|
|
Post by M57 on Sept 2, 2018 8:38:06 GMT -6
With its output meter hitting 0db and going straight into my interface (Motu 828ES) I have to crank the trim ~ +10 at the interface to get decent levels (in this case peaks at -16db). I seem to be having this problem consistently with the Tonebeast. Doesn't seem to matter what mics I use and I'm pretty sure I had the same problem with my Focusrite interface.
Not that it should matter (the meter says it all, right?) but in this particular case I've got gain and saturation at 12 o'clock - no pad and all buttons out in the tone control section. Any suggestions re: what I might be doing wrong.
|
|
|
|
Post by stormymondays on Sept 2, 2018 8:59:09 GMT -6
The output control needs to be on full unless you need to attenuate the output. That’s why you’re having that problem.
|
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Sept 2, 2018 9:08:58 GMT -6
Same with either op amp?
|
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Sept 2, 2018 9:12:41 GMT -6
The output control needs to be on full unless you need to attenuate the output. That’s why you’re having that problem. Holy crap. No only did that fix the problem, but it's a different pre-amp with the output cranked. THANKS! |
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Sept 2, 2018 9:28:01 GMT -6
You have been attenuating the output so not getting the sonic benefit of driving the output transformer ?
|
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Sept 2, 2018 9:32:45 GMT -6
You have been attenuating the output so not getting the sonic benefit of driving the output transformer ? Yep. Like I said, it's a whole new pre-amp  |
|
|
|
Post by iamasound on Sept 3, 2018 9:32:54 GMT -6
I have been doing the same with the Tonebeast. I have been dialing the front end in so that the peaks hit the yellow and gain staging into the WA76 with the output. I need to reevaluate...I always felt that the amp was ok but not "all that". Pushing hard the output of the WA76 lent me a lusiously colored vocal sound the other day and one in which I will use again. I can't wait to find time tomorrow to dial it in like you you'all say. I'm quite excited, actually...and also feel a little foolish.
|
|
|
|
Post by stormymondays on Sept 3, 2018 10:17:21 GMT -6
I don't know about that, I've always assumed that the output control was post output transformer and had no effect on the sound. I don't have a schematic or block diagram to confirm this, though.
|
|
|
|
Post by iamasound on Sept 3, 2018 16:53:31 GMT -6
I don't know about that, I've always assumed that the output control was post output transformer and had no effect on the sound. I don't have a schematic or block diagram to confirm this, though. If that were the case, that the output control was post output transformer, I would feel...no longer foolish. |
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Sept 3, 2018 17:09:02 GMT -6
Well, either way it sure as hell made a big difference for me. If pre-OT I'm getting more API flavor for my dollar ..and if post -OT I don't have to push the thing so damn hard.
|
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Sept 3, 2018 18:18:08 GMT -6
From tb manual:
OUTPUT ATTENUATION ALLOWS FOR SATURATION FLEXIBILITY OF BOTH OPAMPS AND TRANSFORMERS
|
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Sept 3, 2018 18:28:36 GMT -6
From tb manual: OUTPUT ATTENUATION ALLOWS FOR SATURATION FLEXIBILITY OF BOTH OPAMPS AND TRANSFORMERS What does this mean? It still could be post everything. |
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Sept 3, 2018 19:06:44 GMT -6
I could be wrong but I thought Bryce had told me that you can drive the output transformers?
I had a pair of tb12 a while back.
|
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Sept 3, 2018 19:18:30 GMT -6
I think the output control is post the transformer and it attenuated the signal but driving the gain drives the transformers and then you attenuate the output level with the output control ?
So, the gain is doing the driving but you set final output with its control ?
|
|
|
|
Post by stormymondays on Sept 4, 2018 2:01:03 GMT -6
I think the output control is post the transformer and it attenuated the signal but driving the gain drives the transformers and then you attenuate the output level with the output control ? So, the gain is doing the driving but you set final output with its control ? That’s what I always assumed. |
|
|
|
Post by jazznoise on Sept 4, 2018 2:44:54 GMT -6
If you have an output attenuator then you're changing the load seen by the transformer and the current being drawn through it. I can't see how that wouldn't effect the coloration of the OT
|
|
|
|
Post by matt@IAA on Sept 4, 2018 5:30:26 GMT -6
If you have an output attenuator then you're changing the load seen by the transformer and the current being drawn through it. I can't see how that wouldn't effect the coloration of the OT unless it’s a t pad attenuators like CAPI sells |
|
|
|
Post by stormymondays on Sept 4, 2018 7:05:49 GMT -6
From a practical point of view: I've been using a pair for close to four years and I never attenuate the output unless strictly necessary. I think it sounds great.
I ended up replacing the 312 opamp with LTL Rogue Five because the 312 would sometimes collapse under the weight of a thunderous kick drum when using the steel output transformer and driving it hard. The Rogue Five cured that problem. However, I still think the original Opamp sounded great too.
|
|
|
|
Post by jazznoise on Sept 4, 2018 10:03:19 GMT -6
If you have an output attenuator then you're changing the load seen by the transformer and the current being drawn through it. I can't see how that wouldn't effect the coloration of the OT unless it’s a t pad attenuators like CAPI sells It looks like a potentiometer from the decal, but if it's a rotary switch that is possible! Doing a T-Pad (H Pad? It's a balanced line after the transformer) circuit from Unity to -60 or whatever would be a bit of a disaster with a ganged pot. Curious now, for anyone who knows! |
|
|
|
Post by matt@IAA on Sept 4, 2018 10:34:50 GMT -6
|
|
|
|
Post by Ward on Sept 4, 2018 12:30:59 GMT -6
I have a TB12. Can anyone speak to how the WA412 compares to the TB12 in this instance, and all the peculiarities mentioned in this thread?
|
|
|
|
Post by svart on Sept 4, 2018 12:38:09 GMT -6
I thought the output attenuators were after the output transformer, simply FOR allowing you to drive the output tranny a bit harder?
|
|
|
|
Post by iamasound on Sept 4, 2018 13:40:28 GMT -6
With the output transformer disengaged from the circuit, the output still functions as an attenuater which means that it has nothing to do with driving the output transformer. When the output knob is dialed in 100% at 5 o'clock it mimics the circuit of the WA-12. The output transformer adds 6dB and is either engaged fully or not at all. From the Warm site...
Output Control Knob
Power Switch
The gain control is variable and adjusts the Tone Beast's
gain from +29db to +65db or from +35db to +71db when the “Tone”
switch is engaged. The “Pad” feature lowers the minimum and
maximum ranges by -20db when engaged.
This knob controls the signal exiting the Tone
Beast. It ensures that the amplified signal doesn't exit the Tone
Beast too loud and overload the inputs on the user's interface. It also
gives the user greater ability to drive the gain of the preamp harder
resulting in greater colorization and tone shaping within the various
settings.
|
|
|
|
Post by matt@IAA on Sept 4, 2018 13:57:14 GMT -6
Sounds like it’s a pre-transformer attenuator then? Someone pull one out of their rack and take some photos, we’ll sort this ricky tic.
|
|
|
|
Post by notneeson on Sept 4, 2018 14:31:48 GMT -6
WA412 output trim works/sounds great on drums. I'm not sure what the implementation is, but it beats having to use the input pads on an API 4312 just to avoid clipping the convertors.
|
|
