ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 1, 2018 17:50:04 GMT -6
Happy Cheese Day ericn we just bought a strangely wonderful variety of cheeses at the store today as well! Some spreadable, some solid and smoked, some best melted. My favorite holidays are the cheesy ones. A man after my own heart! I had to send a couple of pics to friend in here in KC Showing Triggs a small town WI grocery store home of what many consider the Worlds greatest brats, the Triggs Red, showing one of the 3 large sausage and Brat freezers , one of the 4 Large cheese coolers, not counting the spreadable cheese cooler, and the Lienies cooler her favorite beer! It is a very different place, but expect your arteries and liver to be clogged and damagied!
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Post by LesC on Apr 3, 2018 7:50:32 GMT -6
You'd think that 400 wouldn't be much.. I couldn't hardly sell my converters after the first couple batches with the 400 pricepoint for ADC and 400 for DAC. Everyone LOVES the idea of buying things like this, but very few actually do. And I regret not buying everyday! In case you missed it, I have a SvartBox available for sale. Perfect working and physical condition. It's a beautiful piece! I replaced my Burl B2 ADC and my Dangerous Music DAC with it. However, I needed a new interface so I got the RME ADI-2 Pro. It has stereo ADC and DAC which are on par with the SvartBox, and I never record more than two tracks at a time, so the SvartBox is sitting there looking lonely and unloved, it needs a new home.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 3, 2018 8:03:17 GMT -6
And I regret not buying everyday! In case you missed it, I have a SvartBox available for sale. Perfect working and physical condition. It's a beautiful piece! I replaced my Burl B2 ADC and my Dangerous Music DAC with it. However, I needed a new interface so I got the RME ADI-2 Pro. It has stereo ADC and DAC which are on par with the SvartBox, and I never record more than two tracks at a time, so the SvartBox is sitting there looking lonely and unloved, it needs a new home. I saw it but I’m broke ! The State’s of KS MO and the IRS ate my gear fund!
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Post by LesC on Apr 3, 2018 10:09:56 GMT -6
In case you missed it, I have a SvartBox available for sale. Perfect working and physical condition. It's a beautiful piece! I replaced my Burl B2 ADC and my Dangerous Music DAC with it. However, I needed a new interface so I got the RME ADI-2 Pro. It has stereo ADC and DAC which are on par with the SvartBox, and I never record more than two tracks at a time, so the SvartBox is sitting there looking lonely and unloved, it needs a new home. I saw it but I’m broke ! The State’s of KS MO and the IRS ate my gear fund! That's fine, I just wanted to be sure you're aware of it. I've been ambivalent about selling it. Combined with the ADI-2 Pro, it would be perfect if I ever decide to go back to OTB mixing. But if I can get a reasonable price I'll sell it and probably miss it later.
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Post by jeromemason on Apr 6, 2018 14:31:10 GMT -6
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Post by Martin John Butler on Apr 6, 2018 19:54:12 GMT -6
Some of this is over my head, but I've wished I could have better D/A (and A/D) for along time but just can't see getting one when I could buy a Lewitt 640 mic or a Soyuz 0-13, a Stam SA67 or a Golden Age 47 for what they cost.
Is there any way to make the one Jim's been talking about work with my iMac running Sierra and my UAD Apollo 8?
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Post by jeromemason on Apr 6, 2018 21:04:57 GMT -6
Takes Toslink, so that optical connection from the Apollo should do it.
You can also run on USB and stream the super high res stuff for just listening i guess. I'm not sure I'd want to imagine what a session at 768khz would do to a machine in our time right now....
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Post by jimwilliams on Apr 6, 2018 21:11:19 GMT -6
That's a short loaded version with a single ESS DAC chip, 5 rather than 7 filters, no MQA unfolding. The Pre Box S2 uses a pair of ESS DAC chips. I spent some time listening to mine and comparing it to some other DAC's here. It easily beats the Mytek/Levenson BurrBrown PCM1704 with THS 3061 opamps and the PCM1792 based RMA superbeast with ADA4898-2 opamps. It also bests the Schiit Modi II multibit with ADA4898-2 opamps.
In fact it beats everything I got here. Feeding the Adcom GFA 545 directly is a very pure sound. It's also great on DVD's and even TV playback. The low end is rather impressive and the low level details are easily heard.
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Post by jeromemason on Apr 6, 2018 21:25:58 GMT -6
Ah.... Yeah I definitely wanted the true dual mono. I thought maybe it was something simple like the screen and MQA stuff.
Reading the specs I don't see how this things wouldn't slay most near everything you'd throw at it, in hi-fi and pro audio. I'm still blown totally away by the 100 femto on the clock, that's just nuts.
I'm trying to figure out how to best mate this up with my Antelope Satori though. My Focal's have the unbalanced RCA input, but I want to go from the S2 to my Satori and it only accepts 1/4"TRS balanced. I guess just trying a pair of RCA to 1/4" TS cables and seeing if there is any noise or other issues happening. If I can't get that working it'd take me out of the game for it, which would really suck as I know I won't be finding anything in the pro-audio market that can get near that box without spending $2,500 or more.
Jerome
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 6, 2018 21:33:54 GMT -6
Ah.... Yeah I definitely wanted the true dual mono. I thought maybe it was something simple like the screen and MQA stuff. Reading the specs I don't see how this things wouldn't slay most near everything you'd throw at it, in hi-fi and pro audio. I'm still blown totally away by the 100 femto on the clock, that's just nuts. I'm trying to figure out how to best mate this up with my Antelope Satori though. My Focal's have the unbalanced RCA input, but I want to go from the S2 to my Satori and it only accepts 1/4"TRS balanced. I guess just trying a pair of RCA to 1/4" TS cables and seeing if there is any noise or other issues happening. If I can't get that working it'd take me out of the game for it, which would really suck as I know I won't be finding anything in the pro-audio market that can get near that box without spending $2,500 or more. Jerome Should not be a problem, might want a bit more gain but you know how to gain stage. Worse case through a pair of Jensen’s or one of those Ahpex boxes you can find for $20 bucks used!
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Post by winetree on Apr 6, 2018 23:35:20 GMT -6
Q: Pre Box S2 Digital will not be recognized by Mac OSX (El Capitan/Sierra) or does not output sound. A: There are many forum reports about that issue. It is a widely spread error affecting a wide array of USB DACs, unfortunately there is no current fix for this problem, since it lies in the Core Audio of Apple's OSX. We advice not to use our USB DACs with OSX El Capitan.
bummer
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 7, 2018 1:41:56 GMT -6
Q: Pre Box S2 Digital will not be recognized by Mac OSX (El Capitan/Sierra) or does not output sound. A: There are many forum reports about that issue. It is a widely spread error affecting a wide array of USB DACs, unfortunately there is no current fix for this problem, since it lies in the Core Audio of Apple's OSX. We advice not to use our USB DACs with OSX El Capitan. bummer Do Mac Minis and laptops still have the mini Toslink built into the headphone jack?
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Post by thehightenor on Apr 7, 2018 3:35:26 GMT -6
I found a new new 32 bit DAC design made in Germany. It's made by Pro-Ject and called the Pre Box S2 Digital. This puppy uses the newest ESS 32 bit Sabre DAC chips, a pair in dual cosine. These are the same chipsets used in the $5000 Mytek Manhattan II.
It is small but has all the inputs, coax, optical and USB. It will do several rates of DSD and up to 760k 32 bit. The USB input provides 16 core asynchronous USB transfer for MQA rendering, a unique/expensive feature catching on in the high end consumer market. It also does remote control of transport functions to your computer.
The $40 a piece ESS 9038 DAC chips are the current best in market. This has a pair of them. It also uses the new ESS 9602 headphone/output buffer for -120 db THD+noise. The power supply uses the new ESS 9311 low dropout voltage regulators, designed for high end DAC power supplies.
The clock design is excellent, only 100 femtoseconds of jitter, better than most high end clock generators. It has 7 selectable digital filters and uses organic polymer capacitors for the power supplies. The layout and design is excellent with a 4 layer gold pcb. There are pics of the innards with descriptions on their web site.
This may be a new game changer as it is far beyond the capabilities of nearly all the pro-audio DAC's out there. This is some real engineering folks.
By now you probably want to know how it sounds. I don't know, I'm waiting for it. It did win the EU audio shootouts but is new here in the States.
You probably want to know how much it costs? It could be $4000. It could be $2000 and a deal. It actually costs $399 shipped to your door. I don't know how it can be made that cheap with those expensive chipsets.
www.project-audio.com Wow sounds great. Looking at it the other way around I don't know how these things can cost $4000 when they only have $80 worth of DAC chips in them! Yes I know it's also about quality analogue electronics too but still $399 sounds like a genuine bargain.
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Post by EmRR on Apr 7, 2018 8:22:43 GMT -6
Q: Pre Box S2 Digital will not be recognized by Mac OSX (El Capitan/Sierra) or does not output sound. A: There are many forum reports about that issue. It is a widely spread error affecting a wide array of USB DACs, unfortunately there is no current fix for this problem, since it lies in the Core Audio of Apple's OSX. We advice not to use our USB DACs with OSX El Capitan. bummer Do Mac Minis and laptops still have the mini Toslink built into the headphone jack? At least in the MBP, discontinued in the last model I believe. Most people never knew it was there.
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Post by svart on Apr 7, 2018 9:12:49 GMT -6
I found a new new 32 bit DAC design made in Germany. It's made by Pro-Ject and called the Pre Box S2 Digital. This puppy uses the newest ESS 32 bit Sabre DAC chips, a pair in dual cosine. These are the same chipsets used in the $5000 Mytek Manhattan II.
It is small but has all the inputs, coax, optical and USB. It will do several rates of DSD and up to 760k 32 bit. The USB input provides 16 core asynchronous USB transfer for MQA rendering, a unique/expensive feature catching on in the high end consumer market. It also does remote control of transport functions to your computer.
The $40 a piece ESS 9038 DAC chips are the current best in market. This has a pair of them. It also uses the new ESS 9602 headphone/output buffer for -120 db THD+noise. The power supply uses the new ESS 9311 low dropout voltage regulators, designed for high end DAC power supplies.
The clock design is excellent, only 100 femtoseconds of jitter, better than most high end clock generators. It has 7 selectable digital filters and uses organic polymer capacitors for the power supplies. The layout and design is excellent with a 4 layer gold pcb. There are pics of the innards with descriptions on their web site.
This may be a new game changer as it is far beyond the capabilities of nearly all the pro-audio DAC's out there. This is some real engineering folks.
By now you probably want to know how it sounds. I don't know, I'm waiting for it. It did win the EU audio shootouts but is new here in the States.
You probably want to know how much it costs? It could be $4000. It could be $2000 and a deal. It actually costs $399 shipped to your door. I don't know how it can be made that cheap with those expensive chipsets.
www.project-audio.com Wow sounds great. Looking at it the other way around I don't know how these things can cost $4000 when they only have $80 worth of DAC chips in them! Yes I know it's also about quality analogue electronics too but still $399 sounds like a genuine bargain. You're paying for the engineers. Your paying for the "free support" when you call with problems. You're paying for the rejection rate on the production line. You're paying for the warehouse, the parts, the people who box the product up and ship it to you. You're paying for a lot more than just some parts.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Apr 7, 2018 11:12:13 GMT -6
I looked at Pro-Ject's site, and just noticed the pre-box is a preamp. Jim, did you mean to link to one of their high end DACs? I don't think a preamp is meant to be used as a DAC, or am I wrong.
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Post by Guitar on Apr 7, 2018 11:25:02 GMT -6
Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 DigitalIt's a standalone DAC but with a volume control and a headphone output. Some people would call that a preamp, but it is a DAC as well.
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Post by Blackdawg on Apr 7, 2018 12:09:02 GMT -6
Takes Toslink, so that optical connection from the Apollo should do it. You can also run on USB and stream the super high res stuff for just listening i guess. I'm not sure I'd want to imagine what a session at 768khz would do to a machine in our time right now.... Shouldn't be that bad. I work in 384kHz multi tracks all the time.
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Post by thehightenor on Apr 7, 2018 12:16:29 GMT -6
Wow sounds great. Looking at it the other way around I don't know how these things can cost $4000 when they only have $80 worth of DAC chips in them! Yes I know it's also about quality analogue electronics too but still $399 sounds like a genuine bargain. You're paying for the engineers. Your paying for the "free support" when you call with problems. You're paying for the rejection rate on the production line. You're paying for the warehouse, the parts, the people who box the product up and ship it to you. You're paying for a lot more than just some parts. Yes of course - I payed a lot of money for my HEDD 192 and Avocet - but still it's good to see gear getting cheaper and hopefully still offering a high level of performance.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 7, 2018 12:58:02 GMT -6
Do Mac Minis and laptops still have the mini Toslink built into the headphone jack? At least in the MBP, discontinued in the last model I believe. Most people never knew it was there. That sucks it was a crappy connection but I used it for years on a Mac mini as a music server with a JW modded MCM dac.
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Post by jeromemason on Apr 7, 2018 13:11:57 GMT -6
Takes Toslink, so that optical connection from the Apollo should do it. You can also run on USB and stream the super high res stuff for just listening i guess. I'm not sure I'd want to imagine what a session at 768khz would do to a machine in our time right now.... Shouldn't be that bad. I work in 384kHz multi tracks all the time. As the Tidal service starts to capture more and more users I feel that we are going to for sure see more and more record companies requesting extremely high sample rates, both in tracking and mixing/mastering. If that's the case I don't see how all of us doing this everyday can survive on pure native.... I do extremely well running track counts in the 60's at 96/24 right now. But, theres no way I could do that same track count in 192 let alone 768/32! That's going to for sure going to make it impossible to do this natively, which I was really loving because honestly.
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Post by Blackdawg on Apr 7, 2018 13:23:27 GMT -6
Shouldn't be that bad. I work in 384kHz multi tracks all the time. As the Tidal service starts to capture more and more users I feel that we are going to for sure see more and more record companies requesting extremely high sample rates, both in tracking and mixing/mastering. If that's the case I don't see how all of us doing this everyday can survive on pure native.... I do extremely well running track counts in the 60's at 96/24 right now. But, theres no way I could do that same track count in 192 let alone 768/32! That's going to for sure going to make it impossible to do this natively, which I was really loving because honestly. yeah that is true Im not on a Native system. Im on a Mass core. That said, Masscore is a PITA to keep running. For some reason the Native software is way more stable. In the classical work doing everything in DXD is already catching on a lot. Everything I record is in 384 DXD. 24/96 for our back up.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Apr 7, 2018 21:57:04 GMT -6
So, it said at Project's website it doesn't work with Mac's running Sierra. Has this changed, or am I left wishing I could buy one, but it won't ever happen for Mac's?
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Post by jeromemason on Apr 8, 2018 0:00:55 GMT -6
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Post by illacov on Apr 8, 2018 6:01:33 GMT -6
Some of this is over my head, but I've wished I could have better D/A (and A/D) for along time but just can't see getting one when I could buy a Lewitt 640 mic or a Soyuz 0-13, a Stam SA67 or a Golden Age 47 for what they cost. Is there any way to make the one Jim's been talking about work with my iMac running Sierra and my UAD Apollo 8? I checked and you have SPDIF on the Apollo. That's how you can use it on MAC is over the coaxial or toslink connections via your current converters. Since it won't work via OSX drivers this is my recommendation. Thanks -L.
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