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Post by thehightenor on Mar 29, 2016 10:52:55 GMT -6
So having got a Retro STA Level for vocals and bass with an BAE 1073D to feed it.
I'm just wanting to save up and finish my little place ready to record some new material.
I've never owned a hardware 1176 and want to get one to give me some other sounds for bass, guitars etc.
The options these days are huge but at least I know I want a revision D.
So I keep reading that the UA 1176 re-issue is fairly vanilla (I can believe it as I demoed the UA LA2A reissue and it was pretty vanilla too) and that I should consider the Warm Audio and not be put off by the budget price.
Has the WA76 got more of the vibe of the original UREI 1176 than the UA re-issue?
Also what about the Hairball Audio 500 series Rev D (I would buy one pre-made) Also the IGS Alter 500 series?
There's also the Wes Audio Beta 76 and Mofet .... arrrghh there's no way I can demo them all.
Is the WA76 all it's cracked up to be or am I better with a Hairball 500 Rev. D for similar money, or just save up more and buy a AU 1176 re-issue?
Any advice would be much appreciated.
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Post by svart on Mar 29, 2016 12:05:41 GMT -6
So having got a Retro STA Level for vocals and bass with an BAE 1073D to feed it.
I'm just wanting to save up and finish my little place ready to record some new material.
I've never owned a hardware 1176 and want to get one to give me some other sounds for bass, guitars etc.
The options these days are huge but at least I know I want a revision D.
So I keep reading that the UA 1176 re-issue is fairly vanilla (I can believe it as I demoed the UA LA2A reissue and it was pretty vanilla too) and that I should consider the Warm Audio and not be put off by the budget price.
Has the WA76 got more of the vibe of the original UREI 1176 than the UA re-issue?
Also what about the Hairball Audio 500 series Rev D (I would buy one pre-made) Also the IGS Alter 500 series?
There's also the Wes Audio Beta 76 and Mofet .... arrrghh there's no way I can demo them all.
Is the WA76 all it's cracked up to be or am I better with a Hairball 500 Rev. D for similar money, or just save up more and buy a AU 1176 re-issue?
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Most of the time when folks talk about the differences between things like this, they are greatly exaggerating the differences for the sake of discussion. The overall "sound" of an 1176 is from it's compression characteristics for the most part. The rest is topology, like having transformers and the various versions of 1176 circuitry. Also, it's worth mentioning that the antique/vintage/old gear had parts with very loose tolerances. No two devices sounded the same unless they were selected from a large group for being similar. Because of this, it's almost meaningless to gauge a "true" tone of the device based on era alone. Overall, I'd just suggest you weigh your options while listening to as many demos as possible and just judge based on that, or better yet, see if you can borrow/rent some gear and see which one works better for you in your situation.
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Post by LesC on Mar 29, 2016 12:06:13 GMT -6
I'm probably the wrong person to reply to this because I don't have the ears, talent, experience, or discriminatory ability of most the guys on here.
I've had 2 WA76's. They both sounded great on bass and vocals, though I've never had the original for comparison. The first WA76 had problems with the push-buttons. Each button had to be pushed several times before engaging, and within a few days they couldn't be engaged at all. The second WA76 had working buttons, but the meter was wonky. It would be calibrated, and within a few minutes it was all over the place, no reflection of what's happening. I know I should be able to ignore the meter and just listen, but when punching in bass or vocals at a later date, I just find it easier with a working meter. My experience is very unusual, most people who have the Warm gear are very happy with it, so this was just my personal experience. Every equipment maker has some duds, I'm sure Warm would have done something if I asked, but I just didn't want to spend time on it. I think my magnetic personality causes problems with sensitive equipment.
I finally got a Serpent Audio Splice MkII when Zenpro had a sale, and so far I'm very happy with it. The switches, meter, and overall build quality are rock-solid and the sound is great. Flexibility is amazing, including the side-chain filters, the relay-controlled bypass, switchable blackface/blue-stripe modes, compression ratio options, and it has built-in stereo linking if you decide you need two.
Again, I think the WA76 and the Splice are both capable of delivering terrific sound, I just found the Splice to be more solid and quicker to get a sound I like. I just wish I had more time to use it.
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Post by thehightenor on Mar 29, 2016 15:17:48 GMT -6
Thanks, I do keep reading reports (yours is another) of quality issues with WA76, although everyone universally agrees they sound great.
It does put me off a bit to be honest.
At this point I'm learning towards a Hairball 500 series Rev D, which is another compressor everyone seems to universally think highly of.
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Post by drbill on Mar 29, 2016 17:45:57 GMT -6
Serpent Audio Splice. Both Rev A and Rev D and you can swap input and output trannies for A/D or D/A revisions. Mike @ serpent is a genius and the amount of time and engineering put into the Splice puts it way out ahead of anything else available IMO.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Mar 29, 2016 17:53:38 GMT -6
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Post by iamasound on Mar 30, 2016 6:04:59 GMT -6
I found that I needed to break in my WA76, as too, the buttons were wonky upon delivery and it wouldn't pass sound. I did an all buttons out and then all buttons in maneuver which seemed to cure the malady for what is now and about 10 months or so. The same thing happened when I was visiting Dale Pro Audio while auditioning a Beez Neez Mahalia early last fall while visiting NY. Eric (runs the recording demo room and is a fine and helpful fellow by the way) was in the room when the WA76 unit just plain went silent. His face looked as hitting the floor until I pulled my trick out of the bag and it was once again good to go (didn'the buy the Mahalia but bought the Gefell UMT 70S down the road a bit, albeit from my local Musix here in Baselland, Switzerland). My Tonebeast came delivered to me with a bad op-amp but was quickly sorted out by Bryce quickly and efficiently. And yes, the knobs on the WA76 were totally askew upon unpacking and loose enough to be unusable until I took a tiny screwdriver to them and worked them until there was a semblance of normalcy (they seem to be real cheapies). I cannot fault the sound of either unit, but rather enjoy what they do when I feed them some or lots of signal. I kind of knew what I was buying at this price point, and in lieu the cost of both units am completely and totally satisfied with their tonal qualities (something needs to give). Customer service was stellar and I couldn't have asked for better access to Bryce, his dealing with the distributor and the incredible speed of the replacement of the op-amp in question. As I am within the next six to nine months or so looking to buy an LA 2A clone as well as some stereo eq, some preamps, etc and at this point in time am not completely or partially certain that I will revisit Warm for my needs in the future, that is if I feel that other makers can offer better physical quality and comparable or superior sound at prices that I feel I can live with. Daking comes to mind, amongst others. I know that Warm is an advertiser here (I push the button to peruse the Warm Audio site from time to time), but I feel a need to add my voice to this discussion in weighing cost vs tonal quality vs build quality. There, my ear is back on the keyhole to listen in on the conversations and learn what I can from you guys. This place is fucking awesome, maybe the best of the best, at least to me.
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Post by mrholmes on Mar 30, 2016 6:31:59 GMT -6
By now I own two WA 76 and they both work fine form day one on... BTW I always ask my tech with hardware problems he is faster than the support. If its a big repair thing I always send the unit to the german distributer to fix it.
I never had any trouble doing it this way.
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Post by henge on Mar 30, 2016 6:33:50 GMT -6
I have 2 WA76's and have had zero issues with them! Just wanted to state that for some balanced opinion...
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Post by jin167 on Mar 30, 2016 6:38:49 GMT -6
had a problem with the meter on my wa76 so I had to ask Bryce about how to fix it. Within a couple of hours Bryce got back to me with detailed instructions on how to solve the issue. I dropped in a couple of resistors and capacitors onto the PCB and the meter was back to normal.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,099
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Post by ericn on Mar 30, 2016 7:38:15 GMT -6
OK if you want as close as you can get to a favorite version of the original without the silly money 3 choices 1 Used purple MC 76 ! Good luck finding one for sale! 2 Seprant Splice ! 3 DIY a Hairball ! For the money Warm WA76, For the Money I'll put one next to a new UA any day and be happy, put one on 4 pay at Zzounds, plug it in and run, then 4 months later repeat!
Or Let's be a bit different, The CAPI FC526? Jeff's DIY version of a 1176 either the API Tone, don't have one yet but so far everything I hear it on sounds yummy!
Can't go wrong with a real Daking FET either it's a different tonal take but with the 1176 gain reduction, I mean real Daking FET New 500 and 2 ch VCA's not bad but not the original.
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Post by thehightenor on Mar 30, 2016 7:45:00 GMT -6
had a problem with the meter on my wa76 so I had to ask Bryce about how to fix it. Within a couple of hours Bryce got back to me with detailed instructions on how to solve the issue. I dropped in a couple of resistors and capacitors onto the PCB and the meter was back to normal. It's years since I used a soldering iron - so I would of have to send the unit back. Warm audio seem to have a mixed response as regards build quality, I think knowing myself as I do, I will probably look elsewhere although I'm certain Warm delivers on sound quality. The Splice MK2 looks amazing as do does their little 500 series LA3A clone. However the cost is considerably higher than Warm Audio or even Hairball Audio so I shall have to save a bit longer. Thanks for the input I appreciate it.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Mar 30, 2016 8:28:30 GMT -6
had a problem with the meter on my wa76 so I had to ask Bryce about how to fix it. Within a couple of hours Bryce got back to me with detailed instructions on how to solve the issue. I dropped in a couple of resistors and capacitors onto the PCB and the meter was back to normal. It's years since I used a soldering iron - so I would of have to send the unit back. Warm audio seem to have a mixed response as regards build quality, I think knowing myself as I do, I will probably look elsewhere although I'm certain Warm delivers on sound quality. The Splice MK2 looks amazing as do does their little 500 series LA3A clone. However the cost is considerably higher than Warm Audio or even Hairball Audio so I shall have to save a bit longer. Thanks for the input I appreciate it. Hairball is DIY so if you can't solder your going to have to pay somebody! As far as WARM and build quality two important points. Part of the reason for the low price is Warm is building large number of units at a time so when you factor the number of units to the number with problems not all that bad. Second, Bryce has made no secret that compared to say Purple he is cutting some corners to get to that Price point, and frankly he has responded as well or better than many high dollar vendors! Your not going to get a Splice ,Purple or MOHOG for Warm money it just can't happen.
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Post by drbill on Mar 30, 2016 10:17:55 GMT -6
However the cost is considerably higher than Warm Audio or even Hairball Audio so I shall have to save a bit longer. With good reason, and well worth it IMO.
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Post by mdmitch2 on Mar 30, 2016 10:24:50 GMT -6
I have the hairball rev A 500 series -- It really sounds great, and I would go that route (or rev d) if space is a consideration. However, I also have a hairball rev D, rack version, which I prefer simply because it's not as cramped as the 500 series version, and the knobs have a little better feel.... also I prefer the VU meter. Of course, the 500 version has an extra compression ratio (2:1), which is cool.
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 30, 2016 13:45:29 GMT -6
The serpent is using the real deal original nos FETs with the higher HFE, and Mike is the only one who has them, he has taken it beyond the originals level of performance with unreal control, its quite literally 2 1/2 times the nearest competitor, and the best available bar none, I don't even think that's an opinion. if u want to take a DIY unit to a higher level, send it to Dandeurloo for his mods, they're no joke.
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Post by thehightenor on Mar 30, 2016 15:18:20 GMT -6
KMR in the UK have the Splice MK2 .... it looks fantastic as does the Chimera.
I happy to wait and get something a bit special that will last me as it will be better value on the long run.
I'm glad I started this thread as I wasn't really aware of Serpent Audio.
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Post by drbill on Mar 30, 2016 15:28:21 GMT -6
The serpent is using the real deal original nos FETs with the higher HFE, and Mike is the only one who has them, he has taken it beyond the originals level of performance with unreal control, its quite literally 2 1/2 times the nearest competitor, and the best available bar none, I don't even think that's an opinion. if u want to take a DIY unit to a higher level, send it to Dandeurloo for his mods, they're no joke. It is interesting to note of course that Dan was instrumental in helping Mike get the Splice off the ground. How do you get 2-1/2 Tony???
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Post by drbill on Mar 30, 2016 15:31:19 GMT -6
I wasn't really aware of Serpent Audio. IMO, Serpent is the leader in modern compression with vintage design. Or is that vintage compression with modern design. I suppose either is true. I'd even hazard to guess that Tony would agree with me on this. That in and of itself is enough recommendation - no???
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Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 30, 2016 15:47:51 GMT -6
I wasn't really aware of Serpent Audio. IMO, Serpent is the leader in modern compression with vintage design. Or is that vintage compression with modern design. I suppose either is true. I'd even hazard to guess that Tony would agree with me on this. That in and of itself is enough recommendation - no??? Hey Bill, any affiliation with Serpent? Free/discounted gear? Or just a big fan?
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Post by mhbunch on Mar 30, 2016 16:04:53 GMT -6
I have the hairball fet500 rev A and love it. VERY aggressive tho. Only usable on certain sources.
Don't have the Splice but I do have the Serpent sb4000 and it's a beast.
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Post by drbill on Mar 30, 2016 18:39:21 GMT -6
IMO, Serpent is the leader in modern compression with vintage design. Or is that vintage compression with modern design. I suppose either is true. I'd even hazard to guess that Tony would agree with me on this. That in and of itself is enough recommendation - no??? Hey Bill, any affiliation with Serpent? Free/discounted gear? Or just a big fan? Just a HUGE fan. I paid for all my serpent gear. SB4001, SA3A, and 500 Splices. Love it all. Mike is a great guy to deal with.
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 30, 2016 18:59:42 GMT -6
The serpent is using the real deal original nos FETs with the higher HFE, and Mike is the only one who has them, he has taken it beyond the originals level of performance with unreal control, its quite literally 2 1/2 times the nearest competitor, and the best available bar none, I don't even think that's an opinion. if u want to take a DIY unit to a higher level, send it to Dandeurloo for his mods, they're no joke. It is interesting to note of course that Dan was instrumental in helping Mike get the Splice off the ground. How do you get 2-1/2 Tony??? well, by my "special" math it's a Rev A and D, so that's.... one.... two..., and then there is all the true to the original components and extra super useful features like, filtering, side chain, blah blah, makes equal.... 1, 2,... 3, damn, i was wrong, it's 3 times the nearest haha.
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Post by rocinante on Mar 30, 2016 23:48:12 GMT -6
Sold the UA but still have two hairball rev d's, wa76, and a g1176. I'll be building a rev a in the near future but im not sureif its 500 or racked. Never had a problem with the wa76 and the difference between it, the hairballs, and the UA was negligible enough for me to have no problems selling the UA and using the extra cash for my kids camp and other gear purchases down the road. I've never used the splice but I recently used mohog's 1176 with switchable carnhill and altran xfmrs and that was pretty damn sweet.
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Post by thehightenor on Mar 31, 2016 2:34:54 GMT -6
Where the Hairball Rev D's 500 series?
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