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Post by bchurch on Dec 24, 2022 13:30:44 GMT -6
Not sure what did it for me... the constant bickering and preening, the odd mix of people who either knew far too much or not much at all. Or maybe it's the Compuserve-era looking interface. But one day I had just had it. I might occasionally wind up there as a result of a google search for something, but as far as being an active participant I have no interest.
Please, somebody respond with "clearly you don't know anything because you don't continue to fawn over Dire Straits' 'Brothers in Arms' as the best thing ever recorded" (it isn't) or some Albini-esque tirade about me mis-stating the 1.8v/μs slew rate of a Jensen 990 op-amp.
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Post by geoff738 on Dec 24, 2022 16:21:20 GMT -6
Yeah, haven’t been over there in years. I just come here and bug you guys.
Cheers, Geoff
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Post by svart on Dec 25, 2022 18:41:55 GMT -6
I was. I questioned one of the vendor/sponsors about some obviously shady BS there and got a nasty message from a moderator about it threatening me with a ban.
I heard that others were getting the same treatment and that there would be new forum to go to and I was one of the first to sign up.
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Post by gwlee7 on Dec 25, 2022 19:41:01 GMT -6
Y’all are much more accepting of dumb questions over here as long as I ask nicely.
People here don’t “lord” their knowledge and experience over anyone and that makes it a much better place to learn.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Dec 26, 2022 0:01:24 GMT -6
When I was working at a studio with an SSL room, there was a producer in who wanted to do something on the SSL that nobody else in the room really had knowledge on and I got a call at like 10:30pm to ask if I knew how do “situate”.
I tried to explain over the phone to a few folks how to make it happen, wound up having to drive my ass over there.
Producer “I know there is a way to get this done, I even asked on gearslutz if anybody knew how to help and got no responses”
Me “….uhhhh yeah”
Took care of it in like 3 mins and that one thing had me a job for 2 years.
I don’t think too much of gearslutz. Even when I was a kid coming up and didn’t know anything, it seemed like a group of folks that liked to argue more than they enjoyed spreading information and helping each other.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2022 1:13:31 GMT -6
I've had many accounts there and have mostly deleted them in anger mostly over people apologizing for horrible practices and total crap.
The biggest issue is gearslutz deleting accounts over people criticizing horrible behavior or horrible corporate practices past and present from certain companies, e.g. Behringer Music Group, Gibson, Sennheiser, Beyerdynamic, Focal, Amphion, Pulsar Modular, Joe Meek, SSL, Presonus, etc who's the guy that made the Pye Clones a while back? and poor products from companies who make mostly good ones. Many manufacturers make great analog hardware and horrible plugins or their lineup is great and one or two products are absolutely horrific. There's often criticism elsewhere on the internet but not on the slutz space.
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Post by bchurch on Dec 26, 2022 9:34:49 GMT -6
Yeah, Dan - I got bounced over mocking SSL for their "4K mode" on their "legendary SSL mic preamps" on a $250 USB2 interface. Perhaps "mocking" isn't even the right choice of words here, I was simply calling them to the mat. but you and I seem to share an Aspergers-like intolerance for that kind of thing.
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Post by drbill on Dec 26, 2022 10:34:13 GMT -6
?? I've been over there for 15+ years and have had few problems. I think it might be where on that site that one hangs out. There is drama on the internet no matter where you go.
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Post by stratboy on Dec 26, 2022 12:55:45 GMT -6
?? I've been over there for 15+ years and have had few problems. I think it might be where on that site that one hangs out. There is drama on the internet no matter where you go. Dr Bill, you are deeply respected here and there because of your resume, your willingness to help people and your demeanor online. I joined RGO in 2014 and haven’t posted on GS in many years. I just got tired of useful, interesting threads degenerating into crap slinging contests or disappearing altogether because of moderators.
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Post by copperx on Dec 26, 2022 20:46:48 GMT -6
There have always been inexperienced people with strong opinions on Gearslutz, but twenty years ago it was easier to filter them out, especially in the high end forum.
Today the site is a a total disaster. Unless I'm not following the right people.
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Post by Bat Lanyard on Dec 26, 2022 22:25:22 GMT -6
?? I've been over there for 15+ years and have had few problems. I think it might be where on that site that one hangs out. There is drama on the internet no matter where you go. Dr Bill, you are deeply respected here and there because of your resume, your willingness to help people and your demeanor online. I joined RGO in 2014 and haven’t posted on GS in many years. I just got tired of useful, interesting threads degenerating into crap slinging contests or disappearing altogether because of moderators. That's the thing. You search up old posts and there's so much goddamn info in them by people who actually did the goddamn sessions and such. That went foul over the years.
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Post by carymiller on Dec 27, 2022 1:38:37 GMT -6
My problems with Gearspace really start with attitudes. People there are not interested in social interactions anymore. There's very little PMing/story swapping. No one shares tips or experiences. Instead, you have people preening about whatever knowledge they can pretend to horde in the age of Youtube Tutorial Videos. Next. I was given an opportunity for free swag at a time which was really tumultuous in my life, and I got some Mackie Speakers which were horrible. I mean...really not great, to "review" from their mods "hooking me up". It was a curse. I wound up not doing the review because I knew I'd slag Mackie, and they wouldn't stand for it. So, the mods kind of wrote me off after that. But it was an inferior product since Equator was a company at the time, and the same amount of money could have gotten you a pair of D5s (which are still great for the money, even used). I put my whole life on the line for years making very little money as an engineer/producer. But I tried. I gave it my all. And I always relayed my experiences in posts meant to help people. Genuinely. Because that's what communities should be about (paying it forward). There's so much I've learned from great people over there...yet most of them are gone now. Or they've migrated here. I still post there sometimes, but the site is very near dead in terms of response times with most of the forums these days. And High End, which was my home away from home...is now filled with prosumer hobbyists with high paying day jobs, who moonlight as engineers with their fat wallets, while a great many pros can barely get paying work in most towns which aren't music hubs. And normally I wouldn't slag off hobbyists, but it's infuriating when I think of the great studios that have closed down while I watch people who don't really have much experience argue about which Neve clone to buy next. The home studio killed it too. Now everyone can record something somewhat passable, if bland as hell, without having to spend a lot of money. There's also a glut in this industry when it comes to new material being submitted to streaming services...which, without the gatekeeping of old, has devalued HiFi works of real art as well...it's just a mess if you're not willing to work social media as an artist now. I want to make records which sound like they should be on the radio. That's it. I'm pretty much tired of settling for anything less. So that's what I'm gonna do. I could give a hoot about anything else.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2022 2:54:29 GMT -6
But it was an inferior product since Equator was a company at the time, and the same amount of money could have gotten you a pair of D5s (which are still great for the money, even used). I put my whole life on the line for years making very little money as an engineer/producer. But I tried. I gave it my all. And I always relayed my experiences in posts meant to help people. Genuinely. Because that's what communities should be about (paying it forward). There's so much I've learned from great people over there...yet most of them are gone now. Or they've migrated here. I still post there sometimes, but the site is very near dead in terms of response times with most of the forums these days. And High End, which was my home away from home...is now filled with prosumer hobbyists with high paying day jobs, who moonlight as engineers with their fat wallets, while a great many pros can barely get paying work in most towns which aren't music hubs. And normally I wouldn't slag off hobbyists, but it's infuriating when I think of the great studios that have closed down while I watch people who don't really have much experience argue about which Neve clone to buy next. I trained as an EE / Audio engineer and used credit to start a studio up. It was fun an all but in the end all that remained was a massive bill that plagued me for years, anyway the amount of time that music has been a profitable venture is only a blip on the radar comparatively. I don't begrudge it no matter how nice it would have been to continue in this career, now I do it for myself and I'm happy enough.
I have major respect for those doing well though, it shows the result of true determination in tough times. Anyway, I've learned a few things over the years and not all of it came from formal training or studio work. Quite a bit I discovered within the hobbyist realm so that's cool..
Finally, I like RGO. It's a friendly place with bags of experience, nice people and a sense of commonality. We all have our off days, like having an EQ in bypass and thinking it sounds amazing LOL.. Although nobody cares around this place, it's just easy and that makes RGO a really nice place to hang out.
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Post by carymiller on Dec 27, 2022 3:09:43 GMT -6
But it was an inferior product since Equator was a company at the time, and the same amount of money could have gotten you a pair of D5s (which are still great for the money, even used). I put my whole life on the line for years making very little money as an engineer/producer. But I tried. I gave it my all. And I always relayed my experiences in posts meant to help people. Genuinely. Because that's what communities should be about (paying it forward). There's so much I've learned from great people over there...yet most of them are gone now. Or they've migrated here. I still post there sometimes, but the site is very near dead in terms of response times with most of the forums these days. And High End, which was my home away from home...is now filled with prosumer hobbyists with high paying day jobs, who moonlight as engineers with their fat wallets, while a great many pros can barely get paying work in most towns which aren't music hubs. And normally I wouldn't slag off hobbyists, but it's infuriating when I think of the great studios that have closed down while I watch people who don't really have much experience argue about which Neve clone to buy next. I trained as an EE / Audio engineer and used credit to start a studio up. It was fun an all but in the end all that remained was a massive bill that plagued me for years, anyway the amount of time that music has been a profitable venture is only a blip on the radar comparatively. I don't begrudge it no matter how nice it would have been to continue in this career, now I do it for myself and I'm happy enough.
I have major respect for those doing well though, it shows the result of true determination in tough times. Anyway, I've learned a few things over the years and not all of it came from formal training or studio work. Quite a bit I discovered within the hobbyist realm so that's cool..
Finally, I like RGO. It's a friendly place with bags of experience, nice people and a sense of commonality. We all have our off days, like having an EQ in bypass and thinking it sounds amazing LOL.. Although nobody cares around this place, it's just easy and that makes RGO a really nice place to hang out.
Hobbyists don't really bother me. It's more the culture of "the attack of the clones" when it comes to gear. People latch onto things which aren't that important...when it's the integrity of the tracking, the mix, and the master...the results that matter. I do it sometimes to (I care about what makes the original units great usually). So maybe that makes me a bit of a hypocrite. Hell, maybe that's partly why I want to give a Great River preamp another shot soon (because it's expressly it's own thing, and not really a Neve clone). I think I want to move into more unique boutique stuff when possible. I'm just attracted to HiFi sounds in a world where the budgets have all been slashed. *Facepalm*. Also, I'm a little bitter tonight, because a studio I outfitted (Sun Studios), is moving to a new location, and the owner, who ran them into the ground the first time around isn't thinking clearly. It's just another case of people biting off more than they can chew instead of focusing on winning the trust of the music scene.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2022 3:31:36 GMT -6
Hobbyists don't really bother me. It's more the culture of "the attack of the clones" when it comes to gear. People latch onto things which aren't that important...when it's the integrity of the tracking, the mix, and the master...the results that matter. I do it sometimes to (I care about what makes the original units great usually). So maybe that makes me a bit of a hypocrite. Hell, maybe that's partly why I want to give a Great River preamp another shot soon (because it's expressly it's own thing, and not really a Neve clone). I think I want to move into more unique boutique stuff when possible. I'm just attracted to HiFi sounds in a world where the budgets have all been slashed. *Facepalm*. Yeah, I've asked before where is the dividing line? I've seen emmy's awarded to a song created on a mid ranged digital mixer and local engineers produce quality songs out of whatever was laying about (usually mid tier or well known(ish) equipment). After the studio I went from an LFAC to an Echo Audiofrier, then I've been somewhere in between and back, forth yada yada. After all these years I'm still in two minds about how much equipment actually matters, I just know that some chains (including instruments) consistantly delivered better results. That wasn't always the most expensive chain either.
It's fun to discuss but you are IME 100% right, it is the end result that matters. I've obssessed over equipment ad naseum (something I never used to do), although I decided this time around to do it right and just keep moving on. I might add a few bits, grab a mic if I fancy it but I don't plan on changing anything for many years to come. I'm back to writing, recording and mixing at the moment not delving into the finer points of a device that gets a microphone up to line level.
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Post by theshea on Dec 27, 2022 3:57:46 GMT -6
i simply plain HATE the language over there. and EVERY promising thread derails into war/nonsense terrain ... sincere answers get ignored and everybody just tries to persuade their own favorites. to much plugin-flavour-of-the-month talk.
i do read and listen to mix off‘s from time to time: thats when you realize that some people are just plugin collectors and don‘t know what they are doing.
i REALLY appreciate your pro wisdom here and real expierence. and its time for a thank-you from me to you for that!
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Post by tkaitkai on Dec 27, 2022 10:50:31 GMT -6
I still post on GS occasionally, but it's getting pretty infrequent these days. Too many arguments, too much dogmatism. I've been guilty of feeding into it from time to time and it just gets exhausting after a while. Not to mention it's a complete waste of time.
There are some real nuggets of wisdom to be found if you go back 15 - 20 years ago, but these days, it's mostly a good resource for technical info about gear + new product releases, and that's about it.
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Post by johneppstein on Dec 27, 2022 13:23:08 GMT -6
I'm still there, but wonder why? I think it's because SOMEBODY has to try to counteract all the utter BS what gets posted, especially in the guitar forum. There are some "young kids" (r4elatively speaking) who will argue the most ignorant things and get really nasty about older people with experience. I think that there are maybe a handful of good posters left in the Guitar forum. Most of the good ones have left, or just don't post anymore.
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Post by drbill on Dec 27, 2022 13:24:53 GMT -6
I guess I look at things from a different perspective....
There's a huge amount of experience / knowledge over there that doesn't exist here or in most places. And there is drama no matter WHERE you go. I just ignore it for the most part.
Things that I'd love to see discussed more in depth or even at all here....
Post Production mixing for film Legit composing (not songwriting) from a media perspective SFX design VSTi Orchestral libraries - in depth ADR Orchestration techniques Time code options in 2022 Synth production & modular synth techniques How composers are adapting to the new landscape post 2020 vs. 2000. Voiceovers Recording live in difficult outdoor situations How to mix music for Film Video production (we have dabbled a bit here) Audio for Theme Parks Differences in production techniques between LA, NYC, Atlanta, London, Prague, Tokyo, Nashville. Etc.
to name just a few. Unfortunately, these topics do not come up here. Or very rarely if they do.
It's all stuff that gets discussed pretty much in depth over there. There is a HUUUUGE amount of depth and knowledge that people are hungry for that is needed and scarce availability - especially by experienced experts. And virtually never represented here. It is what it is. If I want to know about acoustic guitars, mics for guitars or vocals, the best 47 or 84 clone, DAW wars, the latest awesome plugins, etc. this is an AWESOME resource. For hanging out? AWESOME! For the above topics of audio knowledge? Not so much. I like international perspectives.
There is a very wide perspective of audio in the world to be explored - and almost all of it interests me. I just can't find it all here. Gotta look elsewhere, and "there" is the place it's most condensed.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 27, 2022 15:36:37 GMT -6
It’s wading through the BS that gets so boring. Yeah the more specialized forums are better, but it just feels so corporate.
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Post by drbill on Dec 27, 2022 18:47:24 GMT -6
It’s wading through the BS that gets so boring. Yeah the more specialized forums are better, but it just feels so corporate. Maybe I just navigate more intuitively over there? I dunno. I rarely have to deal with BS. And maybe I'm just used to corporate? Not sure. For whatever reason, I just don't feel the problem. These "I hate GS" threads show up on RGO about every year or two even though I still see a lot of the gang over there. I don't get it... I do get the love for here, just not the hate for there.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 27, 2022 19:29:13 GMT -6
It’s wading through the BS that gets so boring. Yeah the more specialized forums are better, but it just feels so corporate. Maybe I just navigate more intuitively over there? I dunno. I rarely have to deal with BS. And maybe I'm just used to corporate? Not sure. For whatever reason, I just don't feel the problem. These "I hate GS" threads show up on RGO about every year or two even though I still see a lot of the gang over there. I don't get it... I do get the love for here, just not the hate for there. I understand, I don’t “ hate “ it as a matter of fact I do find myself often digging into some old threads fo info on things I am not all that familiar about, but in doing so there is a definite shift from an informative base of audio knowledge and guys you would get a drink with to your typical giant of social media. This place is it for my social media presence these days.
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Post by drbill on Dec 27, 2022 21:04:21 GMT -6
Maybe I just navigate more intuitively over there? I dunno. I rarely have to deal with BS. And maybe I'm just used to corporate? Not sure. For whatever reason, I just don't feel the problem. These "I hate GS" threads show up on RGO about every year or two even though I still see a lot of the gang over there. I don't get it... I do get the love for here, just not the hate for there. I understand, I don’t “ hate “ it as a matter of fact I do find myself often digging into some old threads fo info on things I am not all that familiar about. Yeah the "hate" comment wasn't directed at you Eric! You never strike me as a "hating" kind of guy!!
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 27, 2022 22:15:28 GMT -6
I understand, I don’t “ hate “ it as a matter of fact I do find myself often digging into some old threads fo info on things I am not all that familiar about. Yeah the "hate" comment wasn't directed at you Eric! You never strike me as a "hating" kind of guy!! I didn’t think it was my friend, it was more for clarification! Bill I can think of one person who while I have forgiven, hate would not be out of the question.
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Post by EmRR on Dec 28, 2022 8:44:45 GMT -6
I find the noise pretty low in the location recording sub-forum. Not highly populated though. I haven’t found a better place to interact with classical techniques as a person not living in that world.
Tangential to the know-it-all/know-nothings in the main sections, I have similar interactions with tech people at tech forums who wish to spout from textbooks without consideration of the hands-on research and evidence I’m presenting. Always people with a ton of knowledge but zero experience with the quirky antique electronics I’ve been around the block with.
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