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Post by Ward on Nov 29, 2020 20:05:42 GMT -6
DAMNG IT, I need me a t-shirt or three. Large. Bill me, mdmitch2
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Nov 29, 2020 20:28:27 GMT -6
I’m probably the biggest M7 guy on RGO, and damn it I would probably go with your HK47. It just seams to work on most things.
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Post by Bat Lanyard on Nov 29, 2020 21:00:48 GMT -6
Tube swapping can be a fun hobby. A Telefunken tube can pull out more high-end details on an M7-style capsule. A Mullard can take the sharp edge off a C12-style capsule, resulting in a smoother, more pleasing sound. I have tried many different kinds, but have ended up with Telefunken tubes in my microphones with M7 and K47 style capsules, and Mullard, Amperex, and RCA tubes in my microphones with C12 and K67 style capsules. I have a bunch of GE, Raytheon, Sylvania, etc., tubes that each have their own sounds. My guess is that the stock tube in the H47tube is going to sound as good as anything. I admire your knowledge on all of that perspective. Some day, I hope to get there! There's so many levels of figuring this audio shit out. Part of the reason I still use the same tech I first took my '78 Plexi to in '94, lol.
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Post by drbill on Nov 29, 2020 22:51:09 GMT -6
I’m probably the biggest M7 guy on RGO. Uhhhh, you're going to have to fight off at least ONE other person for that title Eric!!
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Post by damoongo on Nov 30, 2020 0:04:49 GMT -6
I’m probably the biggest M7 guy on RGO. Uhhhh, you're going to have to fight off at least ONE other person for that title Eric!! Make that two!
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Post by chessparov on Nov 30, 2020 0:20:50 GMT -6
Tres! Chris
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Nov 30, 2020 14:28:52 GMT -6
Ok one of the top 3!
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Post by hadaja on Dec 1, 2020 1:36:43 GMT -6
Oh thanks - that’s good to know. Might do that. There’s very little tonal difference from one Telefunken tube to the next in these mics, so I’m not sure that’s a good use of time or money. The difference in tubes is typically more of a function of how the power supply is calibrated relative to a particular tube.... and we do that when we build and test each mic. Tubes from different manufacturers will often have a different tonal quality... NOS Mullard being a good choice if you want to experiment. Hey there how far off is the next batch of H47 Tube mics? Cheers
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Post by Ward on Dec 1, 2020 9:42:24 GMT -6
I’m probably the biggest M7 guy on RGO, and damn it I would probably go with your HK47. It just seams to work on most things. I have a few other microphones from Neumann-Gefell and two from Gefell-Neumann with original M7 capsules in them (all in great condition). The Heiserman M7 does not disappoint and has a beautiful high end sheen to it that reminds me of a U67 or a U89 at times. it soars. But a while back, mdmitch2 (Matt) sent me a spare NOS Tfunk EF800 tube and after I swapped out for the original, there was a brilliant difference and more edge from the M7. So I bought a sleeve of said tubes from www.tubes.rs - if you're going to invest thousands into an impeccable U47 clone, make sure you have spares!
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Post by drbill on Dec 31, 2020 13:12:36 GMT -6
I posted this elsewhere, and wanted to update my H47T thoughts here after almost a year and a half. Happy New Years to everyone!! So.... Here I sit. On the edge of a new year (thankfully!), with 16 months or so of "water under the bridge" with the Heiserman H47Tube. The honeymoon is long over. The work has been done, mixed, turned in, and my thoughts on it have coalesced and solidified. It has survived the pandemic, and been one of if not THE most used mics of my large locker in the last year +. The pandemic put a pretty large damper on getting a lot of people in like I might normally have had, but I have had enough that I have been able to compare it on female Vox, male Vox, my Vox , acoustic guitar, fiddle, front of drum kit, Room mic, dobro, TALKBOX!, dulcimer, SHAKERS!!!, tambourine, other percussion, etc.. It makes a great all-rounder mic for pretty much everything I've thrown at it. As I ponder the (hopefully) far distant future where I may have to pare down the studio mic collection (which is pushing towards 80+ mics), I know that the H47Tube will be one of - if not the last mic I'll ever get rid of. It is super versatile, classic sounding, reliable (a BIG deal for me with tube mics), and built like a tank to last the rest of my life. With both head baskets (M7/K47) and card / omni on hand - I can go several different directions with it quickly and easily. Actually, the head basket swap thing has turned out to be a lifesaver, and way easier to do mid session than I expected. And on the headbaskets - I've talked with many folks wondering about which capsule to choose - and for me, most times, I'll lean into the HK47 capsule. The HM7 headbasket / capsule gets pulled out for singers with a really bad sibilance problem, or if the track is more "open" and I'm looking for a more vintage / retro sound. The HK can also accel on those sources, but sometimes, the HM7 is just FREAKING MAGIC, and gets the nod. To have both and be able to easily switch is more than just a dream. It makes the package unbeatable IMO. I'm sure there may be other companies that do this, but the Heiserman is just freaking stellar in this respect. It's almost like having 2 different 47's for me. Each with their own personality. Similar, but different. Both wonderful. The hunt for a good/great 47 is over for me. The Heiserman kills it. I'm satisfied, and in love. Mostly I've been using either the Silver Bullet pre's cascaded API into Neve, or the Locomotive / Weight Tank WT72's (V72) for mic pre's. Different, but both love the H47T. Notable mics it has been put up against and beat out in a variety of situations : - my venerable U87, Innertube Audio tube 87, RMS269, my handbuilt MKU47, KM84, Gefell UM70, RCA 77DX, CV4, Joly built U47, Original SM7, and a bunch of others that don't come to mind right now. Some notable uses over the months that come to mind : - TALKBOX - this was a fun one. I was told the SM7 was THE talk box mic. Eh, for me, not so much. As kind of a first timer talk-boxer, I found that this is a difficult instrument to get good articulation with when recorded, and the HK47 was THE ticket in capturing both synth and the vocal equally with enough articulation to understand my mediocre talk box skills and blend it into a cool synth/human combo. - bright, modern sounding female lead Vox. Sounded really great. Beat out what I would have considered a "better call" on females. Just worked. Both HK47 and HM7 capsules worked well, but HK47 worked better. - group vocals with multiple different soloists - The U87 has always worked well for me in this situation of one mic, different vocals / approaches. The H47T with HK47 head basket easily beat it out. Worked superb on all vocalists and group vocals as well. - SHAKER!! Haha! You guys kid me about this, but it's a KILLER shaker mic. Not egg shakers, but the big, rattly, almost tambourine-ish downbeat or 1/4 note shakers that are almost ethnic - and huge - awesome! Not too bright, not too dull, but juuuuust right with killer air surrounding the sound. LOVE it on those!! Makes a track jump out with ALIVE-ness. Beat out my KM86's on this, and that is one difficult task. - Fiddle. My go to is usually a ribbon - RCA77DX or modded Apex205 or modded fathead if more modern. I've successfully used both the RMS269 and UM70's on the condenser front, but the H47T with HM7 capsule really shines on fiddle if you need it more up front, huge sounding, and present - speaking out in the track. - my vocal. Always a difficult call for me cause I'm not a vocalist. I can sing, but not really... This mic pulled me out of a couple deep holes that needed to be filled. When I've got to sing, it's the first call for ME at this point. Definitely HK47 capsule. (I've got a covered, dull sounding voice) - up against my handmade 47. With the HK47 head basket. It almost made my much loved handmade 47 sound broken - and I FREAKING LOVE that 47. There was no contest on the vocalist (male, high bright tenor) that I tried both on. The HM7 kicked its butt. - omni up REAL close on delicate acoustic guitar. WOW! Being able to go omni and get right in was a lifesaver. Both patterns on these capsules rock. I think I used the HK47 on this application. HUGE sound. - articulation on delicate stringed instruments is superb. The HK capsule / head basket is just the ticket for both SIZE, and delicate articulation. Hard to get both of those sometimes, but easy with the H47Tube. - REACH. A quality that seems to have been lost on so many modern mics, but one that is almost a given on the great mics of the past. The reach on the H47T is phenomenal. It's so easy to pull back and dial in the environment that the mic is placed in without everything sounding too close mic'd, or too "roomy". The H47T excels at this. It's a hallmark technique for me. - Voiceover - works as expected. Good mic for this, although U87 has always been my go to. The H47T is quieter though, and bigger sounding. - "other stuff". I'd imagine most people will use this mic for vocals, but I end up using it on "other stuff" as much or more, because that's what my gig as a TV/Film composer / producer normally points me towards. The H47T excels on instruments as much as vocals from my perspective!! - did I mention size? This mic is BIG sounding with either capsule. So there you have it. My updated, year + post-honeymoon thoughts. Looking forward to all the other mics that the guys at Heiserman cook up!! Special thanks to the guys - tskguy (Eric), mdmitch2 (Matt), and @ wave Dave!!! You guys are killing it. Now....on that 251.......
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Post by tskguy on Dec 31, 2020 14:13:55 GMT -6
Damn,
It hard to put in to words how that makes me feal.. all I can say is I’m super happy you love the mic along with the heart and sole the Heiserman team puts in to each and every one we make! Let’s make 2021 a great year making records!!! And yes the 251.. I have one with your name on it😬😬😬
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Post by drbill on Dec 31, 2020 14:42:56 GMT -6
Damn, It hard to put in to words how that makes me feal.. all I can say is I’m super happy you love the mic along with the heart and sole the Heiserman team puts in to each and every one we make! Let’s make 2021 a great year making records!!! And yes the 251.. I have one with your name on it😬😬😬 Thanks for the kind words Eric!! Very appreciated. Yes, hoping 2021 is better for everyone!! Happy, Healthy, and a Successful New Years to all! And yeah, the H47T is IT!!!!!!! on the 47 front. The "heart and soul" you mention is quite evident to me, and I'd guess to anyone who has purchased one. Also, I'm so looking forward to your 251. I've had my eye on the Upton version, but super excited to hear yours. I know it will be killer. So far, the pics look amazing. The 251 is the only mic out of the classics that I have had no real contact with. For whatever reason, they didn't really seem to be that prevalent in LA back in the time I was up and coming. But lots of experience with 47/48's, 49's, 67's, 50's, 12's, etc. Used all of em, love all of em, have clones of all of em.... (except the 50's, but I do have KM53's which get into the zone...) But the 251....Elusive for me. I'm excited to try one!!
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 31, 2020 16:30:25 GMT -6
Yeah, I’ll second that. My H47 gets used constantly. It just works.
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Post by drbill on Dec 31, 2020 17:44:41 GMT -6
That's it right there. Stuff that you can just throw up that consistently works without fiddling and tweaking all over to get a great sound is what helps make great recordings!!
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Post by ChaseUTB on Dec 31, 2020 17:50:12 GMT -6
Yeah, I’ll second that. My H47 gets used constantly. It just works. Do you use it more than your Upton 251? I remember that was your fave mic ever at one point!
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Post by ChaseUTB on Dec 31, 2020 18:20:16 GMT -6
And one more thang... IMHO the U47, particularly with the K47 capsule, is way WAY underated for Modern Hip Hop/R&B/Rap/Pop. The usual suspects are usually emphasized. Ala Sony C800G/Ref C/U87ai. And-of course Ward's favorite. (Drum machine drumroll please)... The mighty SM7! But as I re-listen to old/new recordings done on a quality U47 style tube mic... IMHO that kind of mic, is equally suitable. And you try to get the "Kids" (under 40) to believe that. Chris I don't want those idiots to know. The last thing I need or want is to have prices driven up further.
In fact, they should listen here - THE SM7B IS THE BEST HIP-HOP VOCAL MIC!
There, that should do it.....
BTW, what's the point of using a great mic like a U47 if you're just going to Ottotune the crap out of it?
I use a M7 blue line FET transformer coupled output mic for half & u87ai for half ( commercial studio & don’t bring my mics ) Most “ rap “ quoted loosely cuz it’s more melodic than rapping (Rod Wave, Kevin Gates etc ) the artists use AT to Enhance the delivery & emotion of the vocal & use the AT to transition into higher ranges. Compression & AT can really bring out expression & help you understand the feeling. Ppl who can actually sing, they sound even better thru AT cuz they know how to manipulate their throat & formant & tones plus slide thru the scales melodically where AT is providing an “ icing “ in the already great cake. Ex: T pain, Mariah Carey, Xtina, JT. Hell I’m sure Celine Dion has used AT / Melodyne for correction before.
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Post by ChaseUTB on Dec 31, 2020 18:38:56 GMT -6
Ok, so I did a thing . . . a comparison video/recording session of the Heiserman 47 tube microphone with each of the HK47 and HM7 capsules against a U67 with a Telefunken EF806S tube in it. The talent singing is Canadian up and coming pop singer Peter Fewer. In the vein of Sean Mendes, Ed Sheeran and similar. Each recording/video is as unprocessed as possible, and I will send the raw vocal files to anyone who really wants them, they are also available from Matt Mitchell at Heiserman. First up: Heiserman 47 mic M7 capsule into a vintage Focusrite Red 6 preamp. No EQ, no Compression. Second: Heiserman 47 mic K47 capsule into another Focusrite Red6 pre, no EQ, no compression. Third, control video: Neumann U67 EF806S tube into another Focusrite Red6 pre, no EQ, no compression. I prefer the 47 then M7 then 67 on this voice from these videos. I could use and work w any & YouTube lossy encoding should sound more vintage right lol Aside from that, the talent is good & each mic highlights something different in the vocal imo
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Post by reddirt on Dec 31, 2020 18:46:28 GMT -6
Dr Bill, what tube do you have in the H47T? Cheers, Ross
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Post by drbill on Dec 31, 2020 18:51:46 GMT -6
Dr Bill, what tube do you have in the H47T? Cheers, Ross To be honest, I have no idea. Whatever the stock tube that they tuned the mic with and shipped with....
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wave
Full Member
Posts: 46
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Post by wave on Dec 31, 2020 23:22:13 GMT -6
Damn, It hard to put in to words how that makes me feal.. all I can say is I’m super happy you love the mic along with the heart and sole the Heiserman team puts in to each and every one we make! Let’s make 2021 a great year making records!!! And yes the 251.. I have one with your name on it😬😬😬 Thanks for the kind words Eric!! Very appreciated. Yes, hoping 2021 is better for everyone!! Happy, Healthy, and a Successful New Years to all! And yeah, the H47T is IT!!!!!!! on the 47 front. The "heart and soul" you mention is quite evident to me, and I'd guess to anyone who has purchased one. Also, I'm so looking forward to your 251. I've had my eye on the Upton version, but super excited to hear yours. I know it will be killer. So far, the pics look amazing. The 251 is the only mic out of the classics that I have had no real contact with. For whatever reason, they didn't really seem to be that prevalent in LA back in the time I was up and coming. But lots of experience with 47/48's, 49's, 67's, 50's, 12's, etc. Used all of em, love all of em, have clones of all of em.... (except the 50's, but I do have KM53's which get into the zone...) But the 251....Elusive for me. I'm excited to try one!! Dr.Bill, Thank you for your very kind words and your feelings on the H47tube. Eric Matt and I lovingly slave over each one. I write this as I am sitting here building 6 new units and also fussing over the last 1% of the magical sonic of an "ideal" 251. Making any audio equipment is a daunting venture to say the least, especially microphones. We are building something that is completely subjective to each person so hitting that target can be tricky. Eric an I were speaking today that in a couple months, he an I will have known each other for 10 years. We met after we each built an 87 clone in the Aurycle bodies and posted clips on GDIY. Eric had built his first capsule and that summer (2011) we started working together on fussing over capsules made by us, knowing it was absolutely possible to produce great mic hardware onshore. FF 10 years and we are teasing you guys with the latest wonder our Ela H 251. I have spent the whole month of December working on the appearance and sonic of that prototype and dare I say it, we have some magic happening. So again thanks for taking the time to write your feelings on the H47tube. It's very nice to hear that you like it, it's useful for you and has great value for you and your passion of making records. -Dave
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Post by drbill on Jan 1, 2021 0:09:25 GMT -6
Thanks for the kind words Eric!! Very appreciated. Yes, hoping 2021 is better for everyone!! Happy, Healthy, and a Successful New Years to all! And yeah, the H47T is IT!!!!!!! on the 47 front. The "heart and soul" you mention is quite evident to me, and I'd guess to anyone who has purchased one. Also, I'm so looking forward to your 251. I've had my eye on the Upton version, but super excited to hear yours. I know it will be killer. So far, the pics look amazing. The 251 is the only mic out of the classics that I have had no real contact with. For whatever reason, they didn't really seem to be that prevalent in LA back in the time I was up and coming. But lots of experience with 47/48's, 49's, 67's, 50's, 12's, etc. Used all of em, love all of em, have clones of all of em.... (except the 50's, but I do have KM53's which get into the zone...) But the 251....Elusive for me. I'm excited to try one!! Dr.Bill, Thank you for your very kind words and your feelings on the H47tube. Eric Matt and I lovingly slave over each one. I write this as I am sitting here building 6 new units and also fussing over the last 1% of the magical sonic of an "ideal" 251. Making any audio equipment is a daunting venture to say the least, especially microphones. We are building something that is completely subjective to each person so hitting that target can be tricky. Eric an I were speaking today that in a couple months, he an I will have known each other for 10 years. We met after we each built an 87 clone in the Aurycle bodies and posted clips on GDIY. Eric had built his first capsule and that summer (2011) we started working together on fussing over capsules made by us, knowing it was absolutely possible to produce great mic hardware onshore. FF 10 years and we are teasing you guys with the latest wonder our Ela H 251. I have spent the whole month of December working on the appearance and sonic of that prototype and dare I say it, we have some magic happening. So again thanks for taking the time to write your feelings on the H47tube. It's very nice to hear that you like it, it's useful for you and has great value for you and your passion of making records. -Dave Dave - thank YOU! - for your expertise, and for the individual effort you put into each mic!! It's fantastic to see artisans still giving 110% in their craft and art. It's soooo appreciated in a world of cookie cutter, meh products. The world needs more guys like the Heiserman clan!!! I'm looking forward to checking out the ElaH251!! Make sure you track down that last 1%.....then kick it a few more percentage points like you did with the 47T!!! Happy New Year!
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jan 1, 2021 19:17:56 GMT -6
Great demo, thanks for posting Chase.
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Post by Ward on Jan 1, 2021 19:26:23 GMT -6
Great demo, thanks for posting Chase. Huh?
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jan 1, 2021 22:30:14 GMT -6
Oops, I misread. Great post Ward :-)
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Post by OtisGreying on Jan 2, 2021 2:45:42 GMT -6
So... I have a question. U47 is synonymous with the VF14 tube, so much so that they are going for like 4 grand online, while I can appreciate the Heiserman H47T is a great microphone, how could it nail (like better than Flea, Telefunken) the signature U47 sound with a completely different tube?
I listened to the blackbird clips on their website. They both sound great but I wish those clips had been RAW. It'd be much easier to hear whats really going on. All I could really tell was the Heiserman had alot more 6-7k information and the Neumann was perhaps a bit tighter of a sound. That signature 47 proximity effect up front thing. If anyone has any RAW clips of comparison against a Telefunken or vintage I'd be very anxious to hear.
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