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Post by indiehouse on Dec 12, 2015 17:26:07 GMT -6
My 251 clone is getting the final capsule and body work touches from @shannon at the moment, so I was in need of a vocal mic for a big session this weekend. I ended up getting a Flea 74 Next in to demo. Should be a cool session. Location recording, so packing up the studio is a pain. But we're setting up in an old opera house stage. Tracking everyone live.
I'll report back about my experience with this mic.
On a similar note, any advice for dual mic'ing an acoustic and vocal? Planning on the Flea and a KM84, both are cardioid only.
EDIT: It's a Flea 74 Next
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Post by odyssey76 on Dec 12, 2015 18:48:46 GMT -6
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 13, 2015 6:10:13 GMT -6
Yeah, I remember reading the fig 8 trick, but neither of these mics have that option. Just gonna play around with the nulls of each a bit.
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 14, 2015 10:47:58 GMT -6
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Post by rowmat on Dec 14, 2015 10:58:30 GMT -6
My 251 clone is getting the final capsule and body work touches from @shannon at the moment, so I was in need of a vocal mic for a big session this weekend. I ended up getting a Flea 74 Next in to demo. Should be a cool session. Location recording, so packing up the studio is a pain. But we're setting up in an old opera house stage. Tracking everyone live. I'll report back about my experience with this mic. On a similar note, any advice for dual mic'ing an acoustic and vocal? Planning on the Flea and a KM84, both are cardioid only. EDIT: It's a Flea 74 Next I think what you keep trying to write is "Flea 47" Next.  |
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Post by rowmat on Dec 14, 2015 11:17:14 GMT -6
We have the Flea 47 Vintage version. A while back we tracked a client singing and playing acoustic guitar live with just our Flea 47. It worked out pretty well with just the single mic because I moved it back about 18", cranked up the preamp, and captured both guitar and vocal together. It wasn't a planned take as he had actually finished the songs he intended to record and just threw this in at the end as we were packing up so I stuck the 47 out front and hit record. Fortunately the performer 'mixed' himself as in balanced the level of his voice and guitar. I normally tend to use figure 8 mics when tracking vocal and acoustic instruments together as the out of phase nulls come in handy for isolating the vocal from the instrument and vice versa. Obviously when using a second cardioid only mic you'll need to watch out for phasing and spill problems. I kind of did like the one mic approach but it depends on the artist being able to balance their singing and playing. Also as the mic is further back and the preamp gain is pretty high any other ambient noise will definitely intrude so that may, or may not, be a problem especially if you have other musicians nearby. However if you do go down the figure 8 path in the future here's my 'Frankenstand', 3 ribbon mic, mid/side setup... Attachment DeletedVocal mic is an AEA R84, guitar mics are AEA N22's. Isolation between guitar mics and vocal mic is excellent. N22's are set as a Mid/Side pair which allows me to widen the stereo image of the guitar in post. |
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 14, 2015 11:40:59 GMT -6
My 251 clone is getting the final capsule and body work touches from @shannon at the moment, so I was in need of a vocal mic for a big session this weekend. I ended up getting a Flea 74 Next in to demo. Should be a cool session. Location recording, so packing up the studio is a pain. But we're setting up in an old opera house stage. Tracking everyone live. I'll report back about my experience with this mic. On a similar note, any advice for dual mic'ing an acoustic and vocal? Planning on the Flea and a KM84, both are cardioid only. EDIT: It's a Flea 74 Next I think what you keep trying to write is "Flea 47" Next. No, it's definitely a 74. Cardiod only. |
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Post by jcoutu1 on Dec 14, 2015 11:45:55 GMT -6
I think what you keep trying to write is "Flea 47" Next. No, it's definitely a 74. Cardiod only. According to the Flea site, the 47 Next is Card only and the 74 Next is Card / Omni / 8. |
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Post by rowmat on Dec 14, 2015 11:46:48 GMT -6
I think what you keep trying to write is "Flea 47" Next. No, it's definitely a 74. Cardiod only. The cardioid only version of the Flea 47 is called the Flea 47 'Next' as compared to the switchable cardioid/omni version which is called the Flea 47 'Vintage'. www.flea-microphones.com/mics_next.html#tab1NOTE: Okay I stand corrected. I just noticed Flea does now also make a '74' Next. It must have just recently been released? |
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 14, 2015 11:54:15 GMT -6
We have the Flea 47 Vintage version. A while back we tracked a client singing and playing acoustic guitar live with just our Flea 47. It worked out pretty well with just the single mic because I moved it back about 18", cranked up the preamp, and captured both guitar and vocal together. It wasn't a planned take as he had actually finished the songs he intended to record and just threw this in at the end as we were packing up so I stuck the 47 out front and hit record. Fortunately the performer 'mixed' himself as in balanced the level of his voice and guitar. I normally tend to use figure 8 mics when tracking vocal and acoustic instruments together as the out of phase nulls come in handy for isolating the vocal from the instrument and vice versa. Obviously when using a second cardioid only mic you'll need to watch out for phasing an spill problems. I kind of did like the one mic approach but it depends on the artist being able to balance their singing and playing. Also as the mic is further back and the preamp gain is pretty high any other ambient noise will definitely intrude so that may, or may not, be a problem especially if you have other musicians nearby. However if you do go down the figure 8 path in the future here's my 'Frankenstand', 3 ribbon mic, mid/side setup... Vocal mic is an AEA R84, guitar mics are AEA N22's. Isolation between guitar mics and vocal mic is excellent. N22's are set as a Mid/Side pair which allows me to widen the stereo image of the guitar in post. Yeah, I think the fig 8 would've been the way to go. This session turned out a bit weird. The band insisted on tracking everything live, including acoustic and vocals. And they insisted on cranking their guitar and bass amps, because they wanted bleed to get "that live feel". Well, ok. The venue was live, alright. I mean, they booked out this place for the whole day, which was cool, but there wasn't any reason not to come back to do a vocal or acoustic overdub. The drums bleed into the acoustic and vocal mics really bad, not to mention the phasing issues of the two cardioid only mics. Thinking back on it, I think it would have been better to get the curtain dropped in behind them to kill the backstage reflections. That place was super live. The backstage ceiling went up 2 or 3 stories. They pretty much tracked in a giant reverb chamber. I ended up not being able to use the Flea 74 due to their insistence on not doing any vocal overdubs in order to "capture that energy." I ended up with a SM7B on the vocal and line in on the acoustic. I tracked a MC930, but I doubt I'll be able to use it. Not with the phasing issues and drum bleed. We even cornered with a couple of gobo's, but the sound was bouncing off everywhere. Took 6 hours to set up and dial in everyone's mics before we hit record. It was a long day. Kinda frustrating to have a nice mic like that and not being able to use it. Wish they would've been more open to my suggestions. Instead, we got an SM7B with loads of drum reflections and a line in acoustic. Meh. |
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 14, 2015 11:58:07 GMT -6
No, it's definitely a 74. Cardiod only. According to the Flea site, the 47 Next is Card only and the 74 Next is Card / Omni / 8. Yep, looks like it's more than just cardioid only. Sales rep told me cardioid only, so I had that in my head without actually checking for myself. Doesn't matter, though. Wouldn't have changed anything. |
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Post by rowmat on Dec 14, 2015 12:04:30 GMT -6
We have the Flea 47 Vintage version. A while back we tracked a client singing and playing acoustic guitar live with just our Flea 47. It worked out pretty well with just the single mic because I moved it back about 18", cranked up the preamp, and captured both guitar and vocal together. It wasn't a planned take as he had actually finished the songs he intended to record and just threw this in at the end as we were packing up so I stuck the 47 out front and hit record. Fortunately the performer 'mixed' himself as in balanced the level of his voice and guitar. I normally tend to use figure 8 mics when tracking vocal and acoustic instruments together as the out of phase nulls come in handy for isolating the vocal from the instrument and vice versa. Obviously when using a second cardioid only mic you'll need to watch out for phasing an spill problems. I kind of did like the one mic approach but it depends on the artist being able to balance their singing and playing. Also as the mic is further back and the preamp gain is pretty high any other ambient noise will definitely intrude so that may, or may not, be a problem especially if you have other musicians nearby. However if you do go down the figure 8 path in the future here's my 'Frankenstand', 3 ribbon mic, mid/side setup... Vocal mic is an AEA R84, guitar mics are AEA N22's. Isolation between guitar mics and vocal mic is excellent. N22's are set as a Mid/Side pair which allows me to widen the stereo image of the guitar in post. Yeah, I think the fig 8 would've been the way to go. This session turned out a bit weird. The band insisted on tracking everything live, including acoustic and vocals. And they insisted on cranking their guitar and bass amps, because they wanted bleed to get "that live feel". Well, ok. The venue was live, alright. I mean, they booked out this place for the whole day, which was cool, but there wasn't any reason not to come back to do a vocal or acoustic overdub. The drums bleed into the acoustic and vocal mics really bad, not to mention the phasing issues of the two cardioid only mics. Thinking back on it, I think it would have been better to get the curtain dropped in behind them to kill the backstage reflections. That place was super live. The backstage ceiling went up 2 or 3 stories. They pretty much tracked in a giant reverb chamber. I ended up not being able to use the Flea 74 due to their insistence on not doing any vocal overdubs in order to "capture that energy." I ended up with a SM7B on the vocal and line in on the acoustic. I tracked a MC930, but I doubt I'll be able to use it. Not with the phasing issues and drum bleed. We even cornered with a couple of gobo's, but the sound was bouncing off everywhere. Took 6 hours to set up and dial in everyone's mics before we hit record. It was a long day. Kinda frustrating to have a nice mic like that and not being able to use it. Wish they would've been more open to my suggestions. Instead, we got an SM7B with loads of drum reflections and a line in acoustic. Meh. I can sympathise with you. We've all had those gigs. |
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Post by Guitar on Dec 14, 2015 19:13:42 GMT -6
Me too, sounds like fun though. That's the worst when someone 'insists' against your technical knowledge, the hands are tied at that point. Sounds like a cool mic hope you get to use it soon. I think the SM7 and direct guitar was a good compromise, I've had similar setups work well for me.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,951 
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Post by ericn on Dec 14, 2015 21:16:24 GMT -6
It sucks but these are the gigs where you really learn the craft!
But yeah it sucks!
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