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Post by mdmitch2 on Jan 18, 2017 11:37:37 GMT -6
I guess I'm just more bothered than the average person about noise coming from my gear.... but even the noise on my Hairball Rev D is bothering me. I've also had a rev A, and of course that was much noisier... I've compared mine to other people's, and they're the same (mine was actually a little quieter), so it's not a build issue.
So I'm wondering if maybe the F or G revs would be quieter, or maybe there's some other clone out there that's comparable in it's tone and compression characteristics, but without the noise? CAPI 526 maybe? Purple MC77?
Or is there a mod I can do to completely eliminate the noise on a Rev D?
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Post by swurveman on Jan 18, 2017 11:54:53 GMT -6
My Universal Audio 1176 is quiet. On the other hand my LA2A is quite noisy. I haven't heard the other versions.
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Post by drbill on Jan 18, 2017 12:08:23 GMT -6
If noise is bothering you on an 1176, then you're probably using the wrong compressor. They are by default not the quietest out there. At least if you want them anywhere close to "original".
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Post by svart on Jan 18, 2017 12:31:16 GMT -6
Hmm. My rev A is noisy, but it's not noisy enough to bother me during a mix.
I guess I'd ask, how's your gain staging look?
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Post by jayfitz on Jan 18, 2017 13:03:07 GMT -6
I think the Purple Audio MC-77 would be a front runner in the Self Noise department. Really much an improved version of the "best" 1176 iteration, the "LN" [aka low noise]
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Post by mdmitch2 on Jan 18, 2017 13:19:15 GMT -6
Hmm. My rev A is noisy, but it's not noisy enough to bother me during a mix. I guess I'd ask, how's your gain staging look? I'm happy using the D or A on a rock mix, but for sparse acoustic music, especially when it's on the lead vocal, it's too noisy for me. It's the kind of thing where I don't really notice it until I take it out of the chain, and I notice the noise dropping a fair amount. And I'm feeding it a healthy signal... input is only about 1/4 of the way up. I'm probably just being anal, and I suspect most people wouldn't be bothered by it... but I prefer this type of music with a very low noise floor so the details really shine through. |
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Post by svart on Jan 18, 2017 13:24:07 GMT -6
Hmm. My rev A is noisy, but it's not noisy enough to bother me during a mix. I guess I'd ask, how's your gain staging look? I'm happy using the D or A on a rock mix, but for sparse acoustic music, especially when it's on the lead vocal, it's too noisy for me. It's the kind of thing where I don't really notice it until I take it out of the chain, and I notice the noise dropping a fair amount. And I'm feeding it a healthy signal... input is only about 1/4 of the way up. I'm probably just being anal, and I suspect most people wouldn't be bothered by it... but I prefer this type of music with a very low noise floor so the details really shine through. Ok, fair enough. I'd say the G (opamp) version is the most quiet, but only by a little over the D/F version, which is probably 10dB quieter than the A version. |
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Post by illacov on Jan 18, 2017 15:07:24 GMT -6
Hmm. My rev A is noisy, but it's not noisy enough to bother me during a mix. I guess I'd ask, how's your gain staging look? I'm happy using the D or A on a rock mix, but for sparse acoustic music, especially when it's on the lead vocal, it's too noisy for me. It's the kind of thing where I don't really notice it until I take it out of the chain, and I notice the noise dropping a fair amount. And I'm feeding it a healthy signal... input is only about 1/4 of the way up. I'm probably just being anal, and I suspect most people wouldn't be bothered by it... but I prefer this type of music with a very low noise floor so the details really shine through. For the quiet acoustic rock stuff are you using really quiet preamps? With an output control and feeding healthy gain into the 1176? If your 76 isn't being fed decent levels on the front end of the compressor, the noise level gets pretty rotten. Not a design flaw, just what happens with these crusty old designs if you don't make them happy. General starting point the 1176 is supposed to be Dr. Pepper. Otherwise known as 10 and 2. Input at 10 o'clock output at 2 o'clock. It should compress when set like this but you need to feed the beast for it to work appropriately. This will really help to illustrate how we should be trying to run the 76. For example with my 1073, if I try to run it too clean (like output at 100% open and input just tickling the transient levels, not really coming out that hot and I park the 76 next, its going to be potentially noisy. If you're trying to get that 1176 compression, but don't want the color from the mic preamp, I'd try a really clean mic preamp thats quiet and can give you the solid gain you need before hitting the 76. It may not sound all that sexy, but you can always use whatever combination of microphone, mic preamp etc and couple it with your 76 if that's how you like the vox to sound. I own a pair of Hairball RevF and they are sort of quiet but if you gain stage wrong at the input you'll hear noise. Thanks -L |
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Post by ragan on Jan 18, 2017 15:16:21 GMT -6
I'm happy using the D or A on a rock mix, but for sparse acoustic music, especially when it's on the lead vocal, it's too noisy for me. It's the kind of thing where I don't really notice it until I take it out of the chain, and I notice the noise dropping a fair amount. And I'm feeding it a healthy signal... input is only about 1/4 of the way up. I'm probably just being anal, and I suspect most people wouldn't be bothered by it... but I prefer this type of music with a very low noise floor so the details really shine through. For the quiet acoustic rock stuff are you using really quiet preamps? With an output control and feeding healthy gain into the 1176? If your 76 isn't being fed decent levels on the front end of the compressor, the noise level gets pretty rotten. Not a design flaw, just what happens with these crusty old designs if you don't make them happy. General starting point the 1176 is supposed to be Dr. Pepper. Otherwise known as 10 and 2. Input at 10 o'clock output at 2 o'clock. It should compress when set like this but you need to feed the beast for it to work appropriately. This will really help to illustrate how we should be trying to run the 76. For example with my 1073, if I try to run it too clean (like output at 100% open and input just tickling the transient levels, not really coming out that hot and I park the 76 next, its going to be potentially noisy. If you're trying to get that 1176 compression, but don't want the color from the mic preamp, I'd try a really clean mic preamp thats quiet and can give you the solid gain you need before hitting the 76. It may not sound all that sexy, but you can always use whatever combination of microphone, mic preamp etc and couple it with your 76 if that's how you like the vox to sound. I own a pair of Hairball RevF and they are sort of quiet but if you gain stage wrong at the input you'll hear noise. Thanks -L The "Dr Pepper" setting refers to the attack, release and ratio, not input and output, FYI. The input and output obviously being totally dependent on what's before and after... Attack at 10, release at 2 and ratio at 4. From the ad campaign recommending some Dr Pepper at 10, 2 and 4...you know, so you could stay awake enough to enjoy your diabetes. |
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Post by jcoutu1 on Jan 18, 2017 15:16:37 GMT -6
I'm happy using the D or A on a rock mix, but for sparse acoustic music, especially when it's on the lead vocal, it's too noisy for me. It's the kind of thing where I don't really notice it until I take it out of the chain, and I notice the noise dropping a fair amount. And I'm feeding it a healthy signal... input is only about 1/4 of the way up. I'm probably just being anal, and I suspect most people wouldn't be bothered by it... but I prefer this type of music with a very low noise floor so the details really shine through. For the quiet acoustic rock stuff are you using really quiet preamps? With an output control and feeding healthy gain into the 1176? If your 76 isn't being fed decent levels on the front end of the compressor, the noise level gets pretty rotten. Not a design flaw, just what happens with these crusty old designs if you don't make them happy. General starting point the 1176 is supposed to be Dr. Pepper. Otherwise known as 10 and 2. Input at 10 o'clock output at 2 o'clock. It should compress when set like this but you need to feed the beast for it to work appropriately. This will really help to illustrate how we should be trying to run the 76. For example with my 1073, if I try to run it too clean (like output at 100% open and input just tickling the transient levels, not really coming out that hot and I park the 76 next, its going to be potentially noisy. If you're trying to get that 1176 compression, but don't want the color from the mic preamp, I'd try a really clean mic preamp thats quiet and can give you the solid gain you need before hitting the 76. It may not sound all that sexy, but you can always use whatever combination of microphone, mic preamp etc and couple it with your 76 if that's how you like the vox to sound. I own a pair of Hairball RevF and they are sort of quiet but if you gain stage wrong at the input you'll hear noise. Thanks -L Dr. Pepper should be Attack at 10, Release at 2, and ratio 4. Unrelated to the input/output. That's my understanding at least. |
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Post by illacov on Jan 18, 2017 15:36:51 GMT -6
Ok, my misunderstanding of a setting, which now explains the years of strange looks (but not all of them!) has also revealed to me that the way I've used an 1176 for years deserves a name.
Set your 1176 to Langston. LOL
Try setting your input at 10 and your output at 2. Gain stage into that from the mic preamp to get a better SNR out of the 1176. It works for me, typically a colored preamp will offer more mojo like this but something cleaner won't, but it will be quieter for certain. I've always had my attack defaulting at 100% ccw and release at 100% cw. I usually will adjust the attack until I hear things get tickled. Most times I don't get past 1 oclock on certain vocals with the attack setting. The release normally stays at fastest unless I'm doing slower music or trying to get something interesting happening on a snare or a kick.
Thanks
-L.
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Post by ragan on Jan 18, 2017 15:39:28 GMT -6
Whatever gets the sonics you want!
I very often slow up the release to smooth out the sound. Vox, I often like attack around 10 and release around noon or 1. Unless it's parallel, in which case I usually go very slow (att) and very fast (rel) and smash it up good.
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Post by mdmitch2 on Jan 18, 2017 17:07:43 GMT -6
Ok, my misunderstanding of a setting, which now explains the years of strange looks (but not all of them!) has also revealed to me that the way I've used an 1176 for years deserves a name. Set your 1176 to Langston. LOL Try setting your input at 10 and your output at 2. Gain stage into that from the mic preamp to get a better SNR out of the 1176. It works for me, typically a colored preamp will offer more mojo like this but something cleaner won't, but it will be quieter for certain. I've always had my attack defaulting at 100% ccw and release at 100% cw. I usually will adjust the attack until I hear things get tickled. Most times I don't get past 1 oclock on certain vocals with the attack setting. The release normally stays at fastest unless I'm doing slower music or trying to get something interesting happening on a snare or a kick. Thanks -L. Interesting discussion here... looks like mine is already set to 'Langston' more or less. But the recording was done with neve pre's and a c12, so not exactly a recipe for silence. So I'm sure I need to distribute the blame to additional aspects of the signal chain, and also the noise floor in the room. Nevertheless, the 1176 is contributing a disproportionately large amount of noise relative to it's contribution to the song/mix. I do love the thing on rock mixes, and drums, so I'll probably keep it around.... but substitute something else on lead vocals for these sparse mixes. A couple local studios have the purple clone, so I'll compare it to that too at some point. |
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Post by rocinante on Jan 18, 2017 18:18:36 GMT -6
Yeah c12 into a neve then through an 1176 regardless of letter is gonna be a little noisy. With a rev A more so. Good recipe for rock though. I crank my 1176s. Its where the juice is. Throw in there a 73 or 84 eq and you got yourself some serious mojo, albeit a tad noisy.
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Post by Bender on Jan 18, 2017 23:56:11 GMT -6
I'm happy using the D or A on a rock mix, but for sparse acoustic music, especially when it's on the lead vocal, it's too noisy for me. It's the kind of thing where I don't really notice it until I take it out of the chain, and I notice the noise dropping a fair amount. And I'm feeding it a healthy signal... input is only about 1/4 of the way up. I'm probably just being anal, and I suspect most people wouldn't be bothered by it... but I prefer this type of music with a very low noise floor so the details really shine through. General starting point the 1176 is supposed to be Dr. Pepper. Otherwise known as 10 and 2. Input at 10 o'clock output at 2 o'clock. It should compress when set like this but you need to feed the beast for it to work appropriately. Just curious never head this Dr. P phrase before and I love the epistemology of phrases. Care to enlighten the story behind this, or is it just from the ol ad days.  |
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Post by levon on Jan 19, 2017 0:45:27 GMT -6
The answer is in the very ad you posted. 'Drink a bite to eat at 10, 2 & 4 o'clock'! Transferred to the 1176: attack at 10, release at 2 and ratio at 4. Enjoy.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2017 3:04:23 GMT -6
The answer is in the very ad you posted. 'Drink a bite to eat at 10, 2 & 4 o'clock'! Transferred to the 1176: attack at 10, release at 2 and ratio at 4. Enjoy. Or all buttons in - Red Bull |
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Post by wiz on Jan 19, 2017 3:23:43 GMT -6
The answer is in the very ad you posted. 'Drink a bite to eat at 10, 2 & 4 o'clock'! Transferred to the 1176: attack at 10, release at 2 and ratio at 4. Enjoy. Or all buttons in - Red Bull LOL cheers Wiz |
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Post by hasbeen on Jan 19, 2017 17:53:10 GMT -6
My Universal Audio 1176 is quiet. On the other hand my LA2A is quite noisy. I haven't heard the other versions. If your LA2A is noisy try swapping out the 12AX7. A noisy tube is quite noticeable on these things. |
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