ericn
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Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107 
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Post by ericn on Feb 4, 2023 10:19:14 GMT -6
Oh yeah, those colors. They look horrible. Well yeah they look like Seltzer cans but, anyone who has been around long enough has had someone say something like “ I want it to sound Green” well now we know what green sounds like😎 |
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Post by drbill on Feb 4, 2023 11:00:14 GMT -6
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 4, 2023 11:09:05 GMT -6
There was an Apple ad not too long ago promoting their laptop's new colors. That's fine, but they raved about it like it was an amazing new feature. To me it was silly, perhaps to a younger crowd not so much.
I can't imagine the meetings that must have taken place to decide on those awful colors for the Bock. They're basically a classic mic update, cream, silver or black would make sense. If they were going to do a color, the least they should have done was pick something bold and new, not a washed out Martha Stewart towel color.
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Post by phantom on Feb 4, 2023 11:19:58 GMT -6
There was an Apple ad not too long ago promoting their laptop's new colors. That's fine, but they raved about it like it was an amazing new feature. To me it was silly, perhaps to a younger crowd not so much. I can't imagine the meetings that must have taken place to decide on those awful colors for the Bock. They're basically a classic mic update, cream, silver or black would make sense. If they were going to do a color, the least they should have done was pick something bold and new, not a washed out Martha Stewart towel color. The new generation of youtubers is going to love those new colors. They will probably sell their vintage U67 to buy these. |
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Post by Ward on Feb 4, 2023 11:37:25 GMT -6
SNIP Let's be honest here, none of us know what happened with Bock. Ummm, yeah. Some people here cover by NDAs do. Everything I've gotten second hand (us gear marketing consultants talk but keep our mouths shut) backs up many of the comments I've read here. It'll all come out. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bock microphones become separate stand alone company again, controlled by Mr. Bock, who is a hella good individual. |
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Post by Quint on Feb 4, 2023 11:44:14 GMT -6
The odds of UA sticking with Bock's quality standards are slim to none. If they wanted his standards they would not have fired him. We don’t know the initial compensation deal. He might have negotiated a high package at first, which then appeared expensive in the downturn, making him vulnerable. It could just be about money coming in and going out the door ? HR legal semantics but lay off is different than firing, in terms of legal implications, cause etc.? If David being let go, fired, laid off, whatever was always in the cards from day 1, I don't think he would have angrily posted about it online. That, to me, is an indication that something caused a rift between him and UA. We don't know what that reason might be, but there have been some pretty good speculations in this thread. Either way, it doesn't sound like they parted on amicable terms, regardless of whether blame lies with one party, the other, or both. That much, if nothing else, seems pretty clear. |
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Post by Ward on Feb 4, 2023 11:46:14 GMT -6
Cloning one's own electrical circuit is much easier than emulating it in software Then . . . Why do so many get it wrong? Have you had an opportunity to take apart and examine or listen intently/use intensely a vintage piece of kit versus a reissue? (Neumann AKG API included - with no disrespect at all, just using examples of legacy makers still in business)I've lost hair (I couldn't afford to lose) scratching my head wondering what some trademark owners were thinking . . . Not slagging, just asking . . . what were they thinking? |
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Post by chessparov on Feb 4, 2023 12:05:54 GMT -6
I got in trouble for saying that when they were introduced......  Well you must have said it on Taco Tuesday. Lime is a sacred color then. St. Patricks? I can only imagine. (Don't worry I have a slew rate of Irish jokes up my sleeve) Nothing to Bock at I assure you. Chris |
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Post by chessparov on Feb 4, 2023 12:11:31 GMT -6
SNIP Let's be honest here, none of us know what happened with Bock. Ummm, yeah. Some people here cover by NDAs do. Everything I've gotten second hand (us gear marketing consultants talk but keep our mouths shut) backs up many of the comments I've read here. It'll all come out. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bock microphones become separate stand alone company again, controlled by Mr. Bock, who is a hella good individual. +1 David's a great guy. Has a really funny dry sense of humor too. Including a couple of insightful responses, when "Grasshopper" here asked him some stuff in person. (His wife has a wonderful Contralto voice too BTW) Chris |
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Post by ab101 on Feb 4, 2023 13:10:44 GMT -6
...Has a really funny dry sense of humor too. ... Chris Is he going to name the new line Switched on Bock? Bock to the Future? I hope he is freed up to do exactly what he wants to do. He was very helpful to me when I had some Soundelux U95s mics. |
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Post by Ward on Feb 4, 2023 13:20:30 GMT -6
...Has a really funny dry sense of humor too. ... Chris Is he going to name the new line Switched on Bock? Bock to the Future? I hope he is freed up to do exactly what he wants to do. He was very helpful to me when I had some Soundelux U95s mics. Maybe he'll tempt the devil and come out with a line of NewMan microphones . . . indicating he's a new man, so a resurrection of sorts. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 4, 2023 14:07:31 GMT -6
Quint I wasn’t implying it was planned, perhaps inadvertent, if UA was chasing him, perhaps he said ok for X$, and it was high, but UA agreed, then the downturn, supply issues and release delays, then that hiring/carrying cost started to look high, bean counter logic came to the fore, rather than his carrying cost being seen as an investment in a different more innovative ua product future and David was gone. It seems truly a lost opportunity.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107
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Post by ericn on Feb 4, 2023 15:05:27 GMT -6
Is he going to name the new line Switched on Bock? Bock to the Future? I hope he is freed up to do exactly what he wants to do. He was very helpful to me when I had some Soundelux U95s mics. Maybe he'll tempt the devil and come out with a line of NewMan microphones . . . indicating he's a new man, so a resurrection of sorts. Someone already did the Newman Jerry, they were just repackaged Chinese LDC’s. |
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Post by plinker on Feb 4, 2023 15:34:29 GMT -6
Cloning one's own electrical circuit is much easier than emulating it in software Then . . . Why do so many get it wrong? Have you had an opportunity to take apart and examine or listen intently/use intensely a vintage piece of kit versus a reissue? (Neumann AKG API included - with no disrespect at all, just using examples of legacy makers still in business)I've lost hair (I couldn't afford to lose) scratching my head wondering what some trademark owners were thinking . . . Not slagging, just asking . . . what were they thinking? Nope -- I have no desire to take apart and examine or listen intently/use intensely a vintage piece of kit versus a reissue.
However, I HAVE been a professional software engineer for the last 24 years, with a chunk of that time doing distributed signal processing (DSP) and acoustic analysis, and know very well how difficult it is to model real-world systems in software.
Unlike cloning an electrical circuit: 1. there is no schematic to follow.
2. there's no Reference Architecture for the software.
3. you can't just open the hood and reverse-engineer components (e.g., unwinding a transformer)
I have heard clones/reissues of a vintage mics that sounded good. However, I haven't heard a microphone modeller that was very good. That's because it's freaking hard to do it in software/DSP.
I don't know why companies don't/won't do a proper reissue of there own designs -- that's a question only they can answer -- but I imagine cost is a large factor.
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 4, 2023 15:41:52 GMT -6
Well, we don't really know anything about the details do we. I have three friends whose companies were bought out. Two stayed on for 1 1/2 years, one stayed with the company. Sticking around for a while and then leaving is actually more the norm than unusual. It doesn't necessarily mean something's wrong, though it very well may be so. I'm interested in hearing Bock's U-67 style mic. I don't like the colors they chose, but if it sounds great, that really is no big deal. Well,I have an ear to a particular rumor mill, and the word is that he has already or is in the process of moving back North. My impression is that he was told that he cost too much, or something similar. |
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Post by Quint on Feb 4, 2023 15:42:08 GMT -6
Quint I wasn’t implying it was planned, perhaps inadvertent, if UA was chasing him, perhaps he said ok for X$, and it was high, but UA agreed, then the downturn, supply issues and release delays, then that hiring/carrying cost started to look high, bean counter logic came to the fore, rather than his carrying cost being seen as an investment in a different more innovative ua product future and David was gone. It seems truly a lost opportunity. Yeah, I wasn't saying that you thought the way that this all went down was planned to go down exactly like it did. It may have been planned that he would exit at some point, but I nor you nor probably most people are you viewing his current exit as something that all went down according to the original plan. So we're not in disagreement there. We're saying the same thing. I was just pointing out that it seems clear that things didn't go down according to the original plan, whatever that original plan was. It's probably the one thing that we can all agree on about what happened. The "why" is another matter. Who knows what went down exactly. We just know that it doesn't look to be amicable or planned. I think you're probably right, at least on some counts, about what transpired that led to all of this. |
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 4, 2023 15:47:20 GMT -6
Cloning one's own electrical circuit is much easier than emulating it in software Then . . . Why do so many get it wrong? Have you had an opportunity to take apart and examine or listen intently/use intensely a vintage piece of kit versus a reissue? (Neumann AKG API included - with no disrespect at all, just using examples of legacy makers still in business)I've lost hair (I couldn't afford to lose) scratching my head wondering what some trademark owners were thinking . . . Not slagging, just asking . . . what were they thinking? Oh boy... You really wanna know?
Ok. Beans. Thay were thinking about beans. Certainly not audio gear, but that's been pretty obvious for a long time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2023 15:59:06 GMT -6
Cloning one's own electrical circuit is much easier than emulating it in software Then . . . Why do so many get it wrong? Have you had an opportunity to take apart and examine or listen intently/use intensely a vintage piece of kit versus a reissue? (Neumann AKG API included - with no disrespect at all, just using examples of legacy makers still in business)I've lost hair (I couldn't afford to lose) scratching my head wondering what some trademark owners were thinking . . . Not slagging, just asking . . . what were they thinking? Rent seeking behavior, value engineering, and letting guys who have never repaired squat design gear meant to hold up to a drummer drumming everywhere he can. |
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 4, 2023 17:22:18 GMT -6
Quint I wasn’t implying it was planned, perhaps inadvertent, if UA was chasing him, perhaps he said ok for X$, and it was high, but UA agreed, then the downturn, supply issues and release delays, then that hiring/carrying cost started to look high, bean counter logic came to the fore, rather than his carrying cost being seen as an investment in a different more innovative ua product future and David was gone. It seems truly a lost opportunity. Yeah, I wasn't saying that you thought the way that this all went down was planned to go down exactly like it did. It may have been planned that he would exit at some point, but I nor you nor probably most people are you viewing his current exit as something that all went down according to the original plan. So we're not in disagreement there. We're saying the same thing. I was just pointing out that it seems clear that things didn't go down according to the original plan, whatever that original plan was. It's probably the one thing that we can all agree on about what happened. The "why" is another matter. Who knows what went down exactly. We just know that it doesn't look to be amicable or planned. I think you're probably right, at least on some counts, about what transpired that led to all of this. I hate to say this, but I think it might be a matter of exactly WHOSE "original plan" we're talking about... |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107
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Post by ericn on Feb 4, 2023 17:34:26 GMT -6
Yeah, I wasn't saying that you thought the way that this all went down was planned to go down exactly like it did. It may have been planned that he would exit at some point, but I nor you nor probably most people are you viewing his current exit as something that all went down according to the original plan. So we're not in disagreement there. We're saying the same thing. I was just pointing out that it seems clear that things didn't go down according to the original plan, whatever that original plan was. It's probably the one thing that we can all agree on about what happened. The "why" is another matter. Who knows what went down exactly. We just know that it doesn't look to be amicable or planned. I think you're probably right, at least on some counts, about what transpired that led to all of this. I hate to say this, but I think it might be a matter of exactly WHOSE "original plan" we're talking about... Nailed it, the problem always is this: people will often say what ever it takes to make the deal, often even put it in writing. The trick is the most successful people in buisness are not experts in Econ, accounting, what ever field they are in, no it’s all about understanding people and how to manipulate them. |
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 4, 2023 17:38:14 GMT -6
I hate to say this, but I think it might be a matter of exactly WHOSE "original plan" we're talking about... Nailed it, the problem always is this: people will often say what ever it takes to make the deal, often even put it in writing. The trick is the most successful people in buisness are not experts in Econ, accounting, what ever field they are in, no it’s all about understanding people and how to manipulate them. Or, to put it more simply, they are experts at lying. The better they lie, the bigger they get. |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,107
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Post by ericn on Feb 4, 2023 18:09:49 GMT -6
Nailed it, the problem always is this: people will often say what ever it takes to make the deal, often even put it in writing. The trick is the most successful people in buisness are not experts in Econ, accounting, what ever field they are in, no it’s all about understanding people and how to manipulate them. Or, to put it more simply, they are experts at lying. The better they lie, the bigger they get. It’s more of telling people what they want to hear than anything. |
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Post by jeremygillespie on Feb 4, 2023 18:47:36 GMT -6
This stuff happens all the time. Seems like a mountain is being made of a mole hill. Mr Bock makes great mics, I’m sure he will continue to make great mics. I’ve got a bunch of UA gear, interfaces, plugs - I also think they are great. Sometimes the plan that looks great on paper doesn’t work so great in reality. Slinging shit around doesn’t really seem to get anybody anywhere honestly… I’m sure both parties will move on from this with new found information on what direction they wish to travel and hopefully it will be more rewarding for everybody involved and in the end - all of us included!
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 4, 2023 19:27:23 GMT -6
Now, somebody tell UAD to make one of those Bock 67's or 251's for $1199 for me please ;-)
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 4, 2023 22:37:41 GMT -6
This stuff happens all the time. Seems like a mountain is being made of a mole hill. Mr Bock makes great mics, I’m sure he will continue to make great mics. I’ve got a bunch of UA gear, interfaces, plugs - I also think they are great. Sometimes the plan that looks great on paper doesn’t work so great in reality. Slinging shit around doesn’t really seem to get anybody anywhere honestly… I’m sure both parties will move on from this with new found information on what direction they wish to travel and hopefully it will be more rewarding for everybody involved and in the end - all of us included! Oh, WHY am I so cynical about these things??? |
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