist, It's been known to happen, but it's rare.
One very interesting thing I discovered was because of something Bob Ohlson mentioned. I had a pair of Neumann KM-84's here on loan. I tried one as a vocal mic for fun, and it was really surprising. It was definitely a viable vocal mic, way better than many I've heard. It just need a pop filter, (it's really sensitive) and careful placement. You could probably make a record with only that mic if you know what you're doing.
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Post by Ward on May 16, 2016 8:11:04 GMT -6
I really need a good tube mic... I tracked today with a "clone" it worked but DAMN so did I !!!! to get it to work... I'm almost ready to hunt down a vintage mic, there is nothing new that excites me, I'm so NOT sure about all these clones, I NEED a great mic for tracking. I need a homerun, I have NO time to waist on lots and lots of trial and error and tweeking and blow a session. Up until 2 years ago, I had only heard other people's recordings with a Telefunken Copperhead (CU29) and marveled at how I could not find any fault with them. Such a cheap $1000 used tube condensor mic. So I bought one. If there's a ringer, this is it. But three caveats: 1. Parts of it are made in China (shudder)... yet, it sounds absolutely perfect. Closest I have ever heard to the very best of the Neumann-Gefell UM57 microphones. 2. It's cardioid only and not wide cardioid either. 3. Rip out the tube it comes with, smash it with a hammer, then stomp on it, put it through a grinder until you have fine dust.... then get some NOS replacements like a gold lion, MULLARD, RCA etc and you'll be all set. OPTION DEUX: Buy a Neumann-Gefell UM57 for about $2500-3000 (USD) and spend the necessary $500 having Shannon fix it like he did with mine and you'll have a batman utility belt in a microphone for 1/6th of the nearest Neumann comparable. Mileage may vary according to driver and usage. Please drink responsibly. Don't drink and mic.
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Post by sozocaps on May 16, 2016 8:23:26 GMT -6
Hi all, Don't forget about Dany B's M7 or even (shameless plug) My Hk 47.. I prefer them both over the other M7 47 options out there. My personal u47 just killed a tfunk 47 in a shoot out.. It was built around Danys dual tube boards and cinemag transformer with my hk47 variant. Eric I do want several more mic's in my locker , Im a bit behind the curve on the DIY mic market( im in the guitar amp world non stop), would love to know more on it... !
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Post by jeromemason on May 16, 2016 8:27:02 GMT -6
All I know is Shannon took a clone I built and put it directly against a very well respected person's 251 and we went passed the sound of the vintage 251.
Vintage mics are inflated in price, the worst thing is to be buying one right now.
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