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M3 leak
Aug 12, 2023 15:24:48 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by kcatthedog on Aug 12, 2023 15:24:48 GMT -6
16 cores ?
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Post by andersmv on Aug 12, 2023 16:23:14 GMT -6
We havn't even fixed the issues with the M1's yet.... It's going to get really annoying if Apple keeps up this kind of pace releasing new chips. Developers can't catch up, those of us that bought brand new M2 chips pretty much immediately feel like crap for wasting money when we should have waited "just a little longer". The M1's should have been around for a few years before they even thought about doing the M2's, is this just absolutely crazy to anyone else? We're not going to buy a new computer every year Apple, stop trying so hard.
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M3 leak
Aug 12, 2023 16:28:45 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by kcatthedog on Aug 12, 2023 16:28:45 GMT -6
Issues ? my m1 works fine. Ya can’t keep up so just the best computer that suits your purposes: hard to chase down tomorrow today ? At least now most 3rd party plugs are silicon compliant.
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Post by drbill on Aug 12, 2023 17:09:36 GMT -6
We're not going to buy a new computer every year Apple, stop trying so hard. Just look at Apples incessant new OS releases - one per year or thereabouts. That should tell you where they are headed.
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M3 leak
Aug 12, 2023 18:30:09 GMT -6
via mobile
ericn likes this
Post by kcatthedog on Aug 12, 2023 18:30:09 GMT -6
Ok, but you don’t have to upgrade os automatically?
There are also open legacy installers for older macs if you want to run more up to date mac os.
Just saying there are options and we don’t need to blindly jump on the apple software update bandwagon.
I run ventura on my m1 mini and my 2012 i7 mbp and compatible 3rd party software on both.
I haven’t touched anything for about 6-9 months and other than updating logic, just run the software I have.
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Post by seawell on Aug 12, 2023 18:48:27 GMT -6
Good grief...I can't imagine needing more power than the M2 Ultra provides.
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Post by indiehouse on Aug 12, 2023 21:25:01 GMT -6
Ok, but you don’t have to upgrade os automatically? There are also open legacy installers for older macs if you want to run more up to date mac os. Just saying there are options and we don’t need to blindly jump on the apple software update bandwagon. I run ventura on my m1 mini and my 2012 i7 mbp and compatible 3rd party software on both. I haven’t touched anything for about 6-9 months and other than updating logic, just run the software I have. The problem, I find, is support. Every time I have to contact Apple with an issue, whether it’s my iPhone or my iMac, the first question is inevitably “did you update your OS to the latest version?”. And usually that’s where the process stops, because refuse to update my system, as that will inevitably cause software compatibility issues, which means hours in front of a computer, updating software. I explain that every time to them, and they don’t care. So, yeah. It works great. Till it doesn’t. I will say it’s generally a stable system. But there are times…
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Post by Mister Chase on Aug 12, 2023 21:52:39 GMT -6
Ok, but you don’t have to upgrade os automatically? There are also open legacy installers for older macs if you want to run more up to date mac os. Just saying there are options and we don’t need to blindly jump on the apple software update bandwagon. I run ventura on my m1 mini and my 2012 i7 mbp and compatible 3rd party software on both. I haven’t touched anything for about 6-9 months and other than updating logic, just run the software I have. The problem, I find, is support. Every time I have to contact Apple with an issue, whether it’s my iPhone or my iMac, the first question is inevitably “did you update your OS to the latest version?”. And usually that’s where the process stops, because refuse to update my system, as that will inevitably cause software compatibility issues, which means hours in front of a computer, updating software. I explain that every time to them, and they don’t care. So, yeah. It works great. Till it doesn’t. I will say it’s generally a stable system. But there are times… Bingo. On my old 2012 Macbook Pro, I wanted to use Logic which a client bought for me, so I had to update to Catalina. However, this meant none of my waves plugins were compatible anymore, so I had to pay WUP to use them again. Rock and a hard place sometimes.
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Post by thehightenor on Aug 13, 2023 1:51:48 GMT -6
We havn't even fixed the issues with the M1's yet.... It's going to get really annoying if Apple keeps up this kind of pace releasing new chips. Developers can't catch up, those of us that bought brand new M2 chips pretty much immediately feel like crap for wasting money when we should have waited "just a little longer". The M1's should have been around for a few years before they even thought about doing the M2's, is this just absolutely crazy to anyone else? We're not going to buy a new computer every year Apple, stop trying so hard. It’s not just Apple to be fair. I just ordered a new Intel 13900K system. Intel have announced the 14900K is coming out at the end of the year and then 12 months later the 15900K based on 3nm tech and “that’ll be the one” …. until 6 months later when they announce the 16900K. I’m getting a sneaking suspicion these companies are out to make money!!
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Post by Blackdawg on Aug 13, 2023 3:40:08 GMT -6
I hate that channel. They reallllly like to pump up the rumors are rarely correctly. just click bait BS youtube channel most the time.
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 6:44:48 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by kcatthedog on Aug 13, 2023 6:44:48 GMT -6
Sure, but there is some fun in the speculation. If one was considering a new mac, sometime soonish, as stated above,, then you might want to hold out till m3 drops or as Josh said above, u need mo power than an m2 ultra: really ?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 8:25:35 GMT -6
Good grief...I can't imagine needing more power than the M2 Ultra provides. What we need is more single core power and for Apple to compromise on casework a little bit to gain repairability and better thermals (to run faster on more watts). The current Intel champ, the i9-13900k can only be cooled by an aio water cooler in a full atx case. There’s no reason an Apple silicon Mac mini or studio system on a chip couldn’t use normal ram and a normal ssd if they just made the case a little bigger. I hope the EU mandates that eventually.
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 8:42:39 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by kcatthedog on Aug 13, 2023 8:42:39 GMT -6
By why would mac drop soc ram with m series ?
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 8:58:58 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 8:58:58 GMT -6
We havn't even fixed the issues with the M1's yet.... It's going to get really annoying if Apple keeps up this kind of pace releasing new chips. Developers can't catch up, those of us that bought brand new M2 chips pretty much immediately feel like crap for wasting money when we should have waited "just a little longer". The M1's should have been around for a few years before they even thought about doing the M2's, is this just absolutely crazy to anyone else? We're not going to buy a new computer every year Apple, stop trying so hard. The good developers catch up quickly. Ones that are owned by private equity firms or contract out all of their programming work do not. Do not use such software if you do not have to. Almost all plugin alliance has been replaced but the dsm still lingers occasionally. The elephant in the room is avid with its horrible development schedule, antiquated code base, dead on arrival aax dsp plugin format, and shifting teams of contracted out programmers not fixing bugs and introducing new bugs. Expect it to only get worse.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 9:02:15 GMT -6
By why would mac drop soc ram with m series ? Because they might eventually be forced to or have their products confiscated and destroyed by customs in a major market. They have it just to jack up the price reselling you ram. Same with the soldered in ssd and decoupling the controller from the flash ram chips. The same reason the lightning cable is going away. I hope fake electrical parts will be banned eventually too. I would love to see everything with fake ics and fake caps be destroyed.
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 9:41:14 GMT -6
Post by andersmv on Aug 13, 2023 9:41:14 GMT -6
I always enjoy a chance to crap on Avid, but I think it's worth mentioning that a lot of the Avid software people are based in the Ukraine and the "issues" over there slowed things down significantly. Pretty frustrating, I don't want to see any of those people loose their jobs because they're busy protecting their country, at the same time I would also like Avid to fix a lot of problems...
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Deleted
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 11:14:56 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 11:14:56 GMT -6
I always enjoy a chance to crap on Avid, but I think it's worth mentioning that a lot of the Avid software people are based in the Ukraine and the "issues" over there slowed things down significantly. Pretty frustrating, I don't want to see any of those people loose their jobs because they're busy protecting their country, at the same time I would also like Avid to fix a lot of problems... Avid changed programmers to cheaper ones and in house ones in the UK and other places. The Ukrainian guys were audio programmers who made HDX and made Pro Tools competitive with Reaper and Cubase sound quality wise. When they switched programmers, poor src and automatic noise shaped dither behavior were introduced and worse delay compensation happened. It’s a shame they lost their jobs. They gave pro tools a mostly new code base. Meanwhile Logic and Cubendo… I love Reaper but I don’t really do anything with midi in it and I’m not sure how well it handles huge post projects. Dan
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 11:17:55 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by kcatthedog on Aug 13, 2023 11:17:55 GMT -6
dan, are saying soc ram isn’t faster and doesn’t contribute to the faster processing and lower heat of the silicon design ? As far as I have read, these are its attributes/benefits ?
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 11:42:35 GMT -6
Post by drbill on Aug 13, 2023 11:42:35 GMT -6
Ok, but you don’t have to upgrade os automatically? There are also open legacy installers for older macs if you want to run more up to date mac os. Just saying there are options and we don’t need to blindly jump on the apple software update bandwagon. I run ventura on my m1 mini and my 2012 i7 mbp and compatible 3rd party software on both. I haven’t touched anything for about 6-9 months and other than updating logic, just run the software I have. The problem, I find, is support. Every time I have to contact Apple with an issue, whether it’s my iPhone or my iMac, the first question is inevitably “did you update your OS to the latest version?”. And usually that’s where the process stops, because refuse to update my system, as that will inevitably cause software compatibility issues, which means hours in front of a computer, updating software. I explain that every time to them, and they don’t care. So, yeah. It works great. Till it doesn’t. I will say it’s generally a stable system. But there are times… They of course only want to support you if you are on the latest computer running the latest OS running the latest version of all software. Only problem is, software can't move as fast as Apple does, so everything is always one step behind. Maddening....
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 13, 2023 12:10:20 GMT -6
Good grief...I can't imagine needing more power than the M2 Ultra provides. I can’t really max out my M1 Mac Studio
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Post by andersmv on Aug 13, 2023 12:29:21 GMT -6
Good grief...I can't imagine needing more power than the M2 Ultra provides. I can’t really max out my M1 Mac Studio I just got an M2 Ultra, I would have NEVER remotely considered it just for audio, the Max would have been plenty. The video stuff is killing me, and the Ultra just gave me back hours of my life almost every day. Even having 6-8 channels of video footage in DaVinci Resolve going at the same time, shot in 6K BRAW and going to a 4K timeline, heavy color grade and noise/sharpening stuff going on with every channel, the Ultra is barely breaking a sweat and playing it all back without any dropped frames in real time. I appreciate the time it's saving me on constant renders and being able to play it all back in full res, but it's still probably overkill for me the majority of the time. The new Ultra's are crazy...
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 13:11:19 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 13:11:19 GMT -6
dan, are saying soc ram isn’t faster and doesn’t contribute to the faster processing and lower heat of the silicon design ? As far as I have read, these are its attributes/benefits ? It barely matters. What matters is voltage to the chip, increasing power consumption, increasing heat. They could have the ram be removable under the metal cover of the system on a chip. People with crazy soldering skills have increased ram on Mac minis beyond official Apple specs.
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Deleted
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 13:25:08 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 13:25:08 GMT -6
The problem, I find, is support. Every time I have to contact Apple with an issue, whether it’s my iPhone or my iMac, the first question is inevitably “did you update your OS to the latest version?”. And usually that’s where the process stops, because refuse to update my system, as that will inevitably cause software compatibility issues, which means hours in front of a computer, updating software. I explain that every time to them, and they don’t care. So, yeah. It works great. Till it doesn’t. I will say it’s generally a stable system. But there are times… They of course only want to support you if you are on the latest computer running the latest OS running the latest version of all software. Only problem is, software can't move as fast as Apple does, so everything is always one step behind. Maddening.... The software could move almost as fast as Apple if they had dedicated programmers working on it as a full time job instead of independent contractors and the rent collecting assholes at Pace trying to get their glorified rootkit to run efficiently in the background and rent collectors at Steinberg waiting until the fall to release the new version you must buy for your new OS. There is absolutely zero reasons why modern plugins much more complex than anything in a digital mixer can be updated right away yet basic daw code cannot. Apple themselves brings their 1980s code base DAW kicking and screaming into the modern world of the then current OS complete newfound bugs with a tiny dedicated team. There’s no reason why Steinberg/Yamaha, Avid, MOTU, and Soundwise/Francisco Partners cannot follow them in a month!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2023 13:36:00 GMT -6
Good grief...I can't imagine needing more power than the M2 Ultra provides. I can’t really max out my M1 Mac Studio You can kill a single core pretty easily on low buffer for low latency which will bring the entire session down. Modern fx Sends and bus processing can be very heavy and everything must still be rendered in real time at the same buffer you automated to guarantee everything matches up perfectly for time based fx and automation. You can be using maybe only 10-40 % of the cpu power yet can max out a core. I am using a 12900k which has a much faster single core speed and adding certain compressors to busses (8x to 16x oversampling from pulsar, the glue, and dmg) or another fx send can bring down a session on high buffer. Pro Audio already is the most aggressive real time scheduling on both Mac and Windows. Telling the daw to more aggressively utilize cpu resources to spread the load will increase the total percentage used and bring you in danger of overloading the entire cpu or an efficiency core at the expense of spreading the single core load. If I use some old school sheet like the og Sony Oxford six pack sonnox plugs made by Paul frindle, Waves Ren with the og 1999 guis, old versions of McDSP prior to the last two when they got the stupid encryption and pretty gui bloat, I can run hundreds of them but that’s not really saying much because the sound will be cold steel of Sonnox, mud of Waves Ren, or digital sandpaper phase shifted from excessive high pass filters to correct dc offset sound of McDSP. I used to mix that up and everything would sound like industrial music if I pushed anything too hard. Even rendering 40 minute to hours long audio files offline with a insert chain of modern mastering plugs can take about 10 mins per hour. That’s a lot of time wasted!
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M3 leak
Aug 13, 2023 14:46:25 GMT -6
Post by Mister Chase on Aug 13, 2023 14:46:25 GMT -6
I can’t really max out my M1 Mac Studio You can kill a single core pretty easily on low buffer for low latency which will bring the entire session down. Modern fx Sends and bus processing can be very heavy and everything must still be rendered in real time at the same buffer you automated to guarantee everything matches up perfectly for time based fx and automation. You can be using maybe only 10-40 % of the cpu power yet can max out a core. I am using a 12900k which has a much faster single core speed and adding certain compressors to busses (8x to 16x oversampling from pulsar, the glue, and dmg) or another fx send can bring down a session on high buffer. Pro Audio already is the most aggressive real time scheduling on both Mac and Windows. Telling the daw to more aggressively utilize cpu resources to spread the load will increase the total percentage used and bring you in danger of overloading the entire cpu or an efficiency core at the expense of spreading the single core load. If I use some old school sheet like the og Sony Oxford six pack sonnox plugs made by Paul frindle, Waves Ren with the og 1999 guis, old versions of McDSP prior to the last two when they got the stupid encryption and pretty gui bloat, I can run hundreds of them but that’s not really saying much because the sound will be cold steel of Sonnox, mud of Waves Ren, or digital sandpaper phase shifted from excessive high pass filters to correct dc offset sound of McDSP. I used to mix that up and everything would sound like industrial music if I pushed anything too hard. Even rendering 40 minute to hours long audio files offline with a insert chain of modern mastering plugs can take about 10 mins per hour. That’s a lot of time wasted! Yea. Albeit, I'm only on the regular m1 mini(still love it) but I couldn't even playback some songs for the band when on Discord video chat with Audiomovers running. Granted, they were 70+ track sessions counting busses with lots of modern FX moves that they wanted - but that hurt. Playback errors in the middle of critical listening is not a good look. I found a large portion of the problem was my 2 bus chain. Running True Iron, a tape deck sim, console sim, and some other plugs could bring things to a halt. That's why I'm building a bit more towards a more hardware based approach. The PC doesn't care nearly as much just routing audio to and from the AD/DA. Get my sounds going first mix and print them all back into PT. Then any revisions will be done with basic moves from Pro-Q/Slick/Nova/Kotel/Molot or whatever. Up to 24 channels with my Aurora(n) so I just need to built out the 500 series setup and patchbay.
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