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RND 5211
Oct 26, 2018 8:52:11 GMT -6
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Post by lcr on Oct 26, 2018 8:52:11 GMT -6
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Post by jtc111 on Oct 26, 2018 9:08:50 GMT -6
sexy
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RND 5211
Oct 26, 2018 9:42:19 GMT -6
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Ward likes this
Post by Quint on Oct 26, 2018 9:42:19 GMT -6
I don't get it. Aren't they the exact same feature set as the 500 series 511?
5211 = $1995
511 x 2 = $1090
The psu and extra metal work can't cost $895 can it? Maybe I'm missing something?
All that being said, I DO need to try one of these or the 511 one of these days. Also, I wish all 500 series units had individual power switches on them like the RND stuff does.
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Post by 79sg on Oct 26, 2018 14:48:11 GMT -6
Mine arrived this week. There are differences from the 511, the 5211 does not have an input transformer (uses a TLA I believe), it uses the Shelford output transformer, interestingly it has 2 outputs for each mic pre, 1 of them is -6dB lower output then the other which allows you to hit the pre much harder without clipping. You can and I have recorded simultaneously taking 1 mic input to 2 tracks using both outputs. I run one output into a compressor and the other straight to the DAW. So it's not just a racked 511. Great sounding pre, very flexible. I've never gone down the 500 series route.
Here's a picture of the back of the 5211:
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RND 5211
Oct 27, 2018 19:04:42 GMT -6
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EmRR likes this
Post by Johnkenn on Oct 27, 2018 19:04:42 GMT -6
I always thought the input transformer was what really colored the sound - therefore really being the most important part.
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 27, 2018 21:23:17 GMT -6
Pardon me for being a dumbass...but the input gain on a two stage mic pre is driving the output transformer?
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,921 
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Post by ericn on Oct 27, 2018 21:30:57 GMT -6
Pardon me for being a dumbass...but the input gain on a two stage mic pre is driving the output transformer? All of the adjustable gain in a pre with an input transformer is after the input transformer so both stages drive the output transformer, make sense? |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,921
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RND 5211
Oct 28, 2018 7:41:43 GMT -6
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79sg likes this
Post by ericn on Oct 28, 2018 7:41:43 GMT -6
All of the adjustable gain in a pre with an input transformer is after the input transformer so both stages drive the output transformer, make sense? I too am a (bigger) dumbass - so if both drive the output then an OUTPUT control lowers the gain after the OUTPUT TRANSFORMER (?) thus allowing you to drive the output and input transformers via the available gain (does that make any sense what I wrote?)  Not dumb, but no the output transformer is the very last thing in the preamp, both gain stages are between the transformers. Transformers are for the most part there so the preamp can deal with the outside world, the input transformer is there so the preamp can deal with the microphone and the output transformer is there so it can deal with what ever the preamp is plugged into. |
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Post by iamasound on Oct 28, 2018 9:30:10 GMT -6
My Daking Mic Pre One uses the same topography, yes/no, Eric, though without the Silk?
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RND 5211
Oct 28, 2018 9:58:43 GMT -6
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 28, 2018 9:58:43 GMT -6
On a two stage pre there are two output trans. So one is the gain and one is the fader, right? I guess I’ve been somewhat conflating “color” and “drive/distortion”. Yes, the input transformer indelibly colors whatever sound is coming in...but the output transformer determines the “drive” sound. So the dirty we are hearing when we drive a Neve or an (C)API is the output transformer.
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RND 5211
Oct 28, 2018 10:03:51 GMT -6
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 28, 2018 10:03:51 GMT -6
So the TLA is basically a circuit that does what an input trans does - just more cleanly? The you can dial in color with the silk button? What the hell is that?
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,921
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RND 5211
Oct 28, 2018 10:15:57 GMT -6
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EmRR likes this
Post by ericn on Oct 28, 2018 10:15:57 GMT -6
On a two stage pre there are two output trans. So one is the gain and one is the fader, right? I guess I’ve been somewhat conflating “color” and “drive/distortion”. Yes, the input transformer indelibly colors whatever sound is coming in...but the output transformer determines the “drive” sound. So the dirty we are hearing when we drive a Neve or an (C)API is the output transformer. Not all 2 stage pres use 2 output transformers. |
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Post by 79sg on Oct 28, 2018 10:30:11 GMT -6
So the TLA is basically a circuit that does what an input trans does - just more cleanly? The you can dial in color with the silk button? What the hell is that? If the question pertains to silk, then instead of me explaining what silk is and does here it is from RND's website and for what it's worth, it's awesome. It's one of my favorite features on the RND Master Buss Processor as well. If it has to do with the TLA, I'll post that too.
From RND:
What is Silk? In brief, Silk is a tonal option applied within the unit’s output stage that manipulates the signal’s harmonic content to create the sonic character associated with Rupert Neve’s vintage modules. By reducing negative feedback and saturating the output transformer while adjusting the frequency spectrum, Silk provides a sweet, musical enhancement of the input signal – and when the level is driven to the edge of its headroom, the Silk’s effect is multiplied.
Mic input:
The microphone input is balanced but not floating, using a Transformer-Like-Amplifier (T.L.A.) configuration to capture the microphone’s signal in as pure a manner as possible. With the +48V phantom voltage switched off, this input serves as an extremely high quality line input with an impedance of 10K Ohms.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,921
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RND 5211
Oct 28, 2018 21:08:10 GMT -6
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Post by ericn on Oct 28, 2018 21:08:10 GMT -6
My Daking Mic Pre One uses the same topography, yes/no, Eric, though without the Silk? I thought the Daking Model one had the input transformer but used the Jensen designed That chip like the 500 series, but I might be wrong. |
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Post by adamjbrass on Oct 29, 2018 14:35:24 GMT -6
I don't get it. Aren't they the exact same feature set as the 500 series 511? 5211 = $1995 511 x 2 = $1090 The psu and extra metal work can't cost $895 can it? Maybe I'm missing something? All that being said, I DO need to try one of these or the 511 one of these days. Also, I wish all 500 series units had individual power switches on them like the RND stuff does That is not an unresonable number, also consider the circuit board and even the larger packaging materials. As well, the labor to assemble it. Many things... |
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Post by iamasound on Nov 1, 2018 15:46:57 GMT -6
My Daking Mic Pre One uses the same topography, yes/no, Eric, though without the Silk? I thought the Daking Model one had the input transformer but used the Jensen designed That chip like the 500 series, but I might be wrong. Of course you are right. |
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Ox Han
Junior Member
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RND 5211
Mar 2, 2023 12:14:59 GMT -6
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Post by Ox Han on Mar 2, 2023 12:14:59 GMT -6
I’m also curious as to the sonic differences between the 5211 and the 511. I like the 511 a lot and am considering buying another.
According to RND’s website, both the 511 and the 5211 are TLA input designs. They both ostensibly have the same metering, HPF, and silk/texture features. The 5211 has the Shelford output “double tap” transformer while the 511 has the portico output transformer.
Has anyone used both and if so, are they very distinguishable?
Thanks!
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Post by RealNoob on Mar 2, 2023 22:13:11 GMT -6
Daking Pres have a Jensen Input Transformer and have gone back and forth with output transformers. The Pre/EQ had both but the 4 channel and the MP1 when first out did not. Now, it looks like with the rack units, you can choose.
Geoff has said in the past that the output trannies did not impart any sonic signature. That may be different now.
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RND 5211
Mar 4, 2023 4:20:18 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by javamad on Mar 4, 2023 4:20:18 GMT -6
I have 2 x 511 in my studio.
I still cant believe how cheap they are and how good comparing to other pro level pres like API and BAE which cost literally twice as much per channel.
I use them all the time on pretty much anything and if I was starting again or looking for a good set of pres in a 500 rack, 6 of these would be a killer deal.
The only downside would be no DI input but if you have that covered elsewhere I see no reason not to kit youself out with a bunch of these pres.
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Ox Han
Junior Member
Posts: 72
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Post by Ox Han on Mar 6, 2023 9:49:18 GMT -6
Daking Pres have a Jensen Input Transformer and have gone back and forth with output transformers. The Pre/EQ had both but the 4 channel and the MP1 when first out did not. Now, it looks like with the rack units, you can choose. Geoff has said in the past that the output trannies did not impart any sonic signature. That may be different now. Didn’t Daking stop using Jensen transformers recently for the output, perhaps input as well, and go to cinemag? |
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Ox Han
Junior Member
Posts: 72
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RND 5211
Mar 6, 2023 9:50:37 GMT -6
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Post by Ox Han on Mar 6, 2023 9:50:37 GMT -6
I have 2 x 511 in my studio. I still cant believe how cheap they are and how good comparing to other pro level pres like API and BAE which cost literally twice as much per channel. I use them all the time on pretty much anything and if I was starting again or looking for a good set of pres in a 500 rack, 6 of these would be a killer deal. The only downside would be no DI input but if you have that covered elsewhere I see no reason not to kit youself out with a bunch of these pres. With the exception of kick drums, I think the 511 and API 3124v are nearly indistinguishable. At least on vocals and electric guitars and snares. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2023 11:26:14 GMT -6
Daking Pres have a Jensen Input Transformer and have gone back and forth with output transformers. The Pre/EQ had both but the 4 channel and the MP1 when first out did not. Now, it looks like with the rack units, you can choose. Geoff has said in the past that the output trannies did not impart any sonic signature. That may be different now. Didn’t Daking stop using Jensen transformers recently for the output, perhaps input as well, and go to cinemag? They switched to cinemag because Jensen got bought by Radial, Radial’s founder and owner retired and sold the company to Regimen Equity so the business would continue. Regimen restructure the business and jacked prices. Daking changed parts to continue building gear people can actually buy. That’s why the FET II and FET III disappeared. Switches and the VU meters used got too expensive. VCAs are thermally more reliable and consistent gain reduction elements than FETs. Unlike all the NOS part stuff and gimped clones  |
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