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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 22, 2021 14:26:23 GMT -6
Really? Oh, that's really good to know. So better to just turn them on and leave them on until I shut it down for the evening? Or just leave them on forever? That doesn't seem right, I've burned out amplifier tubes that way.
I doubt that being powered on all the time killed your amp tubes. Were they NOS or new? If new I would assume that they just died. Many new tubes are somewhat less than reliable. I've had new tubes that lasted a couple weeks before blowing. grrr...
Funny you say that. I had just gotten work done on my amp including new tubes. My brother was in town and left it on overnight. In the morning, crapola. I was pretty pissed assuming that he had blown them out by leaving the thing on so long and not in standby. Maybe I owe him an apology!
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Post by johneppstein on May 22, 2021 14:33:08 GMT -6
I doubt that being powered on all the time killed your amp tubes. Were they NOS or new? If new I would assume that they just died. Many new tubes are somewhat less than reliable. I've had new tubes that lasted a couple weeks before blowing. grrr...
Funny you say that. I had just gotten work done on my amp including new tubes. My brother was in town and left it on overnight. In the morning, crapola. I was pretty pissed assuming that he had blown them out by leaving the thing on so long and not in standby. Maybe I owe him an apology! If an amp blows its tubes from being left on overnight, either the tubes were defective or the amp has a problem. You could have one or more leaky coupling caps that are causing your bias to go off, causing overheating and tube damage. Generally you'll see some degree of red or orange glow on the plate of the tube, indicating loss of bias. Another symptom of this problem is that often the amp will start to sound unusually good before it blows.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 22, 2021 14:36:56 GMT -6
Another symptom of this problem is that often the amp will start to sound unusually good before it blows. This is a perfect metaphor for my life.
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Post by EmRR on May 22, 2021 15:04:01 GMT -6
Er, no. Actually turning tubes on and off a lot wears them out much faster than leaving them on. Thermal cycling. Really? Oh, that's really good to know. So better to just turn them on and leave them on until I shut it down for the evening? Or just leave them on forever? That doesn't seem right, I've burned out amplifier tubes that way. You turn that shit off unless you just want to buy new tubes every year or so. I've been turning many many tubes on and off for 20+ years with no failures or related aging. They're still going strong. I defy anyone here to come up with a larger count of tubes they turn on/off more frequently than I.
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Post by svart on May 22, 2021 15:34:34 GMT -6
Er, no. Actually turning tubes on and off a lot wears them out much faster than leaving them on. Thermal cycling. Really? Oh, that's really good to know. So better to just turn them on and leave them on until I shut it down for the evening? Or just leave them on forever? That doesn't seem right, I've burned out amplifier tubes that way. Ever notice that bulbs would pop when you turned them on? The halogen cycle technically should replenish the tungsten alloy filaments in lightbulbs, so they should last forever if the gas fill holds. Most of the time it slowly leaks and the filaments thin out and pop when the thermal stress is eventually higher than the mechanical strength of the filament. Same for tubes.
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Post by svart on May 22, 2021 15:35:48 GMT -6
There's also a lightbulb in a theater in Chicago that's been on for something like 100+ years. Nobody is allowed to turn it off because they know it'll probably pop.
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Post by ragan on May 22, 2021 15:58:37 GMT -6
There's also a lightbulb in a theater in Chicago that's been on for something like 100+ years. Nobody is allowed to turn it off because they know it'll probably pop. That's the kind of weird thing I would actually seek out as a tourist. Throwin' that in the notes for the next time I'm in Chicago.
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Post by jampa on May 22, 2021 16:48:45 GMT -6
There's also a lightbulb in a theater in Chicago that's been on for something like 100+ years. Nobody is allowed to turn it off because they know it'll probably pop. That's the kind of weird thing I would actually seek out as a tourist. Throwin' that in the notes for the next time I'm in Chicago. I mean I get it, but that's a hard sell to anyone else right
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 22, 2021 17:23:47 GMT -6
I was always taught to zero out the console between sessions and this included turning off all the phantom power. As consoles got cheaper (think Mackie) indicator LEDS became less prevalent and switch positions hard to read. As much as I am a firm believer that all gear should be designed to take accidental phantom, even kept some phantom blocking custom adaptors on ribbons, I still think a zeroing of the console and racks is a must. A ramping phantom supply probably makes theoretical sense but I’m not sure if it makes economic sense. Maybe if you don’t expect every single pre amp to offer phantom and plan on using a outboard phantom supply.
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Post by jcoutu1 on May 22, 2021 17:26:35 GMT -6
I've got an old International Scout II Diesel that I bought a block heater for. Never installed it though, the glow plugs do the trick, even in winter here, which isn't very extreme. No joke, you're the coolest dude I know. (and this is not sarcastic)
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Post by mrholmes on May 22, 2021 17:33:37 GMT -6
And more environmental friendly, which is a big topic for all of us.
That car was the least environmentally friendly thing ever created. But, I’ll say this. Microphones and cars. Buy German and you’ll never regret it. I am not sure if we Germans hold up the QC standard in the future. Cars? Drove a Tesla last week and I was impressed. Microphones? I bought three 2021 Octava MK012 with the new circuit board, and kept the best one. And hell if they would do a little more QC the MK012 should trouble some competitors, special at this price point. At least it’s a cheapie with character. Some google research shows that Russia wasn’t bad in making mics but always have been a bit jealous of the friends in east Germany Microtec Geffel. Germany shouldn’t be so self-assured. Many countries are snapping on our heals. Including the USA.... But ok ...we are still proud of being a small nation leading in some technology fields .... making 5 Billion dollars GNP a year. But hey things can change.
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Post by mrholmes on May 22, 2021 17:36:05 GMT -6
Double
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ericn
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Post by ericn on May 22, 2021 17:42:35 GMT -6
That car was the least environmentally friendly thing ever created. But, I’ll say this. Microphones and cars. Buy German and you’ll never regret it. I am not sure if we Germans hold up the QC standard in the future. Cars? Drove a Tesla last week and I was impressed. Microphones? I bought three 2021 Octava MK012 with the new circuit board, and kept the best one. And hell if they would do a little more QC the MK012 should trouble some competitors, special at this price point. At least it’s a cheapie with character. Some google research shows that Russia wasn’t bad in making mics but always have been a bit jealous of the friends in east Germany Microtec Geffel. Germany shouldn’t be so self-assured. Many countries are snapping on our heals. Including the USA.... But ok ...we are still proud of being a small nation leading in some technology fields .... making 5 Billion dollars GNP a year. But hey things can change. Hey Tesla’s Berlin factory should be opening soon.
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Post by johneppstein on May 22, 2021 17:45:01 GMT -6
What about things like the RND 535? I turn those off too when not in use because they run at about 10000 degrees. So I assumed it would extend their life by not running them all day long. Am I backwards on that too? 10,000 degrees?
R.U.Sirus?
They don't run at 10,000 degrees. They'd melt.
If they run excessively hot, allow me to recommend a new invention. We call it the fan, and thety're available in sizes appropriate for rack gear.
Yes, you're backwards on that, too. If stuff runs way too hot in your 500 rack, it's the designer's problem. Some designers cram, too much stuff into too small a space in a format intended for CONSOLE MODULES, not what it's been appropriated for. I don't use 500 stuff for that reason - there's no consistancy or quality control across rack manufacturers, let alone module designers, and I don't beta test for free. I do own SCAMP racks and some Allison moduilar stuff, but since those were proprietary they were subject to uniform quality control.
Yes, there are many great 500 format modules and designers. But the field itself is the Wild West.
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Post by johneppstein on May 22, 2021 17:55:42 GMT -6
That car was the least environmentally friendly thing ever created. But, I’ll say this. Microphones and cars. Buy German and you’ll never regret it. I am not sure if we Germans hold up the QC standard in the future. Cars? Drove a Tesla last week and I was impressed. Microphones? I bought three 2021 Octava MK012 with the new circuit board, and kept the best one. And hell if they would do a little more QC the MK012 should trouble some competitors, special at this price point. At least it’s a cheapie with character. Some google research shows that Russia wasn’t bad in making mics but always have been a bit jealous of the friends in east Germany Microtec Geffel. Germany shouldn’t be so self-assured. Many countries are snapping on our heals. Including the USA.... But ok ...we are still proud of being a small nation leading in some technology fields .... making 5 Billion dollars GNP a year. But hey things can change. Russia's main problem in electronics is and always has been quality control. Their communist philosophy unfortunately did not provide for great quality control.
And the USA has always made great mics, albeit often on a different design path from Germany.
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Post by chessparov on May 22, 2021 18:17:20 GMT -6
That's the kind of weird thing I would actually seek out as a tourist. Throwin' that in the notes for the next time I'm in Chicago. I mean I get it, but that's a hard sell to anyone else right Not to those seeking eternal enlightenment. Chris
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Post by ragan on May 22, 2021 18:23:36 GMT -6
I've got an old International Scout II Diesel that I bought a block heater for. Never installed it though, the glow plugs do the trick, even in winter here, which isn't very extreme. No joke, you're the coolest dude I know. (and this is not sarcastic) Heheh. We’ve gotta get you some cooler friends, Jesse. 😎
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Post by mrholmes on May 22, 2021 18:37:11 GMT -6
I am not sure if we Germans hold up the QC standard in the future. Cars? Drove a Tesla last week and I was impressed. Microphones? I bought three 2021 Octava MK012 with the new circuit board, and kept the best one. And hell if they would do a little more QC the MK012 should trouble some competitors, special at this price point. At least it’s a cheapie with character. Some google research shows that Russia wasn’t bad in making mics but always have been a bit jealous of the friends in east Germany Microtec Geffel. Germany shouldn’t be so self-assured. Many countries are snapping on our heals. Including the USA.... But ok ...we are still proud of being a small nation leading in some technology fields .... making 5 Billion dollars GNP a year. But hey things can change. Russia's main problem in electronics is and always has been quality control. Their communist philosophy unfortunately did not provide for great quality control.
And the USA has always made great mics, albeit often on a different design path from Germany.
Putin hates Germany and Octava is a rudimentary part of the past communistic state companies. It should not be a big deal to invent a better QC... I read that they get it with the capsules but they fail on the electronic parts. Doesn’t makes sense to me.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 22, 2021 21:23:12 GMT -6
That car was the least environmentally friendly thing ever created. But, I’ll say this. Microphones and cars. Buy German and you’ll never regret it. I am not sure if we Germans hold up the QC standard in the future. Cars? Drove a Tesla last week and I was impressed. Microphones? I bought three 2021 Octava MK012 with the new circuit board, and kept the best one. And hell if they would do a little more QC the MK012 should trouble some competitors, special at this price point. At least it’s a cheapie with character. Some google research shows that Russia wasn’t bad in making mics but always have been a bit jealous of the friends in east Germany Microtec Geffel. Germany shouldn’t be so self-assured. Many countries are snapping on our heals. Including the USA.... But ok ...we are still proud of being a small nation leading in some technology fields .... making 5 Billion dollars GNP a year. But hey things can change. After years and years of waiting I finally bought my first 3 series a couple years ago. Yeah it was second hand but it wasn't THAT old, newer than any car I've ever purchased before. And it was worth the wait, let me tell you. BMW is the Neumann of cars. (This deserves its own thread.) Maybe BMW is the Beyerdynamic of cars? You can afford to buy one if you save your money and then you realize it was even better than you thought it would be.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 22, 2021 21:27:47 GMT -6
What about things like the RND 535? I turn those off too when not in use because they run at about 10000 degrees. So I assumed it would extend their life by not running them all day long. Am I backwards on that too? 10,000 degrees?
R.U.Sirus?
They don't run at 10,000 degrees. They'd melt.
If they run excessively hot, allow me to recommend a new invention. We call it the fan, and thety're available in sizes appropriate for rack gear.
Yes, you're backwards on that, too. If stuff runs way too hot in your 500 rack, it's the designer's problem. Some designers cram, too much stuff into too small a space in a format intended for CONSOLE MODULES, not what it's been appropriated for. I don't use 500 stuff for that reason - there's no consistancy or quality control across rack manufacturers, let alone module designers, and I don't beta test for free. I do own SCAMP racks and some Allison moduilar stuff, but since those were proprietary they were subject to uniform quality control.
Yes, there are many great 500 format modules and designers. But the field itself is the Wild West.
I might have exaggerated by a few thousand degrees.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,982
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Post by ericn on May 22, 2021 21:51:23 GMT -6
I am not sure if we Germans hold up the QC standard in the future. Cars? Drove a Tesla last week and I was impressed. Microphones? I bought three 2021 Octava MK012 with the new circuit board, and kept the best one. And hell if they would do a little more QC the MK012 should trouble some competitors, special at this price point. At least it’s a cheapie with character. Some google research shows that Russia wasn’t bad in making mics but always have been a bit jealous of the friends in east Germany Microtec Geffel. Germany shouldn’t be so self-assured. Many countries are snapping on our heals. Including the USA.... But ok ...we are still proud of being a small nation leading in some technology fields .... making 5 Billion dollars GNP a year. But hey things can change. After years and years of waiting I finally bought my first 3 series a couple years ago. Yeah it was second hand but it wasn't THAT old, newer than any car I've ever purchased before. And it was worth the wait, let me tell you. BMW is the Neumann of cars. (This deserves its own thread.) Maybe BMW is the Beyerdynamic of cars? You can afford to buy one if you save your money and then you realize it was even better than you thought it would be. I have owned every major German brand, but I have to say going from the Merc/ AMG to the BMW X5 to the Tesla the X5 had so many stupid cheap engineering choices that I lost a lot of respect for the ultimate driving machine alone the way.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 22, 2021 21:57:46 GMT -6
After years and years of waiting I finally bought my first 3 series a couple years ago. Yeah it was second hand but it wasn't THAT old, newer than any car I've ever purchased before. And it was worth the wait, let me tell you. BMW is the Neumann of cars. (This deserves its own thread.) Maybe BMW is the Beyerdynamic of cars? You can afford to buy one if you save your money and then you realize it was even better than you thought it would be. I have owned every major German brand, but I have to say going from the Merc/ AMG to the BMW X5 to the Tesla the X5 had so many stupid cheap engineering choices that I lost a lot of respect for the ultimate driving machine alone the way. I know others will think they went south way before this, but to me the 3 series was good all the way up to 2020. Once they got rid of the analog speedo they lost me. As long as you have the M-Sport package and jack up all the dumb buttons you have to push to make it feel like a Beemer, you're good pre-2020. The peak modern BMW, to me, is the M 235. Big engine in a little car. Old school.
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Post by mrholmes on May 22, 2021 22:21:11 GMT -6
After years and years of waiting I finally bought my first 3 series a couple years ago. Yeah it was second hand but it wasn't THAT old, newer than any car I've ever purchased before. And it was worth the wait, let me tell you. BMW is the Neumann of cars. (This deserves its own thread.) Maybe BMW is the Beyerdynamic of cars? You can afford to buy one if you save your money and then you realize it was even better than you thought it would be. I have owned every major German brand, but I have to say going from the Merc/ AMG to the BMW X5 to the Tesla the X5 had so many stupid cheap engineering choices that I lost a lot of respect for the ultimate driving machine alone the way. My dad used to be a typical German car nerd. His opinion goes like this: Tesla gets all the good press, but you need to wait a few years. BMW and VW are late to the game, and when they are ready to flood the markets they get the good press. Maybe he is right. But given the fact that Musk was a nobody in building cars. Kudos he has balls. On the other hand he wants to go to Mars? That’s a bit crazy given the fact Mars is not giving a human friendly environment.... Btw. Can we stop the car analogy? Is it smart to use a clean external phantom PSU and which one would you recommend? I need four mics running constantly.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 22, 2021 22:29:31 GMT -6
I have owned every major German brand, but I have to say going from the Merc/ AMG to the BMW X5 to the Tesla the X5 had so many stupid cheap engineering choices that I lost a lot of respect for the ultimate driving machine alone the way. My dad used to be a typical German car nerd. His opinion goes like this: Tesla gets all the good press, but you need to wait a few years. BMW and VW are late to the game, and when they are ready to flood the markets they get the good press. Maybe he is right. But given the fact that Musk was a nobody in building cars. Kudos he has balls. On the other hand he wants to go to Mars? That’s a bit crazy given the fact Mars is not giving a human friendly environment.... Btw. Can we stop the car analogy? Is it smart to use a clean external phantom PSU and which one would you recommend? I need four mics running constantly. No more thread hijacking. I actually have the same question.
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Post by jampa on May 23, 2021 0:25:15 GMT -6
I don't think they offer it anymore, but Pueblo audio had some dedicated external phantom power units, 1500mA per channel. I believe the 48V specification is minimum 10mA per channel (corresponding to a max microphone draw of 10mA). The examples of the Pueblo I heard held up your signal like nothing else
To contrast this, I've had high current draw mics connected to low current supply pre-amps and they've lost headroom and clipped
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