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Post by drumsound on Jun 9, 2023 0:12:36 GMT -6
I think I'm just a little bored but, I'm wondering about EQs that aren't trying to be something analog, and aren't just using math to simply add or subtract at X frequency. Something that maybe has a bit of a sound and a really simple and effective UI.
Thoughts?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2023 2:10:26 GMT -6
They all use math, they all model analog eqs, and they all have a sound even if they do not product any distortion.
Older EQs and poorer modern ones mostly used abstracted models of analog eqs to try to model the result of the analog eq, ie direct form biquadratic filters.
Good clean modern EQs concretely model what the individual electrical components of an analog eq do, eg Andy Simper or Vadim Zavalishin state variable filters. These lack the numerical errors of the direct form filters.
They are still models even if they are not circuit models with distortion. Unfortunately there are a lot of bad plugins still being released worse than things from the 90s.
Tokyo Dawn
Slick EQ GE and M are what you want with their non linear sections. They are 10 dollars each on sale.
Nova GE also has a "+" mode that adds in non-linearities. It sounds really good.
Sonnox
Oxford EQ type 4 is an almost equal power parametric EQ. It's super cool. Almost like a parametric API 550.
PSP
NobleQ2 is really cool.
RetroQ has the shelves from vintage warmer. Very useful.
Master Q2 analog button is cool and it has a cool limiter.
Variety of Sound Boot EQ is free, sounds smooth, and is Windows only.
Kirchoff is pretty cool but I never used it when I owned it.
PA Neold Big Al is pretty wicked.
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Post by svart on Jun 9, 2023 8:18:03 GMT -6
Crave EQ. Love it. Use it on everything. It has switchable algorithms as well so you can tailor it to your needs.
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Post by notneeson on Jun 9, 2023 8:23:46 GMT -6
I think I'm just a little bored but, I'm wondering about EQs that aren't trying to be something analog, and aren't just using math to simply add or subtract at X frequency. Something that maybe has a bit of a sound and a really simple and effective UI. Thoughts? I still love Massey VT3, the mid band is excellent on electric guitar. |
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Post by niklas1073 on Jun 9, 2023 8:41:27 GMT -6
I don’t know many of that kind when i think about it. When I want something colorless and non intrusive I always use the pro tools EQ7. I feel most “specialty” eq’s tend to have something twisty to it and I go for them because of the twist which usually is the saturation factor. Hard to imagine what an eq without saturation added but with a sound would be. Well the pultec kind of does something interesting despite of circuit modeling that gives a character of its own, but nothing that you couldn’t achieve with using a few parametrics on top of each other.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2023 11:04:13 GMT -6
I don’t know many of that kind when i think about it. When I want something colorless and non intrusive I always use the pro tools EQ7. I feel most “specialty” eq’s tend to have something twisty to it and I go for them because of the twist which usually is the saturation factor. Hard to imagine what an eq without saturation added but with a sound would be. Well the pultec kind of does something interesting despite of circuit modeling that gives a character of its own, but nothing that you couldn’t achieve with using a few parametrics on top of each other. what? A Pultec is a passive, parallel inductor based eq. Inductors behave differently. Different filter structures sound different. Pro Tools EQs have a sound by being direct form biquads. You don’t need to drive something into obvious distortion for it to have a sound. Compare the eqiii to Oxford, Fabfilter, or Kirchhoff eqs for example. blog.threebodytech.com/72.html has a filter comparison. |
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Post by niklas1073 on Jun 9, 2023 11:30:56 GMT -6
I don’t know many of that kind when i think about it. When I want something colorless and non intrusive I always use the pro tools EQ7. I feel most “specialty” eq’s tend to have something twisty to it and I go for them because of the twist which usually is the saturation factor. Hard to imagine what an eq without saturation added but with a sound would be. Well the pultec kind of does something interesting despite of circuit modeling that gives a character of its own, but nothing that you couldn’t achieve with using a few parametrics on top of each other. what? A Pultec is a passive, parallel inductor based eq. Inductors behave differently. Different filter structures sound different. Pro Tools EQs have a sound by being direct form biquads. You don’t need to drive something into obvious distortion for it to have a sound. Compare the eqiii to Oxford, Fabfilter, or Kirchhoff eqs for example. blog.threebodytech.com/72.html has a filter comparison. Sorry maybe I misunderstood the initial topic. I was referring to plugins only which of course are math only and emulations does not correlate with analog circuits. With the pultec example i meant disregarding the circuit emulation the analogy of pultec style eqing has a character of its own even when accomplished with parametric eq plugins. And no, obviously I was not talking about driving anything to distortion, but the ever present saturation in analog gear emulated to plugins being a distinct psrt of the sound. |
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Post by drumsound on Jun 9, 2023 12:53:13 GMT -6
They all use math, they all model analog eqs, and they all have a sound even if they do not product any distortion. Older EQs and poorer modern ones mostly used abstracted models of analog eqs to try to model the result of the analog eq, ie direct form biquadratic filters. Good clean modern EQs concretely model what the individual electrical components of an analog eq do, eg Andy Simper or Vadim Zavalishin state variable filters. These lack the numerical errors of the direct form filters. They are still models even if they are not circuit models with distortion. Unfortunately there are a lot of bad plugins still being released worse than things from the 90s. Tokyo Dawn Slick EQ GE and M are what you want with their non linear sections. They are 10 dollars each on sale. Nova GE also has a "+" mode that adds in non-linearities. It sounds really good. Sonnox Oxford EQ type 4 is an almost equal power parametric EQ. It's super cool. Almost like a parametric API 550. PSP NobleQ2 is really cool. RetroQ has the shelves from vintage warmer. Very useful. Master Q2 analog button is cool and it has a cool limiter. Variety of Sound Boot EQ is free, sounds smooth, and is Windows only. Kirchoff is pretty cool but I never used it when I owned it. PA Neold Big Al is pretty wicked. I've been using Slick and Slick GE for quite some time. The free one was one of the first things I got PT. Nobel Q is still a really useful one. RetroQ looks like it might be right up my alley. I had the VW way back when. and MasterQ maybe. I'll pay more attention then next time they have a sale. Crave EQ. Love it. Use it on everything. It has switchable algorithms as well so you can tailor it to your needs. That looks really interesting and affordable. Do you find yourself switching modes a lot? It seems like that would be a really useful and speedy workflow thing. I think I'm just a little bored but, I'm wondering about EQs that aren't trying to be something analog, and aren't just using math to simply add or subtract at X frequency. Something that maybe has a bit of a sound and a really simple and effective UI. Thoughts? I still love Massey VT3, the mid band is excellent on electric guitar. I remember people talking about Massey a lot in the early PT days, when I was still staying away. I like the simple aspect for sure. I don’t know many of that kind when i think about it. When I want something colorless and non intrusive I always use the pro tools EQ7. I feel most “specialty” eq’s tend to have something twisty to it and I go for them because of the twist which usually is the saturation factor. Hard to imagine what an eq without saturation added but with a sound would be. Well the pultec kind of does something interesting despite of circuit modeling that gives a character of its own, but nothing that you couldn’t achieve with using a few parametrics on top of each other. Yeah, I still go to EQ7 for simple cleanup and such. I was doing mix revisions with a band on Wednesday and we pulled something up and I really liked whatever I had done to the BD in the mix, and sure enough it was simple EQ7. |
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Post by antbar on Jun 9, 2023 12:58:27 GMT -6
On certain rainy days, the only thing I miss about PT is the Massey VT3! Loved that EQ. Perfect for a simpleton like myself. Turn the knobs, the sound changes - always for the better. Great for synths, vocals... whether just a slight enhancement or a radical tonal overhaul, but the VT3 was always my friend.
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Post by svart on Jun 9, 2023 13:47:43 GMT -6
Crave EQ. Love it. Use it on everything. It has switchable algorithms as well so you can tailor it to your needs. That looks really interesting and affordable. Do you find yourself switching modes a lot? It seems like that would be a really useful and speedy workflow thing. Not really. I've done a lot of A/B and while I can hear a very slight difference when quickly switching.. In practice I usually only stick with "digital" for low CPU usage or "transparent" for max quality on stuff like vocals that might need it. |
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Post by christopher on Jun 9, 2023 14:50:56 GMT -6
ReaEQ in reaper has a sound I guess. At 44.1 it has a gentle low pass across the whole thing that starts to affect around 14k and up iirc. So you can boost 18k all you want but you are unknowingly fighting a deep roll off filter LOL. People realized this when trying to compare to Fabfilter. The developer explained it was on purpose. I still use it quite often, it’s just easy. I don’t know if they ever changed it. In Reaper (and other DAWs) what it says on the meters/plugins and what comes out the converters can be pretty different. But don’t ever try to explain that to folks lol
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2023 21:06:52 GMT -6
ReaEQ in reaper has a sound I guess. At 44.1 it has a gentle low pass across the whole thing that starts to affect around 14k and up iirc. So you can boost 18k all you want but you are unknowingly fighting a deep roll off filter LOL. People realized this when trying to compare to Fabfilter. The developer explained it was on purpose. I still use it quite often, it’s just easy. I don’t know if they ever changed it. In Reaper (and other DAWs) what it says on the meters/plugins and what comes out the converters can be pretty different. But don’t ever try to explain that to folks lol There's no roll off; it's just a bog standard biquad eq with cramping. Check out ReEQ for free SVF eq with oversampling. Pretty good. forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=213501 |
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Post by christopher on Jun 9, 2023 21:42:03 GMT -6
Thanks Dan. Is that what it is that’s going on? Very over my head.. apologies. ReEQ looks pretty cool. Quick Question.. you know so much of this stuff, so I figure you must develop? Is there some stuff you might release or have released? You don’t have to answer that of course. If you did, I’d try it though  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2023 0:47:41 GMT -6
Thanks Dan. Is that what it is that’s going on? Very over my head.. apologies. ReEQ looks pretty cool. Quick Question.. you know so much of this stuff, so I figure you must develop? Is there some stuff you might release or have released? You don’t have to answer that of course. If you did, I’d try it though The frequency response starts getting weird after about 4 kHz at 44.1/48 kHz!
No. I can barely code and was sick of crappy sound from cheap gear and old plugs a long time ago so I started testing every plugin after I lost woofers from the low end noise in bad digital eqs and DC offset in distorted older compressors.
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Post by vvvooojjj on Jun 10, 2023 3:35:40 GMT -6
I like to use Kirchhoff and Weiss MP for clean digital eq duties.
I don't know why but I feel that the Weiss mp doesn't push vocals as back as Kirchhoff when cutting from 2-4k.
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Post by tkaitkai on Jun 10, 2023 11:59:12 GMT -6
Kirchhoff definitely does something special compared to other clean digital EQ plugs. Especially with OS + 117bit enabled, and phase mode set to 'analog' or 'mix'. It's subtle, but it sounds better than FF to me.
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Post by ab101 on Jun 10, 2023 13:42:54 GMT -6
Crave is fantastic. (Best I found for bayin - low drum of tablas.)
Disclaimer: Have not tried Kirchhoff.
Love the TDR plugs.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jun 10, 2023 19:42:48 GMT -6
How much does the Crave EQ cost? I couldn't find out at their website.
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Post by ab101 on Jun 10, 2023 20:24:54 GMT -6
How much does the Crave EQ cost? I couldn't find out at their website. $69 through Crave (look at the shopping cart image near the top of this web page). cravedsp.com/crave-eqMaybe it is less elsewhere. I do not recall paying that much. All the best. |
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Post by bgrotto on Jun 10, 2023 21:05:41 GMT -6
My 'go to' eq for most purposes is Kirchhoff. The UI is excellent, and to my ears it edges out Fab Filter on sound, plus it has a far superior dynamic eq toolset.
When I'm dealing with LF-heavy instruments -- especially with large transients, like kick -- I really like the Empirical Big Freq. There's something to that thing in the low end that just sounds tight and right. You can also dial in some 'analog flavor' using the Finisher knob, which can be really groovy. It's also particularly good with cuts, to my ear. Not sure why, but it seems capable of pulling away mud or other spectral nuisance without sucking out too much energy or 'vibe' from a sound.
Lately I'm having similar results with the Pulsar GML clone. Good, clear cuts, and a nice tight bottom end. But that one's real highlight for me is the de-esser, oddly enough. I like the way the HF works on vocals, and the way the De Esser interacts with all that. Makes dialing in a lead vocal really easy.
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Post by drumsound on Jun 11, 2023 2:36:06 GMT -6
My 'go to' eq for most purposes is Kirchhoff. The UI is excellent, and to my ears it edges out Fab Filter on sound, plus it has a far superior dynamic eq toolset. When I'm dealing with LF-heavy instruments -- especially with large transients, like kick -- I really like the Empirical Big Freq. There's something to that thing in the low end that just sounds tight and right. You can also dial in some 'analog flavor' using the Finisher knob, which can be really groovy. It's also particularly good with cuts, to my ear. Not sure why, but it seems capable of pulling away mud or other spectral nuisance without sucking out too much energy or 'vibe' from a sound. Lately I'm having similar results with the Pulsar GML clone. Good, clear cuts, and a nice tight bottom end. But that one's real highlight for me is the de-esser, oddly enough. I like the way the HF works on vocals, and the way the De Esser interacts with all that. Makes dialing in a lead vocal really easy. There's a desser built into the Pulsar GML EQ? That's pretty interesting. |
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Post by sentientsound on Jun 11, 2023 3:29:57 GMT -6
Check out Voxengo's HarmoniEQ: www.voxengo.com/product/harmonieq/Super simple UI and unique processing. Sounds great. The filters can be static or dynamic - you control the overall strength of the action and choose either compression or expansion behavior. The dynamic effect works on the overall signal so it's not really like the usual dynamic EQ. The whole thing generates harmonics from the difference signal (I'm guessing here) so the harmonics vary based on your EQ and output stage settings. The harnonics and filters are clean and anlalog-ish but it works mostly like any modern plugin EQ. Even with the output stage bypassed it's a cool EQ.. Tip - use the dual-mono routing mode on stereo stuff. www.wavesfactory.com/audio-plugins/spectre/Wavesfactory Spectre is good too. Boost-only EQ with mid-side available per-band, and capable of stronger drive or outright distortion. It also has a de-emphasis mode to saturate specific bands of frequency without changing gain much. |
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Post by drumsound on Jun 11, 2023 23:04:07 GMT -6
Check out Voxengo's HarmoniEQ: www.voxengo.com/product/harmonieq/Super simple UI and unique processing. Sounds great. The filters can be static or dynamic - you control the overall strength of the action and choose either compression or expansion behavior. The dynamic effect works on the overall signal so it's not really like the usual dynamic EQ. The whole thing generates harmonics from the difference signal (I'm guessing here) so the harmonics vary based on your EQ and output stage settings. The harnonics and filters are clean and anlalog-ish but it works mostly like any modern plugin EQ. Even with the output stage bypassed it's a cool EQ.. Tip - use the dual-mono routing mode on stereo stuff. www.wavesfactory.com/audio-plugins/spectre/Wavesfactory Spectre is good too. Boost-only EQ with mid-side available per-band, and capable of stronger drive or outright distortion. It also has a de-emphasis mode to saturate specific bands of frequency without changing gain much. HarmoniEQ looks really freaking interesting. How's the UI? |
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Post by sentientsound on Jun 12, 2023 1:34:10 GMT -6
UI is great. Easy and fast, intuitive enough to figure out without reading the user guide (although that's highly recommended).
You can customize the look of all his plugins and the analyzer response to taste.
Give it a try,
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Post by aremos on Jun 12, 2023 9:09:44 GMT -6
Does anyone still use, or even like, Waves R-EQ (Rennaisance)?
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