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Post by ninworks on May 25, 2023 7:48:06 GMT -6
Is it regional or has the used recording gear market all but gone away? It seems like every time I try to sell something recently it gets almost no activity even though I'm listing it at below market value. The only responses I get are scammers. I'm not going to GIVE away high-end gear for peanuts but that's all anyone seems to be interested in lately. I ended up pulling the listings for my matched pair of Purple Audio Biz mic preamps from about a half dozen sites yesterday. I dropped the price $75 each and still no responses. I don't need the money so I don't have to sell them. I'll list them again in a month or two and see if I can get any activity then. If not I'll just keep them. They are great units. I just don't need them anymore.
Does it have to do with the announcement that Apple Music is now requiring ATMOS mixes and everyone is gun-shy so nobody is investing in their home studios? I don't know. Just speculating.
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Post by phdamage on May 25, 2023 7:59:03 GMT -6
I think it's just a function of the economy tanking a bit. I just sold some stuff for way cheaper than I would have gotten for it a year ago. the fed is trying to "discipline" labor and there is a ton of price gouging out there for necessities. gotta love living in an oligarchy
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Post by niklas1073 on May 25, 2023 8:28:32 GMT -6
Yep, market has been dead since beginning of covid. Hard to sell anything, easy to make deals of your lifetime. But this is equal to every market during crisis. Some who take the risk might score big time… most goes into save mode
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Post by Johnkenn on May 25, 2023 9:10:30 GMT -6
It ain’t Covid.
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Post by niklas1073 on May 25, 2023 9:22:55 GMT -6
I sure do remember that started the first wave of musicians beginning selling their gear off at low prices as the shut downs killed the income. That didn't really take a proper turn around before the instability in energy, economy and security turned a new chapter. Even though the economy is slowly stabalizing it sure will take some time before we can see people investing in a branch as music production. Underlying and on top of all this the long term change in the industry of course where fewer studios are needed and production methods change. |
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Post by christopher on May 25, 2023 10:09:51 GMT -6
I’m pretty sure it’s that people buy stuff when debt is cheap and investments are up. Debt got expensive and Wall Street got hit hard last year, slowly trying to get back up. Real estate should be dropping back as that’s why they raise rates, but it’s stable. They need cost of living to tank before they can lower rates again. The last thing they want is someone working at the grocery store making 1980’s union wages to survive. But the Fed is talking pausing rate hikes. Maybe they’ll be ok with inflation causing pay raises across the board? I doubt it, as retirees on Social Security already barely suffer to get by, can’t have inflation without needing to raise payments. Or all the elderly gonna be shacking up with the grandkids
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Post by notneeson on May 25, 2023 10:14:46 GMT -6
Whatever the case it’s a good time to buy. I’m selling that Mesa combo amp I listed in the classifieds today after months on Craigslist and the guy is getting it for peanuts.
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Post by kelk on May 25, 2023 10:22:37 GMT -6
It's a good time to buy used pro audio. Vintage instruments on the other hand are nuts at the moment.
A friend of mine bought a 1960 Les Paul Jr for 6k about 4years ago.. These last months two other ones in worse shape were going for 12k-14k online.
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Post by kcatthedog on May 25, 2023 10:22:48 GMT -6
I think lots of peeps over bought over last few years, so there aren’t that many buyers and lots of people selling .
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 25, 2023 10:29:18 GMT -6
The supply chain issues drove used prices up, now we are in a period of adjustment as to what “market price “ really is. Sellers seam to be using historically high recent sales as their benchmark while buyers are using pre COVID numbers as their’s. Add recent uncertainty about the US debt limit and nobody is buying.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 25, 2023 14:45:02 GMT -6
One other thing that is effecting the used market is shipping costs, more and more people seam to use it as a profit center. Example auction for a bunch of lots of cheap made in China LED PARs, $109 to ship from LV to KC. Umm you showed the original sealed box think I can’t track down size and shipping weight? Without a deal UPS ground of a box 2in bigger in each dimension and 5lbs heavier ( think double boxed) is $60 !
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Post by viciousbliss on May 25, 2023 19:48:40 GMT -6
I'd been looking at buying a Black Box and the used prices were almost the same as new. One listed at $3200 just sold, but I don't know what the final prices was. Looks like even a months ago that one sold for around $2700. Seen some SHMC listed around 7-7.5k with the PSU included. So far I haven't made any offers to go lower. What's the deal with this Atmos thing anyway? Atmos was the only format I could find Machinery of Torment in from Metal Lords and I found it strange to listen to on headphones. Audio Animals just setup an Atmos studio and are saying it's the next big thing. I think they said they spent something like 100k pounds on it. If everyone is gonna have to invest big money in Atmos gear, then yeah, I could see why they wouldn't be buying more analog stereo stuff and would be selling a lot.
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Post by smashlord on May 25, 2023 21:34:22 GMT -6
Reverb is a ghost town and what is there is usually a bit overpriced. As someone else mentioned, alot of items are just under *advertised* new pricing with shipping costs that bring them up over new. If you have a guy at a music retailer, you can often get new stuff cheaper than what people are asking for used stuff.
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Post by viciousbliss on May 25, 2023 23:28:53 GMT -6
Reverb is a ghost town and what is there is usually a bit overpriced. As someone else mentioned, alot of items are just under *advertised* new pricing with shipping costs that bring them up over new. If you have a guy at a music retailer, you can often get new stuff cheaper than what people are asking for used stuff. My SW guy didn't budge on the Aurora N price and is telling me he can't discount Shadow Hills. And if I want additional time added to financing, like 18 months or whatever, I have to pay around an 8% fee. VK guy is the opposite, trying to accommodate everything and promising me discounts. When I read old threads, I see that a lot of this hardware was thousands cheaper. Shadow Hills for 6-7k instead of close to 10k. Is there a best way to invoke these discounts? |
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Post by the other mark williams on May 26, 2023 6:48:16 GMT -6
Reverb is a ghost town and what is there is usually a bit overpriced. As someone else mentioned, alot of items are just under *advertised* new pricing with shipping costs that bring them up over new. If you have a guy at a music retailer, you can often get new stuff cheaper than what people are asking for used stuff. My SW guy didn't budge on the Aurora N price and is telling me he can't discount Shadow Hills. And if I want additional time added to financing, like 18 months or whatever, I have to pay around an 8% fee. VK guy is the opposite, trying to accommodate everything and promising me discounts. When I read old threads, I see that a lot of this hardware was thousands cheaper. Shadow Hills for 6-7k instead of close to 10k. Is there a best way to invoke these discounts? Wait ‘til retailers catch up with market realities. |
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Post by Ward on May 26, 2023 7:33:23 GMT -6
The supply chain issues drove used prices up, now we are in a period of adjustment as to what “market price “ really is. Sellers seam to be using historically high recent sales as their benchmark while buyers are using pre COVID numbers as their’s. Add recent uncertainty about the US debt limit and nobody is buying. Correct. And now there's a glut of new toys on the market. I think we are at the peak of the gear sales explosion now, and there are going to be some Humpty Dumptys sitting on the expansion wall, bound to take a great fall. I did my minor in economics. Cycles are cycles. The other contributing factor, since we've crossed over into the geo-poly-econimic area, is the push for CBDCs. Hard assets are going to be a lot more valuable, and enough people know this to hold on to them now. Currency isn't as solid if it isn't tangible. Those who monkey with the system are going to find that common folk aren't quite as blind as they think and the whole 2020-2022 situation awakened a lot of people. Just a couple words to the wise. |
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Post by sparky on May 26, 2023 22:49:12 GMT -6
Things in Australia are insanely overpriced on the used market which is pretty normal, but it's gone from bad to worse. Folks are asking ridiculous prices. Shipping from O/S is cost-prohibitive compared to pre-COVID as well so I'm getting by with what I have. I'm house hunting at the moment and looking to upgrade my studio setup but will have to be more frugal than I'd hoped.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2023 1:46:04 GMT -6
I think with vintage analog gear in particular, you can't discount how many trust fund kids with nice portfolios saw a pretty hefty return on tech stocks and crypto in '20 and '21. And, at least in NYC, I can tell you that at least half of the studios that exist are inherited money going into building the space. Nothing wrong with it but it's the reality of what is now a luxury product. A lot of Hainbachs out there in the world - good intentions and some taste but even more money. They bid up everything classic, the dealers and retailers pushed the new and used market, supply chain for esoteric transformers and tubes got squeezed and now, as with every other company, the big shops are going to lean hard on customers for as long as they can before price reality sets in. You also had very very favorable financing terms to people with suspect credit and that's now reversing. The prices on the weird stuff will be coming down with the market downturn and inflation tamed. Neves, Pultecs, UREI, etc? Probably never. That’s a lot of these studios. Let them them have all the old crap to make distorted lofi. They don’t have good taste. People have to accept that the meme stuff is gone and the weird stuff was cooler anyway. The recordings that stood out often used hohum or weird stuff. The later records from bands that used money stuff or classics often don’t sound as good. They sound generic. The lofi trust fund crap is dirtier than cassette recordings from 80s and 90s Then the trust funds and programmers find out that abusing distorted stuff just makes their poor recordings and bad music sound shitty and plastic. It can’t hide shit, it accentuates it. Posers. |
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Post by thehightenor on May 27, 2023 2:32:42 GMT -6
Things in Australia are insanely overpriced on the used market which is pretty normal, but it's gone from bad to worse. Folks are asking ridiculous prices. Shipping from O/S is cost-prohibitive compared to pre-COVID as well so I'm getting by with what I have. I'm house hunting at the moment and looking to upgrade my studio setup but will have to be more frugal than I'd hoped. Yep, around my part of the world I see no bargains. Just people asking for close on the new price for second hand. In some cases more for second hand then new! Go figure that! Nuts. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 27, 2023 9:17:46 GMT -6
I think with vintage analog gear in particular, you can't discount how many trust fund kids with nice portfolios saw a pretty hefty return on tech stocks and crypto in '20 and '21. And, at least in NYC, I can tell you that at least half of the studios that exist are inherited money going into building the space. Nothing wrong with it but it's the reality of what is now a luxury product. A lot of Hainbachs out there in the world - good intentions and some taste but even more money. They bid up everything classic, the dealers and retailers pushed the new and used market, supply chain for esoteric transformers and tubes got squeezed and now, as with every other company, the big shops are going to lean hard on customers for as long as they can before price reality sets in. You also had very very favorable financing terms to people with suspect credit and that's now reversing. The prices on the weird stuff will be coming down with the market downturn and inflation tamed. Neves, Pultecs, UREI, etc? Probably never. Even worse for HiFi audio. Every 28 yr old NYC hedge funder has a $15 McIntosh amplifier wired (out of phase usually) into a pair of danish speakers. This usually set up on a bookshelf or in an unused fireplace. Painful to see. Literally had a friend tell me “hey can you get this working while you’re here?” Talking about $25k of stereo equipment going totally unused. |
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Post by EmRR on May 27, 2023 9:27:54 GMT -6
I had all sorts of vintage gear that had been listed at various forums for a decade, all of which would have sold immediately had it been at ebay. It all suddenly went in 2020, with increased prices. Probably because it suddenly looked like a deal compared to the related fishing expeditions you could find when comparing. Lots of the fishing expeditions are still listed, multiple years in, prices dropped to half but still way over actual market. If you’re only considering short term flipper gains, the market is down, but most of what i deal with is still up a lot looking at the 5 and 10 year. Many things up 2000% looking at the 20 year.
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Post by hadaja on May 27, 2023 10:04:33 GMT -6
Things in Australia are insanely overpriced on the used market which is pretty normal, but it's gone from bad to worse. Folks are asking ridiculous prices. Shipping from O/S is cost-prohibitive compared to pre-COVID as well so I'm getting by with what I have. I'm house hunting at the moment and looking to upgrade my studio setup but will have to be more frugal than I'd hoped. Welcome Sparky to RGO from fellow Brisvegas user. hope you are enjoying yur experience here. I feel your pain regarding house hunting. Its a daunting experiencewith the over inflated prices. which part of Aust are you from? |
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Post by indiehouse on May 27, 2023 11:29:02 GMT -6
It's the same old pandemic story. New gear in short supply due to parts, labor and shipping issues. Gov't handing out checks left and right, people weren't spending as much on other things, more spending money all around. Supply went down, demand went up. Used gear was fetching crazy money, so people started cashing in. Now, things are different. The economy is in the shithouse. Inflation went through the roof, and everyone cashed in on that excuse and raised their prices, even if they didn't have to.
The world has moved on. Yet people still want top dollar pandemic pricing for their used gear. But in general, people aren't willing to pay those prices anymore, so it sits.
I'm much more careful on what I spend my money on now, because moving gear has become a giant PITA. I've got some pieces up for sale that I really don't want to let go, but my dollar doesn't go as far as it did a couple years ago.
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Post by drbill on May 27, 2023 14:54:50 GMT -6
Some used gear seems to be holding value. Didn't I just see a Fairchild 670 for well over $300,000? Gone now it seems....maybe it sold?
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Post by EmRR on May 27, 2023 17:40:42 GMT -6
Some used gear seems to be holding value. Didn't I just see a Fairchild 670 for well over $300,000? Gone now it seems....maybe it sold? Yeah, listed by the buzzard who has everything at 4x+ market value. Has a bunch of stuff that came from me at 4x what I just sold it for (some in the aforementioned category of "I had it for sale for 10 years with no takers"), been sitting unsold at the new prices for a couple years, duh. Most of what's visible in vintage is fishing expeditions, the real dealing is offline. |
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