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Post by ChaseUTB on Aug 15, 2017 11:08:05 GMT -6
Never ever have disrespected you, called you outside your name, and have always tried to help you as well. Good to know how you actually feel about someone you don't even know who has always shown you and treated you with upmost respect ... I must have really said something that bothered you considering this had zero to do with you, and wasn't even an issue. but you had to had to jump in and take Up for your buddy.. I'm the tool tho haha have a smiley face emoji 😀 Yes, that's right. I found your attempted dress-down of Indiehouse immature and out of line. Doesn't mean it's how I "actually feel" about you but it does mean it's how I actually feel about that post. I've told the best of my lifelong buddies, on occasion, "dude, you were being a dick" and they've, thankfully, done the same for me. The thing to do is to, without knee-jerking into melodrama, just admit "yeah, I was outta line". Calm honesty works wonders in my experience. I honestly don't care about your opinion. Funny you call me out but not your buddy for the same. Also, you don't know me and I am not your lifelong buddy. You of all people felt the need to say something so you are involving yourself in other ppl business, I mind my own. I waited a few days to respond to this and I still feel the *same way I do today about your interjections ... edit* Again, I don't disrespect anyone here I don't call out anyone or start issues unless sometimes brings the bs my way... not sure why either when I offer my endless help, my time can be used for better than going back and forth on a forum.
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Post by ragan on Aug 15, 2017 11:21:21 GMT -6
Yes, that's right. I found your attempted dress-down of Indiehouse immature and out of line. Doesn't mean it's how I "actually feel" about you but it does mean it's how I actually feel about that post. I've told the best of my lifelong buddies, on occasion, "dude, you were being a dick" and they've, thankfully, done the same for me. The thing to do is to, without knee-jerking into melodrama, just admit "yeah, I was outta line". Calm honesty works wonders in my experience. I honestly don't care about your opinion. Funny you call me out but not your buddy for the same. Also, you don't know me and I am not your lifelong buddy. You of all people felt the need to say something so you are involving yourself in other ppl business, I mind my own. I waited a few days to respond to this and I still feel the *same way I do today about your interjections ... edit* Again, I don't disrespect anyone here I don't call out anyone or start issues unless sometimes brings the bs my way... not sure why either when I offer my endless help, my time can be used for better than going back and forth on a forum. Fair enough, Chase. I don't have the slightest interest in convincing you of anything really. Indiehouse had a snarky one line comment towards you and you responded with an onslaught of personal insults. I gave you my opinion on that and you didn't like it. Totally fine. We see it differently.
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Post by ChaseUTB on Aug 15, 2017 15:35:42 GMT -6
I honestly don't care about your opinion. Funny you call me out but not your buddy for the same. Also, you don't know me and I am not your lifelong buddy. You of all people felt the need to say something so you are involving yourself in other ppl business, I mind my own. I waited a few days to respond to this and I still feel the *same way I do today about your interjections ... edit* Again, I don't disrespect anyone here I don't call out anyone or start issues unless sometimes brings the bs my way... not sure why either when I offer my endless help, my time can be used for better than going back and forth on a forum. Fair enough, Chase. Â I don't have the slightest interest in convincing you of anything really. Â Indiehouse had a snarky one line comment towards you and you responded with an onslaught of personal insults. Â I gave you my opinion on that and you didn't like it. Â Totally fine. Â We see it differently. Â It's been multiple from him. Thanks for understanding and agreeing to disagree. I respect you and appreciate your response.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2017 15:49:18 GMT -6
Very civil round these parts..
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Post by jazznoise on Aug 15, 2017 15:57:33 GMT -6
Woah nelly
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Post by indiehouse on Aug 15, 2017 17:56:45 GMT -6
It's been multiple from him. I agree to disagree. I honestly don't know what you're talking about, and I don't appreciate the slander against my character. You made a joke (that you felt the need to disclaimer), and I said it wasn't funny. No harm. Now you're aggrandizing the situation and making me out to be some bully or something. I'm not, and I'd appreciate it if you just drop it and leave it alone.
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Post by c0rtland on Aug 16, 2017 14:03:49 GMT -6
To the OP.
not much.
I have a pet theory.
I think that the middlemen, Spotify Apple YouTube etc blah blah will always have new music to sell. even if artist's can't make music for a living wage, they will still make music. A lot of creative people don't really have a choice in the matter. They make art because they HAVE to for their personal meaning in life and enjoyment. That's why I am involved in music. I have never been delusional enough to think getting involved in the industry would be a wise financial decision.
If you can scratch together a living doing whatever it is you love, then you are winning big time. Even if you can't make a living doing what you love, but find a way to do it anyhow, you are still winning. .
Even John Lennon was disgruntled about the percentages. In his last television interview he expressed animosity towards the industry saying that the Beatles didn't even see a lot of the money they were bringing in. It was siphoned off before they even knew it was there. Granted what they were left with was still a living wage (lol), but greed and people taking advantage of one another is absolutely nothing new.
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Post by Guitar on Aug 16, 2017 14:48:47 GMT -6
That's a good theory, I like it.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Aug 16, 2017 21:11:31 GMT -6
When I was in high school during the early '60s friends earned $100-200 each every weekend playing in bands.
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Post by EmRR on Aug 16, 2017 21:56:35 GMT -6
When I was in high school during the early '60s friends earned $100-200 each every weekend playing in bands. Yeah, it's a heckuva change from that to now. Band I was in 1990, played the local music club on a nice summer evening, weekday I think, $3 cover, we left with $2600 1990 dollars. That's $4880 today. We weren't any kind of particular draw. We gave the opening act $600. Club changed hands the next year, never saw over $300 after that. I go to shows now, lucky to find 25 people there, many times less than 10.
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Post by rowmat on Aug 16, 2017 22:55:16 GMT -6
25 years ago my studio partner's band would get $100 each per member for a bar gig.
A beer was $1.40 and a bar meal was $8.00
Today a beer is $7.00 and a bar meal is $30.00
And today's going rate for each band member?... $100!
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Post by EmRR on Aug 17, 2017 10:06:55 GMT -6
You'd be hard pressed to get over $100 for the whole band here today, on average. Some better, a lot actually much worse, maybe nothing but a few comped drinks.
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Post by Bender on Aug 17, 2017 10:11:50 GMT -6
You'd be hard pressed to get over $100 for the whole band here today, on average. Some better, a lot actually much worse, maybe nothing but a few comped drinks. Ain't that the truth, IMO that is one reason why us younger folks are all about these DIY/underground/BYOB/illegal venues. They help create relationships in a scene, and usually they're fair/democratic when it comes to payment,booking, and opportunities.
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Post by ragan on Aug 17, 2017 10:17:19 GMT -6
I have friends that tour on the "living room show" thing. They love it.
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Post by EmRR on Aug 17, 2017 11:17:05 GMT -6
I have friends that tour on the "living room show" thing. They love it. Frequently the best deal going.
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Post by jazznoise on Aug 17, 2017 11:47:41 GMT -6
I have friends that tour on the "living room show" thing. They love it. We've done living room shows for bands and often even with less than half the capacity they make more than a venue show would. It's the obsession with "professionalism" that hinders so many, you have to do what's right for you.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Aug 17, 2017 11:58:35 GMT -6
The steady decline in in pay for musicians is the elephant in the room. High school kids are no longer exposed to great live music at reasonable prices and volume levels. It's why I think most are not engaged listeners who will happily buy records.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 17, 2017 14:07:26 GMT -6
You'd be hard pressed to get over $100 for the whole band here today, on average. Some better, a lot actually much worse, maybe nothing but a few comped drinks. That must be for an original band with not much following right? Cover bands are still doing better than than, at least around here. $100/man seems to be the average for a cover bar gig. I stopped playing those gigs a few years ago because the time and effort isn't worth the hundo.
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Post by Guitar on Aug 17, 2017 14:28:50 GMT -6
Yeah, unfortunately, I've been bled out of the live show experience, based on knowing what it used to be like in the early 2000's vs now.
It's hard to find a rewarding gig. The best ones do seem to be houses and DIY venues.
It would be hard to explain to someone what it used to feel like, vs now, if they weren't there.
That said a lot of my friends "live to play live" so it's what they have to do to feed their muse. I was dreaming about playing a solo gig sometime this year, maybe it will happen.
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Post by drbill on Aug 17, 2017 15:26:12 GMT -6
The big cities and the music centers seem to be the worst as far as wages go for gigging musicians. $50 a night is pretty standard in LA. Unless you're PAYING to play - or unless you're backing up a mega-star. I had a buddy who plays jazz move out of LA to Sedona, AZ and now he plays as many nights a week as he wants, and makes 2-3X's as much as he did in LA for way less effort. Now he's able to buy a house, live the life, etc. whereas LA was just a creative and financial sucking....
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Post by EmRR on Aug 17, 2017 15:33:03 GMT -6
You'd be hard pressed to get over $100 for the whole band here today, on average. Some better, a lot actually much worse, maybe nothing but a few comped drinks. That must be for an original band with not much following right? Cover bands are still doing better than than, at least around here. $100/man seems to be the average for a cover bar gig. I stopped playing those gigs a few years ago because the time and effort isn't worth the hundo. Right.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Aug 17, 2017 18:43:43 GMT -6
The problem is people willing to play for free or even pay to play.
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Post by jimwilliams on Aug 18, 2017 14:07:02 GMT -6
In LA back in the the early 1980's the club would only book you if you pre-bought all the tickets for the show. Then it was up to the band to re-sell them to re-coup their investment. Usually they were given away just to put some bodies in front of the stage. The payback was "being seen".
Musicians are worth even less today. Lessen the supply and demand will rise.
Clubs make their money off of booze anyway.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Aug 18, 2017 14:20:24 GMT -6
By the way, I'm NOT a musician, just an observer.
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Post by rowmat on Aug 18, 2017 16:54:39 GMT -6
What really killed off many of the live music venues over here was when the clubs and bars put in poker machines.
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