|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 9:44:03 GMT -6
Hey,
If you were starting over with digital recording and or thinking about an apogee symphony mkii with some bells and whistles (8x8, plus pres) and had about 5 grand as a budget and typically recorded 1-2 tracks, wanted a controller, used Logic /pro tools as your daws, recorded 1-2 tracks, had outboard and missed the monitoring on your dox, why wouldn't you buy the nucleus ?
|
|
|
Post by swurveman on Dec 11, 2016 9:52:18 GMT -6
IMO, anybody who typically records 1-2 tracks would be better spending $3,400.00 on the source- an acoustic or electric guitar or microphone(s)- than the Nucleus.
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 10:07:38 GMT -6
fair enough and if you already have those, very good OB pres and mikes, then what ?
|
|
|
Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 11, 2016 10:14:26 GMT -6
I kinda dig this thing. Two SSL mic pres, goes a long way. No other pre's really needed. I'll look into this. Down the road, it seems like a cool thing to get away from 100% mouse activities, and get some SSL vibe and tone. I've used every major board at one time or another, and honestly never failed to be impressed by the sound an SSL had. I was at a mixing session for James Blunt and for Neo, and the SSL blew my frickin' mind when it was used by a great engineer.
|
|
|
Post by swurveman on Dec 11, 2016 11:36:11 GMT -6
fair enough and if you already have those, very good OB pres and mikes, then what ? Personally, I'd buy a hardware LA2A next. I'd recommend anybody to use a "source first" approach when spending money on making music. Room->player->instrument->microphone->preamp->hardware comp/eq->converter->DAW I wish I'd have done this, but instead went willy nilly on too many shiny objects that-though important- weren't what I needed at the time.
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Dec 11, 2016 11:58:06 GMT -6
This is probably sacrilege, but for me there's something about using a mouse on a graphic EQ. Left/Right/Up/Down all in one hand. I have the Behringer X-Touch and it pretty much does everything the Nucleus does on the Controller side of things. I love the transport section, soft keys, and a number of ways that it interacts with Logic, but I have to admit there are a lot of features I just don't find myself using. I don't use the pots to go through menus. Maybe part of that is that I just don't use it enough, but the truth is, I don't really use the pots at all. They're detented and plastic-y and I just find that I can get to where I want to go with a mouse quicker than I can with my hands on the controller. I was watching the demo where the demostrator was selecting a plug on the device. It took him 20 seconds to do what I can do with a mouse in 5 sec. I mean, between the plugs in the DAW and the 20 or so after-market plugs, when you've got literally hundred's of plugs to choose from, scrolling through with a pot just makes no sense to me. Also, I honestly prefer to draw my automation, even if I didn't, I'd be going in and editing my poor fader technique - not to mention right on top of the wave-form zoomed in as far as I need.
I'm not intending to slam the Nucleus. I'm just talking about how I use the X-touch and making the assumption that the experience might not be that dissimilar on the Nucleus. Certainly the Nucleus is an impressive all in one device. The value of those mic-pres channel strips alone has got to be a chunk of change right there. The convenience of the inserts makes me swoon a bit. It is certainly something worthy of consideration if you were re-building from scratch and had all the criteria katthedog mentioned. But then it's one of those things where it better fit - because if one or two of its major features end up not meeting your work-flow preferences, you're kind of screwed.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Dec 11, 2016 12:28:33 GMT -6
I'm not sure why people list after physical faders so much. Now, chasing the transformers that a console has, that's what I want.
|
|
|
Post by popmann on Dec 11, 2016 12:43:29 GMT -6
It has the appeal AND the downside of integrated approaches....it's a one purchase, one driver....analog cue, high voltage preamps with analog inserts if you want to buy the aforementioned LA2a--use before conversion or after. It's a great home/project studio unit. But, I mean they had trouble with OSX what 10.10....I hadn't heard they even fixed it.... Actually....I went and looked--the v1 doesn't work after 10.9....as an audio interface. They have a v2 that works with current OSX. F'n Apple. But, it makes me feel better about deciding against it when I was shopping. That IS the worst case scenario....without the audio interface working, it's a big EVEN more expensive MCU. How do you use the preamps? Well, you CAN--by outputting them to another audio interface, and returning the DAW from another interface....anyway....no longer nearly as slick a solution. vintageking.com/solid-state-logic-ssl-nucleus-2THAT is the problem with integrated solutions. But, while they work, there's nothing more slick. Even if you look at the cheap end--there have been companies Maudio and Avid (when they were different companies) both did 8 fader controllers with preamps and interface....right? Everyone I know with either can no longer use some portion, thus they've moved on all together.
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 12:44:33 GMT -6
fair enough and if you already have those, very good OB pres and mikes, then what ? Personally, I'd buy a hardware LA2A next. I'd recommend anybody to use a "source first" approach when spending money on making music. Room->player->instrument->microphone->preamp->hardware comp/eq->converter->DAW I wish I'd have done this, but instead went willy nilly on too many shiny objects that-though important- weren't what I needed at the time. ah I have a wa2a, 2 wa76, a stam 4k, 2 diz D4's and am selling my apollo in order to sell a whole bunch of ua plugs to free up so dough, hence the point/question of the thread looking at options for stepping up the interface/ controllers, not instruments and not more OB, nice as they might be
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 13:20:14 GMT -6
all good input: thx guys !
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 14:05:37 GMT -6
We might as well critique the demo vid for N2?
|
|
|
Post by swurveman on Dec 11, 2016 15:04:51 GMT -6
Personally, I'd buy a hardware LA2A next. I'd recommend anybody to use a "source first" approach when spending money on making music. Room->player->instrument->microphone->preamp->hardware comp/eq->converter->DAW I wish I'd have done this, but instead went willy nilly on too many shiny objects that-though important- weren't what I needed at the time. ah I have a wa2a, 2 wa76, a stam 4k, 2 diz D4's and am selling my apollo in order to sell a whole bunch of ua plugs to free up so dough, hence the point/question of the thread looking at options for stepping up the interface/ controllers, not instruments and not more OB, nice as they might be Totally understand. Wish I had everything I need and could afford the Nucleus. I'm sure it's an awesome experience to be able to own one, assuming the software/IPMIDI handshake works as planned.
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 15:54:10 GMT -6
Talking stuff over before hand with you guys is always great , cus I learn stuff each time that I wouldn't think about or would miss
|
|
|
Post by mrholmes on Dec 11, 2016 16:38:54 GMT -6
I cant remember when the N. hit the road but I remember that my retailer gave me a short demonstration of it. I was not much impressed... the retailer used to use a lot SSL consoles back in the 80s. His attitude told me that he wasn't much impressed too.
I think my I pad an my magic track pad is enough to control Logic very fast.
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 16:47:42 GMT -6
It was launched 5 years ago: no disrespect but its a little more than an ipad This is or someone who wants real motorized faders etc, not a touch screen. Given that it can control 3 daws at the same time, has two ssl pres , 2 channel AD/DA , a 2 channel interface and dual monitor controller, talk back and real inserts for tracking and for your print track and zero latency for tracking and two duende ssl plug ins, one could say all its other features are about the price of an ipad pro but built to ssl standards. If may not be for everyone, but I think a lot of thought went into it and it is actually well priced for its features.
|
|
|
Post by wiz on Dec 11, 2016 17:24:53 GMT -6
I must be missing your point Kcat...
why if you are going to have only two tracks in a song... would you need it....?
I assume, acoustic guitar and vocal.... ?
cheers
Wiz
|
|
|
Post by mrholmes on Dec 11, 2016 17:56:38 GMT -6
It was launched 5 years ago: no disrespect but its a little more than an ipad This is or someone who wants real motorized faders etc, not a touch screen. Given that it can control 3 daws at the same time, has two ssl pres , 2 channel AD/DA , a 2 channel interface and dual monitor controller, talk back and real inserts for tracking and for your print track and zero latency for tracking and two duende ssl plug ins, one could say all its other features are about the price of an ipad pro but built to ssl standards. If may not be for everyone, but I think a lot of thought went into it and it is actually well priced for its features. At least I have seen it in action and in my opinion its a tool no one ever asked for. The controll I have on the I pad is very flexible because I can programm it to my exact needs, combine that with the apple magic trackpad and you will have good chances to be faster as with the overpriced - two mic preamp and converter included- SSL controler.... But who cares, because its just my fucking opinion you dont have to follow my thoughts. love and peace holmes
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 18:32:08 GMT -6
Meow !! Mein schlechtes, es tut mir leid! I wasn't putting you down. I hold you and your opinions in high regard, but I thought I made it clear, I am thinking about replacing my interface. What good is an ipad, no pres ,no converters, the controller functionality is secondary to wanting to up grade my interface. lovier and peacier kcat !
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 18:37:13 GMT -6
I must be missing your point Kcat... why if you are going to have only two tracks in a song... would you need it....? I assume, acoustic guitar and vocal.... ? cheers Wiz That is just 1-2 track recording at a time. When I am recording myself, which is mostly what I do, I only need 1-2 channels, but drums would be a problem as I think the nucleus only has sdpif in , so 4 channels ? So far, I am more thinking the symphony mkii ( 8x8) and maybe with the on board pres: this would be most like my current apollo, for recording purposes.
|
|
|
Post by wiz on Dec 11, 2016 18:44:09 GMT -6
I must be missing your point Kcat... why if you are going to have only two tracks in a song... would you need it....? I assume, acoustic guitar and vocal.... ? cheers Wiz That is just 1-2 track recording at a time. When I am recording myself, which is mostly what I do, I only need 1-2 channels, but drums would be a problem as I think the nucleus only has sdpif in , so 4 channels ? So far, I am more thinking the symphony mkii ( 8x8) and maybe with the on board pres: this would be most like my current apollo, for recording purposes. Oh I see.... 8) I thought 1 or 2 tracks TOTAL... 8) MOTU? They have a new thingy out... might work.. MOTU 624
cheers Wiz
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 18:50:59 GMT -6
Yes was wondering aboutt it as well given your very positive experience, actually a guy in nyc was selling a complete 16 channel delta last week for a grand : I wondered what it would cost to send to Jim to make right
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Dec 11, 2016 18:57:45 GMT -6
It does seem strange that there are only 2 inputs on the Nucleus 2. Just about everyone who's willing to drop close to 6K for this is going to want to be able to track more than instrument at a time on occasion. Clearly, it's designed to be used in conjunction with additional hardware, which begs the question - why even bother to have the channel strips? You would think at this level, guys are going to be a bit more persnickety when it comes to pairing mics and pre-amps.
..not to mention, what happens when the controller becomes obsolete? - You're stuck with two worthless channel strips.
|
|
|
Post by kcatthedog on Dec 11, 2016 19:04:39 GMT -6
Just to be clearer about my recording and mixing needs , here is where my 1-2 tracks at a time end up, this is the working mix of my current song "amber": soundcloud.com/kcatthedog/amber-23-b
|
|
|
Post by popmann on Dec 11, 2016 19:32:44 GMT -6
It does seem strange that there are only 2 inputs on the Nucleus 2. Just about everyone who's willing to drop close to 6K for this is going to want to be able to track more than instrument at a time on occasion. Clearly, it's designed to be used in conjunction with additional hardware, which begs the question - why even bother to have the channel strips? You would think at this level, guys are going to be a bit more persnickety when it comes to pairing mics and pre-amps. The price was $4500 last I looked....if it's gone up with v2, forgive that, but.... I can explain as someone who chose differently but considered it. MCU+ext was $2500 new. A good analog monitor controller was $1k+. A solid pair of preamps will be $1500+. A good quality 6x6 interface will run $400-1k (and many you have to buy larger to get enough LINE LEVEL inputs) So, the actual point of the unit IS if you own nothing of that caliber. You buy that--and the whole thing is a unit that sits on your desk with you monitor above it. I mean how much more slicker can you GET than a 27" 4x4ghz iMac and a Nucleus? One cable between the two. Now, of course long term, component based systems will ALWAYS....ALWAYS cost less down the road. And if you already had a nice DAC/Monitor analog control and two channels of nice clean preamps....it makes less sense. I chose to add an MCU+Ext....and punt the ADC until later, which I now own....and ironically, the MCU has been in and out of service. Good god--if that had been a Nucleus, one would HOPE the built quality was better, but assume for a moment it's not--they're taking my WHOLE studio into the shop for a month? THAT is the downside of consolidated slick stuff like this. Actually, the main MCU got repaired and 6 months later, the extender did the same thing...I just put it into a box. I really need to either sell the main unit or get the Extender fixed....8 faders isn't better than 1....16 IS better than 1....IMO/E.
|
|
|
Post by M57 on Dec 11, 2016 19:59:16 GMT -6
www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/NucleusAssuming this is what we're talking about - pushing 6k with tax at Sweetwater. Yeah, putting your eggs in one basket is neat and pretty, but drop the basket and..
|
|