ferry
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by ferry on Dec 19, 2023 17:45:42 GMT -6
Thanks for welcomes and also for a lot of info to you and to everyone. Somehow I consider neumann km184 only work with EQ and so far from my point of view with little exp, I think that it should be proceeded easier, than working with already EQ'ed track. But considering the fact of my envinroment (living room without doors with 2 meter opened passage to another room and ladder behind my back, when I sit in from of pc) - it is probably won't possible to record something perfect, just trying to stay realistical  So for now will get a Soyuz and play around with mono/stereo with MK4. Regarding preamp - understood, added in mind to the "Wishlist". Just when I will be ready for that. For now, imho - I must also concentrate on treatment. Overall my envinroment is abnormal for any kind of studio rules. Probably will buy more panels, i.e. acoustic foam under my 240x100cm table etc. And play around with positioning as well. But as mentioned... It's just a hobby and I dont expect gorgeous results, its like as good as possible  Just saying, I wouldn't poo poo the Samar at all. I think others would back me up on that. Half the price. ah yeah, I took a look on that. All shops doesnt have it. Used market is empty, even ebay... Its probably something "local". I want to have a possibility to return it in case everything will be bad Or what has resell value in the future. If nobody use and know it in my country, then it will be really difficult to deal with those mics. |
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Post by bikescene on Dec 19, 2023 20:03:19 GMT -6
I have a few SDCs that I use on acoustic guitar: Soyuz 013, a pair of Oktava MK-012, Lulu FET, and a KSM-137. I kept tabs on these mics over the years from reading about their use mainly on acoustic guitar.
I thought I would be doing a lot more XY recording on acoustic guitar with the MK-012. I found that I preferred the sound of a single SDC.
For acoustic guitar, I like the 013 the best out of the four, although the MK-012’s sound isn’t all that different to me. The Lulu FET and KSM-137 are a little brighter sounding and I don’t reach for them as much for this application.
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Post by drbill on Dec 19, 2023 22:08:01 GMT -6
The 84 is more expensive of course, but a classic that will almost never loose out, and almost never get sold. It is the ultimate SDC in uncontrolled environments for me. You can pull back or push in to remove the craziest of room tones. I've even used them at a clients with windows open and gardeners outside and got a useable recording. Speaking of SDCs, I like my Soyuz 013s but I've been curious about the Beyerdynamic 930s. In an old thread you (kinda) said that you hated them. I've wanted to ask you why you don't like them. Hate is a strong word. Probably too strong. With (3) 84's, (2) 86's, (2) 53's and some Gefell's and 012's there's just no point to them for me. They are cloudy, and have a weird thing that sounds kinda phasey to me. |
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Post by reddirt on Dec 19, 2023 22:39:26 GMT -6
In support of John's P.O.V - that recording he posted of the Samar 32 sounds terrific ; at any price let alone $299 I'd be starting right there.
Cheers, Ross
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Post by the other mark williams on Dec 19, 2023 22:51:49 GMT -6
Just saying, I wouldn't poo poo the Samar at all. I think others would back me up on that. Half the price. ah yeah, I took a look on that. All shops doesnt have it. Used market is empty, even ebay... Its probably something "local". I want to have a possibility to return it in case everything will be bad Or what has resell value in the future. If nobody use and know it in my country, then it will be really difficult to deal with those mics. Right, that's because they're brand new. Like, they haven't actually shipped the first batch out yet. Mark Fouxman is a world-class designer, though. And he's an active member of this forum. You could ask him anything you need to about the mics. |
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Post by svart on Dec 20, 2023 14:25:13 GMT -6
I use the KM184 or MK012's almost exclusively for acoustic guitar these days. They're just mics you can trust the sound of.
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Post by thehightenor on Dec 20, 2023 16:01:49 GMT -6
I was given a pair of vintage AKG 451E's
I initially thought they might be too bright for use in a digital world
but with my pre-amps I've found they sound beautiful on my Martin D-18 and Alhambra C7 classical.
They don't need any EQ - save for the usual gentle LPF and the detail is incredible.
I've struggled to find something I prefer in a SDC (LDC I have lot's of choice)
I guess they don't make mics like they used to.
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Post by reddirt on Dec 20, 2023 17:51:46 GMT -6
Yep, the old 451 ( I have an EB from 1983 ) is a great mic with a lot of reach and a sweet sound. Have cut a few albums using it as the lead Vox mic and it works beautifully ( on the right voice of course)
Cheers, Ross
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Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 20, 2023 20:18:05 GMT -6
I've used both the Neumann and the Soyuz. The KM184 always feels like it's missing something, especially since I'm used the the vintage KM84's. The Soyuz is like a modern upgrade of the KM84. I'd choose it any day over the KM184.
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ferry
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by ferry on Dec 21, 2023 11:17:39 GMT -6
Thanks to everyone again. Today I've got the Soyuz 013. Did first test in my current condition and was honestly surprised compared to Sennheiser MK4. I like it, I like also the voice recordings, so it will be nice to use for Discrod, Teams etc Right now will think about how to do it still better. Ordered: - circular carpet (dont like to use them - dust collectors), but will just use it if I need to record something. - Few more bass traps, to cover my (only 3 available corners) from ceiling to the floor. - Few acoustic pictures and acoustic foam to treat empty wall from the right, which fells like made of cardboard And probably need to think about what to do with also empty wall along the ladder... Maybe it make sense to create another topic, but it seems like hard discussion and just need to test a lot  |
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Post by noob on Dec 21, 2023 11:37:42 GMT -6
Good choice, I'm a big fan of my 013's. They are very natural sounding, beautiful mics. I suggest for closer micing such as guitar, checking out the -10db pads they come with. For me, it was a big improvement. For drum OH's, I haven't tried using the pads yet.
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ferry
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by ferry on Dec 21, 2023 11:54:18 GMT -6
Good choice, I'm a big fan of my 013's. They are very natural sounding, beautiful mics. I suggest for closer micing such as guitar, checking out the -10db pads they come with. For me, it was a big improvement. For drum OH's, I haven't tried using the pads yet. What is exactly the usage of -10pad? For example on my Audtio Interface - Phantom power - set 30db gain on mic. And if I equip -10db pad it should be more silent, so I will have to increate the gain i.e. from 30db to 40db or does it work differently? |
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Post by svart on Dec 21, 2023 12:40:08 GMT -6
Good choice, I'm a big fan of my 013's. They are very natural sounding, beautiful mics. I suggest for closer micing such as guitar, checking out the -10db pads they come with. For me, it was a big improvement. For drum OH's, I haven't tried using the pads yet. What is exactly the usage of -10pad? For example on my Audtio Interface - Phantom power - set 30db gain on mic. And if I equip -10db pad it should be more silent, so I will have to increate the gain i.e. from 30db to 40db or does it work differently? The pad is usually inserted before the mic's preamp so that very loud sources won't cause the mic's preamp to overload. And yes, the result is that you will possibly need to compensate the loss in signal with more preamp gain. |
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Post by noob on Dec 21, 2023 12:46:03 GMT -6
Good choice, I'm a big fan of my 013's. They are very natural sounding, beautiful mics. I suggest for closer micing such as guitar, checking out the -10db pads they come with. For me, it was a big improvement. For drum OH's, I haven't tried using the pads yet. What is exactly the usage of -10pad? For example on my Audtio Interface - Phantom power - set 30db gain on mic. And if I equip -10db pad it should be more silent, so I will have to increate the gain i.e. from 30db to 40db or does it work differently? It's because they are such sensitive capsules, so if you are close to something that's very dynamic like a guitar, the -10db pad will make it so you don't overshoot your gain settings. |
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ferry
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by ferry on Dec 21, 2023 14:39:37 GMT -6
Alright, then I was thinking correctly, but still not completely understandable the difference between normal pad and lower gain and -10db pad, but higher gain. If see that db-lever is overshooting the red lines, then I just make the gain lower by those same 10db :thinking: Well, going to try to find some articles and read |
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Post by robo on Dec 21, 2023 14:58:48 GMT -6
Alright, then I was thinking correctly, but still not completely understandable the difference between normal pad and lower gain and -10db pad, but higher gain. If see that db-lever is overshooting the red lines, then I just make the gain lower by those same 10db :thinking: Well, going to try to find some articles and read The microphone itself has an ideal range of signal level, just like anything else in your chain. Some mics sound good pushed a little, and some just get congested and crappy. It will sound different padding the mic or turning down the preamp gain - even if very subtle. Which is better for the application is up to you. |
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jono3
Full Member
Posts: 49
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Post by jono3 on Dec 22, 2023 12:16:13 GMT -6
If it helps at all, I sold my pair of 184s I had for about 10 years after I got my 013s.
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Post by zonkola on Dec 22, 2023 14:47:04 GMT -6
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,086 
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Post by ericn on Dec 22, 2023 15:29:33 GMT -6
I would really take a good look at the New Samara mics, but I have stumbled on a manufacturer that Hudsonic knows more about Griffon, take a listen to their SDC’s and their mid sized Diaphragm. The mid size are looking tempting as an unknown affordable great utility mic.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Dec 22, 2023 16:32:16 GMT -6
For those using single 012 on acoustics, what capsule are you using?
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Post by drbill on Dec 22, 2023 20:06:47 GMT -6
For those using single 012 on acoustics, what capsule are you using? Card. |
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Post by bikescene on Dec 24, 2023 9:23:50 GMT -6
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Post by smashlord on Dec 24, 2023 9:58:55 GMT -6
Those with the 013 FETS.... are you having the issues that I've seen mentioned with chipping paint, badges falling off, etc...? These mics have intrigued me and have come recommended from friends who have impressive mic collections (one has 6X KM84s and says he prefers 013 FET on acoustic), but those QC issues are what is holding me back from pulling the trigger on a pair.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Dec 24, 2023 14:21:45 GMT -6
Those with the 013 FETS.... are you having the issues that I've seen mentioned with chipping paint, badges falling off, etc...? These mics have intrigued me and have come recommended from friends who have impressive mic collections (one has 6X KM84s and says he prefers 013 FET on acoustic), but those QC issues are what is holding me back from pulling the trigger on a pair. Never heard of this and honestly sounds like a problem with mishandling. Those mics are built like tanks. They are heavy and substantial. No problems here. |
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Post by the other mark williams on Dec 24, 2023 20:35:49 GMT -6
Those with the 013 FETS.... are you having the issues that I've seen mentioned with chipping paint, badges falling off, etc...? These mics have intrigued me and have come recommended from friends who have impressive mic collections (one has 6X KM84s and says he prefers 013 FET on acoustic), but those QC issues are what is holding me back from pulling the trigger on a pair. Never heard of this and honestly sounds like a problem with mishandling. Those mics are built like tanks. They are heavy and substantial. No problems here. Same |
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