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Post by bluegrassdan on Aug 24, 2020 19:23:10 GMT -6
Depends on the tone of the guitar.
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Post by notneeson on Aug 24, 2020 20:10:26 GMT -6
I have had luck with 635a, a KH modded 87 (rental), km184 (it can work) and to my surprise, my WA47.
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Post by thirdeye on Aug 24, 2020 20:52:58 GMT -6
I'm curious what answers might rise to the top for the question; What would your mic choice(s) be for acoustic guitar, if you can't use a KM84 ?
From what we have available in our mic cabinet, and if I couldn't use my KM84s, my next choices would be: -Soyuz SU013 -Warm WA84 -AKG C61 -AKG 451eb |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 24, 2020 21:40:27 GMT -6
This is easy. If you wanted a KM84, the Soyuz 0-13 is the ticket. You would probably choose the 0-13 over the KM-84 blind. I love KM-84's by the way.
Now, the U87 is never a bad choice, but.. in a Soyuz event a couple of years ago they had a live shootout in a good studio in Brooklyn. One of the comparisons was an acoustic guitar shootout. Over 20 producers and engineers unanimously picked the same mic. The contestants were.. the Soyuz 0-19 (FET), Soyuz 0-17 (tube), Soyuz 0-11, Soyuz 0-13 FET, a Beezneez SDC, a vintage Neumann U67 and a vintage Neumann U87.
The choices were compared blind. Everyone, seriously , EVERYONE, chose... the Soyuz 0-19 FET, (now called the 0-17 FET).
I would use the Soyuz 0-19 for acoustic tracks where the guitar is featured, like a singer/songwriter thing. I would use the 0-13 in tracks with lots of strumming that needs to blend in.
This is a great example of how good the 0-13 is..
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Post by the other mark williams on Aug 24, 2020 22:42:44 GMT -6
Not to pile on with this response, but... ...lately I’ve really been enjoying one of my Soyuz 013s pointing at the neck joint off axis towards the soundhole panned L, and my Soyuz 019 (renamed 017FET, as Martin John Butler said) above and slightly in front of my right shoulder pointing nearly straight down panned R. Both about 20” away. Big, larger-than-life kind of sound. Not right for everything. But I dig it, especially when the AG is meant to be a heavily-featured part of the song. It’s definitely akin to the KM84 and U87 combo. But man, acoustic guitar has to be one of the most variable instruments around. So much depends on the individual instrument, not to mention what the part needs to do in the song. I know those things go without saying, but still. Sometimes the Soyuz mics sound too big, and I need something leaner in the low mids, like one of my Earthworks mics. |
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Post by seawell on Aug 24, 2020 22:45:14 GMT -6
My favorite is the Korby KAT with C12 capsule. On a budget, an Audio Technica AT4040 can work out nicely.
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Post by reddirt on Aug 25, 2020 2:07:51 GMT -6
The 'What sounds right is right' philosophy absolutely means I'm not married to my KM 84 and don't try to force it - my Stam SA 87 often works better.
Cheers, Ross
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Post by nnajar on Aug 25, 2020 9:23:56 GMT -6
I rarely record steel string acoustic (I'm a mostly nylon string guy unless someone's job calls for it) but the last time I recorded one for someone's record it was a Martin 000 and I used a U67. And it was perfect and really nice. I've used 87s often, schoeps very often all with good results. And recently I recorded a Del Vecchio - a Brazilian resonator with silk and steel strings - being played finger style arpeggios and I used a TLM107 and it was fantastic.
I usually use KM-A/KK184 on the nylon string. I always used schoeps and always found myself adding 5k pretty wide so I just got a slightly brighter mic. And this mic sounds really nice. It is Neumann's modular system and I don't know how it compares to a regular 184 - I believe they're supposed to sound the same - but if so I don't know why the 184 gets such a bad rep. That said, I haven't used it on a typical strummed steel string or on drum OH etc...
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Post by mike on Aug 25, 2020 9:47:35 GMT -6
The 'What sounds right is right' philosophy absolutely means I'm not married to my KM 84 and don't try to force it - my Stam SA 87 often works better. Cheers, Ross
Which SA87 version do you have Ross?
I think there are 3 versions with the latest SA87 mk3 being an Italian BG 87 capsule, and a Ludahl Output transformer (BV13 replica from Sweden) . I think the version before that had a Sowter transformer.
Thanks,
Mike
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Post by EmRR on Aug 25, 2020 14:03:36 GMT -6
I usually use KM-A/KK184 on the nylon string. I always used schoeps and always found myself adding 5k pretty wide so I just got a slightly brighter mic. And this mic sounds really nice. It is Neumann's modular system and I don't know how it compares to a regular 184 - I believe they're supposed to sound the same - but if so I don't know why the 184 gets such a bad rep. That said, I haven't used it on a typical strummed steel string or on drum OH etc... The KM-A electronics are supposed to be a step up, even though the capsule is the same. As with the KM140. |
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Post by johneppstein on Aug 25, 2020 15:49:17 GMT -6
AKG C12A (brass)
U-87Ai (pre Senn.)
AKG C414 EB/P48 (plastic)
C451EB modular w/ CK1
C460
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Post by svart on Aug 25, 2020 17:36:24 GMT -6
Km184..
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Post by bradd on Aug 25, 2020 19:23:50 GMT -6
Beyer MC930
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Post by Ward on Aug 25, 2020 21:34:35 GMT -6
for several regular duties, I prefer the 'lowly' MC930 over a KM84. But it doesn't have the pleasant off-axis capture that the KM84 has, and is renowned for, and is why most of us love them. Consistency. |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,086 
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Post by ericn on Aug 27, 2020 10:34:27 GMT -6
for several regular duties, I prefer the 'lowly' MC930 over a KM84. But it doesn't have the pleasant off-axis capture that the KM84 has, and is renowned for, and is why most of us love them. Consistency. But unless you go Omni that off axis llinear response is almost impossible to find. Maybe that’s the secret if you want what the KM84 brings but don’t have one look for a natural omni. |
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Post by forgotteng on Oct 1, 2020 19:48:04 GMT -6
Advanced Audio CM-28 small diaphragm Tube.
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Post by johneppstein on Oct 1, 2020 21:42:13 GMT -6
Oops, already answered.
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Post by aremos on Oct 1, 2020 22:34:43 GMT -6
Can't believe there aren't that many posts for SCHOEPS - any.
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Post by damoongo on Oct 1, 2020 23:40:00 GMT -6
Schoeps m221's and km56 get used more than my km84's here...
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Post by jcoutu1 on Oct 2, 2020 0:47:29 GMT -6
But man, acoustic guitar has to be one of the most variable instruments around. So much depends on the individual instrument, not to mention what the part needs to do in the song. Don't forget how much the player matters too. 2 players on the exact same guitar make it sound totally different. |
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Post by bricejchandler on Oct 2, 2020 0:52:12 GMT -6
Can't believe there aren't that many posts for SCHOEPS - any. I use my Schoeps all the time on acoustic guitar, I actually like them better than the 84s. MK41s or 21s depending on the room/player, always works great. They usually need a bit more help than KMs to fit in a modern production, but most of what I do is pretty natural sounding so the Schoeps is a great match. Recently I've been using a lot of dynamics on acoustics too if the acoustic is more there for rhythm than harmony an needs to fit in a tighter space, M88s mostly. |
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,086
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Post by ericn on Oct 2, 2020 11:07:51 GMT -6
Can't believe there aren't that many posts for SCHOEPS - any. I use my Schoeps all the time on acoustic guitar, I actually like them better than the 84s. MK41s or 21s depending on the room/player, always works great. They usually need a bit more help than KMs to fit in a modern production, but most of what I do is pretty natural sounding so the Schoeps is a great match. Recently I've been using a lot of dynamics on acoustics too if the acoustic is more there for rhythm than harmony an needs to fit in a tighter space, M88s mostly. You put an EV PL/RE on a rhythm part and it’s a time machine back to the 70’s. |
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Post by bricejchandler on Oct 2, 2020 11:29:12 GMT -6
I use my Schoeps all the time on acoustic guitar, I actually like them better than the 84s. MK41s or 21s depending on the room/player, always works great. They usually need a bit more help than KMs to fit in a modern production, but most of what I do is pretty natural sounding so the Schoeps is a great match. Recently I've been using a lot of dynamics on acoustics too if the acoustic is more there for rhythm than harmony an needs to fit in a tighter space, M88s mostly. You put an EV PL/RE on a rhythm part and it’s a time machine back to the 70’s. Love them too! Re15 and 16 I love for acoustics. The 635a I also really like for kind of a laid back washy strum sound, sits back nicely in the mix, and it being omni and not too hifi, it doesn't get the hard pick sound you get from a lot of dynamics which I love using with some singer songwriters who have timing issues ( I want to say all of them but that would be mean) |
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Post by Ward on Oct 2, 2020 11:35:49 GMT -6
If you're really determined to use a dynamic in place of a KM84, then you really should consider a 441. True, it's super cardioid so your placement matters more, but it is the only dynamic that truly rivals the gorgeous capture of the KM84, on-axis.
Dynamic? It's a dyna-MIC
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Post by bricejchandler on Oct 2, 2020 11:44:57 GMT -6
If you're really determined to use a dynamic in place of a KM84, then you really should consider a 441. True, it's super cardioid so your placement matters more, but it is the only dynamic that truly rivals the gorgeous capture of the KM84, on-axis. Dynamic? It's a dyna-MIC What pre do you use it with? I always find it a bit dark compared to Beyers on acoustic. |
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