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Post by rowmat on Aug 1, 2017 19:18:28 GMT -6
Wunder CM49 vs FLEA 49 vs FLEA 49 Next? Now that I officially have the bug for an M49 mic, has anyone tried any of these? Heck I'm curious if anyone has tried the Flea 49 Next vs the standard Flea 49. I don't want to spend 3k on the next and think, oh if only I'd spent the extra grand. Same for the Wunder. I don't want to spend 4K on the Flea and think, maybe I should have just saved for the Wunder. I cannot find any clips directly comparing these to each other. I had the Flea 47 in my studio last month and was floored at how good it sound. Different than the Wagner U47W I had tried in the past. It actually worked better on my voice than the Wagner which had a larger low end, probably due to the VF14 tube vs the EF12. So right now the plan is to save for a FLEA 49, but I figured I'd ask about the Wunder and the Next and see if anyone has any thoughts. I'm actually thinking of getting the FLEA 249 which has the more readily available cable. You don't see them for sale very often but a Wagner U47 just sold here in Oz on eBay for $8,300 USD ($10,400 AUD) which was more than twice what I paid for a new Flea 47 Vintage two years ago. www.ebay.com.au/itm/Wagner-U47-Microphone-/162600197772
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Post by jampa on Aug 2, 2017 2:06:52 GMT -6
Rumour is Beesneez have M49 and M50 style mics coming out
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 2, 2017 4:57:27 GMT -6
rowmat, having used a Wagner U47W I can say it is an incredible microphone. It just sounds like a vintage mic. The U47 doesn't really work for my voice though. It tends to beef up the mids which is nice, but my voice is naturally warm. It also has this compression quality on the high notes which for most people sounds incredible, but for me dulls my top range. The more neutral M49 worked better. jampa, that's cool. I'd be especially interested to see the costs of those. I would also love to see and hear some more M50 style mics on the market. I'm currently building a Decca Tree myself.
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Post by rowmat on Aug 2, 2017 11:18:50 GMT -6
rowmat , having used a Wagner U47W I can say it is an incredible microphone. It just sounds like a vintage mic. The U47 doesn't really work for my voice though. It tends to beef up the mids which is nice, but my voice is naturally warm. It also has this compression quality on the high notes which for most people sounds incredible, but for me dulls my top range. The more neutral M49 worked better... Many felt the Wagner U47W was the closest U47 style mic to an original U47 when it came out.
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Post by wiz on Aug 2, 2017 15:29:30 GMT -6
rowmat , having used a Wagner U47W I can say it is an incredible microphone. It just sounds like a vintage mic. The U47 doesn't really work for my voice though. It tends to beef up the mids which is nice, but my voice is naturally warm. It also has this compression quality on the high notes which for most people sounds incredible, but for me dulls my top range. The more neutral M49 worked better... Many felt the Wagner U47W was the closest U47 style mic to an original U47 when it came out. Gunter is a really good bloke, and I should have taken the offer of purchasing one, back when.... ah well... They are made up of real parts, so.. to my mind, they were vintage mics. cheers Wiz
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Post by sean on Aug 3, 2017 10:08:05 GMT -6
We did 8 songs in a day and while I set up a few microphones, I just went with Flea 49. My opinion of it is that it's a little thick in 300-700 range, and it's missing a bit at 7K and above. Good separation recording guitar/piano at the same time.
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 3, 2017 12:10:19 GMT -6
I'm hoping to try out a Flea 49 and an M149 (may as well try it, as I haven't yet, although I know it's a different beast) with my usual dealer. It will mean a trip to Connecticut, but a day trip is less expensive that either of these mics. Once I try them, possibly bring my CM49 with me too for a comparison and reference, I'll have a better idea of what I want to do. There is a good chance I'll work with Shannon down the road either way.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,982
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Post by ericn on Aug 3, 2017 13:36:35 GMT -6
Peppers proshop has one for $12k plus if you want the real thing
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 3, 2017 16:05:48 GMT -6
I just don't have that kind of cash. I'm going to really have to find the funds for the Flea.
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Post by jtc111 on Aug 3, 2017 18:27:00 GMT -6
I just don't have that kind of cash. I'm going to really have to find the funds for the Flea. That said... if anyone needs their leaves raked or their lawn mowed, Vincent is available for side jobs. (I was looking for a good opening for my first post and this seemed to be as good as I was likely to find) Jim
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 3, 2017 21:30:37 GMT -6
I just don't have that kind of cash. I'm going to really have to find the funds for the Flea. That said... if anyone needs their leaves raked or their lawn mowed, Vincent is available for side jobs. (I was looking for a good opening for my first post and this seemed to be as good as I was likely to find) Jim Ultimately Jim, it was your Flea 47 that has given me this bug.
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Post by ChaseUTB on Aug 3, 2017 22:35:38 GMT -6
I just don't have that kind of cash. I'm going to really have to find the funds for the Flea. That said... if anyone needs their leaves raked or their lawn mowed, Vincent is available for side jobs. (I was looking for a good opening for my first post and this seemed to be as good as I was likely to find) Jim Welcome to RGO 😀
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Post by Ward on Aug 4, 2017 6:09:38 GMT -6
I just don't have that kind of cash. I'm going to really have to find the funds for the Flea. That said... if anyone needs their leaves raked or their lawn mowed, Vincent is available for side jobs. (I was looking for a good opening for my first post and this seemed to be as good as I was likely to find) Jim I think you'll fit in just fine here.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,982
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Post by ericn on Aug 4, 2017 7:10:53 GMT -6
I just don't have that kind of cash. I'm going to really have to find the funds for the Flea. There is always time to dream!
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Post by jtc111 on Aug 4, 2017 8:12:19 GMT -6
That said... if anyone needs their leaves raked or their lawn mowed, Vincent is available for side jobs. (I was looking for a good opening for my first post and this seemed to be as good as I was likely to find) Jim Ultimately Jim, it was your Flea 47 that has given me this bug. It's a shame the 47 doesn't produce quite the same kind of magic for you because the Lauten Audio Atlantis might have done you well for about $1500.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 4, 2017 8:42:05 GMT -6
Welcome to the forum JTC!
The Atlantis is a very good mic. I preferred my old Blackspade UM17R to it when I did a shootout at Fab Dupont's Flux Studios a few years ago, but it's undeniably good quality. I haven't heard their Eden yet, which is supposed to be a step up from the Atlantis. I'd like to try one eventually. At $2,500 it could be a great deal relative to the cost of some high end clones.
One problem with mics in this price range is $2,500 is way too much money to spend if it isn't the right thing. Better to save and spend $3,500 than $2,500 and still be wanting more. It's smarter to grab a really nice Stam or Warm U87 style mic until you can afford what you really want. Those mics are not second rate, they're excellent in their own right, and don't have that cheap Chinese capsule sound.
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Post by joseph on Aug 4, 2017 9:16:03 GMT -6
rowmat , having used a Wagner U47W I can say it is an incredible microphone. It just sounds like a vintage mic. The U47 doesn't really work for my voice though. It tends to beef up the mids which is nice, but my voice is naturally warm. It also has this compression quality on the high notes which for most people sounds incredible, but for me dulls my top range. The more neutral M49 worked better. jampa , that's cool. I'd be especially interested to see the costs of those. I would also love to see and hear some more M50 style mics on the market. I'm currently building a Decca Tree myself. Seems like you should audition a few other mics too, aside from the Flea 49/49 next (speaking as a Flea 47 owner). Perhaps the Josephson C715 with C37 type capsule, not tube but very flattering mic with soft lows, extended delicate highs without the big CK12 phase shift; Manley Reference Silver which is based on C37A and uses same Josephson capsule; and the Brauner Valvet X, which is more neutral and open than U87 or 67 but not as bright or prone to sibilance as their other mics. Also the Chandler, which has less overall mid push than 47, albeit still colored, and more extended up top. It seems like if you don't drive the internal preamp hard it wouldn't be more compressed than a 49.
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Post by drbill on Aug 4, 2017 11:31:58 GMT -6
I'm down with almost every kind of clone out there.....
Except for one. The M49. I remain skeptical but hopeful. I know it's doubtful I'll ever own one of the MAGIC originals. If some company figures out how to cram the magic dust into a clone, then that would be an instant contender for me.
Until then "voiced similar", "shaped right" or having number that says 49 on it doesn't do it for me after using several magic M49's. I suppose the same applies to M50's - but as I'm not recording orchestras right now, I don't really jones for them as much - and I have a buddy that still has 10 of em if I need to get my hands on some.
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Post by jtc111 on Aug 4, 2017 12:33:53 GMT -6
Welcome to the forum JTC! The Atlantis is a very good mic. I preferred my old Blackspade UM17R to it when I did a shootout at Fab Dupont's Flux Studios a few years ago, but it's undeniably good quality. I haven't heard their Eden yet, which is supposed to be a step up from the Atlantis. I'd like to try one eventually. At $2,500 it could be a great deal relative to the cost of some high end clones. One problem with mics in this price range is $2,500 is way too much money to spend if it isn't the right thing. Better to save and spend $3,500 than $2,500 and still be wanting more. It's smarter to grab a really nice Stam or Warm U87 style mic until you can afford what you really want. Those mics are not second rate, they're excellent in their own right, and don't have that cheap Chinese capsule sound. I bought the Atlantis primarily to pair with my Flea 47 in a mid-side configuration. I've been working on drums and bass for a couple of songs and have been using the Atlantis to lay down the scratch vocal tracks. I'm really surprised at how nice it sounds. It doesn't have the big round bottom that the Flea has but it does have rich mids and a nice silky top end. To my ears it has more of a 47 vibe than the less expensive mics I've heard trying to accomplish the same thing. I've never heard the Blackspade, so I can't compare the two. Vincent and I have been having similar conversations to what you mention in your second paragraph about mics and value. If I'm laying down thousands for a mic, I'd like to know going in there's a good chance the hit won't be too bad should I decide that mic wasn't really the right choice. I had no qualms about buying the Flea because I knew that if I decided to sell it in a year or two, the hit wouldn't be more than a few hundred dollars (the price went up right after I bought it so now I could probably make money by selling it). Other mics don't fare so well. For example, I have a Blue Kiwi that I got in a trade for an Avalon M5 and it's resale is about half of the retail price. I'm glad I didn't buy that one new.
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 7, 2017 10:55:48 GMT -6
Well, it looks like I'm actually going to be able to demo a FLEA 49 courtesy of Vintage King Audio. I was speaking with them about the current promotion soyuz has allowing people to demo their mics. I asked instead if I could demo a FLEA 49. You can bet there will at least be a shoot out video.... maybe two.
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Post by jtc111 on Aug 7, 2017 12:30:16 GMT -6
You can bet there will at least be a shoot out video.... maybe two. The 47 vs the 49 ...it will be as epic as The Battle of the Bastards!
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Post by rowmat on Aug 7, 2017 17:38:20 GMT -6
Although M49's are often considered more of a go to mic especially for female vox than a U47 because of the 47's more present mids I found our Mercury V76m pre works a treat with our Flea 47 on female vox.
That said I still have a 49 on my wishlist.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 7, 2017 18:03:23 GMT -6
My original Blackspade UM-17 was a dead ringer for the M-49. It had a very similar sound and vibe to the Nora Jones debut CD. I tried one M49 next to a U47, and U67, and in comparison, it was too thin. I don't think it was a particularly good example because it sure wasn't magical. That's not to say other 49's aren't.
Vincent, you'd do well to find a Blackspade UM-17 and have it modded to be cardioid only. That would give you around 4-6db more gain, (it needs a little more heat). You can also have the Thiersch M7 capsule installed in it.
I had a borrowed U47 at my place once when my wife was doing a vocal, and she said, "give me my mic", meaning the Blackspade. It was that good on female vocals.
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Post by rowmat on Aug 7, 2017 18:43:04 GMT -6
Never heard anyone refer to a M49 as "thin". Sounds like it was either broken or inadvertently had the lows EQ'd out of it.
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Post by drbill on Aug 7, 2017 19:37:24 GMT -6
Never heard anyone refer to a M49 as "thin". Sounds like it was either broken or inadvertently had the lows EQ'd out of it. Ditto. M49 is the holy grail of all mics if you find a magic one. They are almost all REALLY great sounding, but there are a few out there that transcend microphone-dom. Thin is not a descriptor of any M49 I've ever heard.
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