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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 2, 2016 10:51:41 GMT -6
Really? I thought they modeled the whole path. Have to check that out.
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Post by mrholmes on Jul 2, 2016 11:14:37 GMT -6
What I'm really hoping for is the phase interaction between all the channels - since the modeled 72 channels. Hoping it adds width and punch. I'm gonna see if my workflow changes a little. I might start the mix with them on every channel, then make rudimentary decisions on EQ and compression... then start using more detailed EQ's and comps. They just modeled a range of tolerances on EQs and comps I think. No phase/crosstalk/nonlinear stuff. Just that the attack or the filter cutoff or whatever vary a tiny bit from channel to channel. I think it is still a good take on the topic. Switiching back to the real mixing desk makes the biggest diffrence. And thats not a NEVE.... I like the idea but I would not spend 170 $ for it. Last time I did this I had to pay more an d more to make that dam thing work again. I prefer mixing in the desk thats the way I lke to work.
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Post by ragan on Jul 2, 2016 11:51:18 GMT -6
Really? I thought they modeled the whole path. Have to check that out. No. There was (as you can imagine) a stupid, tedious dust up over it on GS when it came out. No nonlinear stuff. Dirk from BX said that desk is super clean and there wasn't really anything to model. But yeah that (I forget the acronym) "technology" they came out with on BX Console just means the parameters vary a little bit from channel to channel.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 2, 2016 12:04:54 GMT -6
Not so much worried about distortion as phase interaction between channels...I have zero idea how you would model that though. So basically, it's just "channel one has a little less top end in the eq and a toothpick in the shelf button?" That's kind of a bummer. I guess the proof will be in the pudding. I'm gonna try this mix with bx and VCC and see which one I like.
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Post by ragan on Jul 2, 2016 12:34:43 GMT -6
Not so much worried about distortion as phase interaction between channels...I have zero idea how you would model that though. So basically, it's just "channel one has a little less top end in the eq and a toothpick in the shelf button?" That's kind of a bummer. I guess the proof will be in the pudding. I'm gonna try this mix with bx and VCC and see which one I like. Yeah even VCC doesn't actually have interaction between the channels, other than stereo buss instances (modeling crosstalk, phase stuff). The BX Console doesn't so much have "less top end" on a channel or anything like that. Wth the controls flat, they're all identical. But as you adjust the EQ and compression, the parameters will be very slightly different from one another (modeling the "component tolerance"). I still thought it was a pretty nice plugin. Not one I remotely want to purchase though.
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Post by mrholmes on Jul 2, 2016 13:57:25 GMT -6
Not so much worried about distortion as phase interaction between channels...I have zero idea how you would model that though. So basically, it's just "channel one has a little less top end in the eq and a toothpick in the shelf button?" That's kind of a bummer. I guess the proof will be in the pudding. I'm gonna try this mix with bx and VCC and see which one I like. Yeah even VCC doesn't actually have interaction between the channels, other than stereo buss instances (modeling crosstalk, phase stuff). The BX Console doesn't so much have "less top end" on a channel or anything like that. Wth the controls flat, they're all identical. But as you adjust the EQ and compression, the parameters will be very slightly different from one another (modeling the "component tolerance"). I still thought it was a pretty nice plugin. Not one I remotely want to purchase though. I see a big + for the EQ it sounds very smooth in the highs compared to SSL simulations, I like it. I would like to buy it, but not for the price they call.
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Post by ragan on Jul 2, 2016 14:00:40 GMT -6
Yeah even VCC doesn't actually have interaction between the channels, other than stereo buss instances (modeling crosstalk, phase stuff). The BX Console doesn't so much have "less top end" on a channel or anything like that. Wth the controls flat, they're all identical. But as you adjust the EQ and compression, the parameters will be very slightly different from one another (modeling the "component tolerance"). I still thought it was a pretty nice plugin. Not one I remotely want to purchase though. I see a big + for the EQ it sounds very smooth in the highs compared to SSL simulations, I like it. I would like to buy it, but not for the price they call. Yeah I liked the EQ too.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 2, 2016 17:29:05 GMT -6
So let me get this skrate...
If I add this to my channels with the EQ, Comp and Gate disengaged, I'm not hearing the effect of the console? I thought that was the whole point...
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 2, 2016 17:30:33 GMT -6
So it's not a "console plug" but a EQ, Gate and Comp plug...
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 2, 2016 17:31:33 GMT -6
I do like the comp and the EQ...but kinda disappointed...
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Post by kcatthedog on Jul 2, 2016 17:48:39 GMT -6
have you tried the ua 88rs update ?
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Jul 2, 2016 17:58:43 GMT -6
The analog switch in BX gives you noise and the channel variations. They modeled what the variations in different components in each channel would sound like. It is a model of an Neve film mixing console that has no preamps and is exceptionally clean and undistorted. Waves actually modeled 32 separate channels for each console in their NLS plug-in without eq and compression.
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Post by mrholmes on Jul 2, 2016 19:23:10 GMT -6
I do like the comp and the EQ...but kinda disappointed... I like it... but to clear the technical questions I have found this on the other page... " Soooo. This plugin does not 'model' non-linearities or add harmonics etc. YET.... On the website Total Marketing Toss (TMT) (TM) say's... "Nowhere is this unit-to-unit variation in an analog audio system more critical than in a large format mixing console. Any seasoned engineer or producer will tell you that there are audible differences between discrete channels of a high-end mixing console, and yet ALL emulated channel strips currently on the market are based on the exact same channel. The specific nonlinearities and distortions of that particular channel are what create its unique character. However, when you multiply that exact character from one to several dozen channels, what used to sound a lot like the original now starts to diverge, sometimes dramatically." So... Yeh. "The specific nonlinearities and distortions of that particular channel are what create its unique character" Which your plugin DOES NOT in fact create. TOOT TOOT all aboard the Hype Train next stop Snake Oil Town."
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Jul 2, 2016 20:43:06 GMT -6
Phase interaction is unintentional eq.
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Post by jdc on Jul 3, 2016 5:32:33 GMT -6
but Mr Holmes, if you like the plug in very much then does it matter if there's a hype train or not? every company relies on some sort of marketing to build excitement around a product, that doesn't mean a product itself is inherently bad. if this sounds good and gets you better results then what else matters? (I'm forever playing the devil' s advocate haha)
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 3, 2016 6:57:01 GMT -6
I put a blank instance on every channel and didn't really hear a difference. Did the same with VCC and that's kinda what I was looking for. I did like what the comp and eq can do and the gate is great. But somewhat redundant for what I have.
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Post by ragan on Jul 3, 2016 10:37:15 GMT -6
I put a blank instance on every channel and didn't really hear a difference. Did the same with VCC and that's kinda what I was looking for. I did like what the comp and eq can do and the gate is great. But somewhat redundant for what I have. Again, if I'm not mistaken, the BX Console doesn't do anything at default settings. Like, it should null with a version with no plugins on the tracks. It doesn't impart a 'sound' without adding EQ and compression.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 3, 2016 13:20:52 GMT -6
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Post by mrholmes on Jul 3, 2016 13:21:46 GMT -6
but Mr Holmes, if you like the plug in very much then does it matter if there's a hype train or not? every company relies on some sort of marketing to build excitement around a product, that doesn't mean a product itself is inherently bad. if this sounds good and gets you better results then what else matters? (I'm forever playing the devil' s advocate haha) I am just saying I like the EQ and some other stuff it does - shaving transients etc. But my real console is still sounding verry diffrent from a simulation. I have no need to buy a plug in. I was just interested in how far they get it. They are getting better and better but we are far away from simulating a console feel / sound. If I switch on the console I get a way more coherent picture. Is not half the way good enough? I think it is not good enough!!
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Post by viciousbliss on Nov 18, 2016 3:40:21 GMT -6
Just demoed this the other day since November is plug-in month with all the sales. It makes my tracks sound better even on default. Wider, smoother, and with more of a presence. Sample rate was 88.2. Not sure if the result has anything to with me already running NLS Nevo at the top(drive between 0-8 depending on the track), Strip V3 at the bottom and HEAT set to default with the eq off and the top dial turned left once. It helped some vocals I recorded that were a little sibilant and too dynamic to sound smoother and more controlled without me tweaking anything when I added it to the vocal buss. Don't think I had added it to anything else but the main stereo instrumental track at that point. Kept bypassing it to make sure I wasn't hearing things. The eq is quite good, definitely. I'm still reading the manual and figuring it all out, but I was able to tweak a few things without the manual on a different mix and get some nice results quickly. Dirk I thought explained that there were some nonlinearities with this, that it wasn't just a channel strip. There's also some good talk around page 88 of the ultimatepluginanalysis thread. bx_console seems worthwhile to me. I'm not sure what else could pull all this off, especially without a much bigger cpu hit.
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