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Post by tonycamphd on Dec 9, 2014 8:59:50 GMT -6
There are so many ways I'm sure! So how do u guys set up mics for a singer/songwriter AC performance to get the most control over the tracks? Any cool, uncommon tricks out there?
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Post by drbill on Dec 9, 2014 11:48:55 GMT -6
Two fig 8 mics with the nulls facing the "other" sound source. Pretty dependent on singer/guitarist staying PUT without shifting around. Not doable for many cause they gots ta MOVE.
My preference? Learn the song without singing, and record the gtr and vox separate.
Or embrace the bleed and make it work for you instead of against you.
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Post by dandeurloo on Dec 9, 2014 12:38:08 GMT -6
Yeah, like the good Dr said. I have also had luck with one figure 8 and one cardo dynamic. Just depends on the sound sources and the singer voice and singing/playing volumes. When I do this technique you have to embrace the bleed. It will actually sound really natural. Just pray the singer can sing in tune. Haha
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Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 9, 2014 13:10:49 GMT -6
The best acoustic guitar and vocal sound I've ever heard is on Lyle Lovette's "Road to Ensenada". That was a C24, (stereo C12) on the guitar and a U67 on vocal, with bleed into each other. I tried youtube, but couldn't find the album track to post for you, but try to check it out.
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Post by wiz on Dec 10, 2014 16:34:53 GMT -6
I have also used a cardoid mic... on its side, horizontal to the floor with the pattern facing the roof.
You put it under the singers mouth and they sing across the mic.. the rear of the mic is pointing at the acoustic guitar....
and the acoustic mic'd with a SDC.
I always struggle even with fig 8 mics with phase issues... it just never sounds GREAT! The performance might be better than individually tracking separately, and of course that wins.
But I have never managed to equal it sonically ....
cheers
Wiz
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Post by watchtower on Dec 10, 2014 19:41:25 GMT -6
The best is definitely to record them separately. I've experimented with placement a good bit, and I can't stand the bleed when using two mics. If I absolutely have to, though, I'll just use two cardioids and get the nulls as "deep" as I can in regards to bleed with the angling/position. I'll have to try figure-8 some time.
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Post by Ward on Dec 10, 2014 20:12:20 GMT -6
It can be an even greater challenge if you are dealing with a singer/guitarist who has to look at the fretboard whilst playing.
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Post by lpedrum on Dec 12, 2014 14:42:16 GMT -6
I've found that figure 8 on the vocal mic is pretty impressive in the way it keeps the acoustic diminished in the vocal track. The bigger problem for me is vocal bleed into the guitar mic. With a decent singer that maybe needs a few tuning tweaks here and there I've often, in addition to a mic, gone direct with the acoustic, using a good inside mic/pickup. On the offending vocal notes I'll replace the miked guitar with the DI guitar so that I can tune the vocal without it fighting the bleed in the guitar mic. I know this is not a "pure" way to do it, but if the DI sound is good and it's in and out quickly it doesn't draw attention to itself like you think it might.
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Post by tonycamphd on Dec 12, 2014 16:52:48 GMT -6
The hell of dealing with bleed aside, the thing that really stinks about doing it separate.. is if the guy/gal is really good, they will push/pull the time around, creating weight by kicking vocal phrases with their guitar, it's purely emotional, and as tight as it can ever get, and in no way will anyone be able to overdub later at that level of tightness(unless theyre not very good, in which case it will be tighter by overdubbing i guess..) I know a dude who takes this to another level, he plays drums with his feet while he sings and plays the AC, it's a seriously tight 3 piece, and i mean he plays nuanced swinging ass drums with his feet, it's cool as shit, i cant wait to get this slog done so i can get him in here.
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Post by Guitar on Dec 13, 2014 16:26:52 GMT -6
I've used fig-8 pairs for this, works pretty well.
Also a dynamic mic on vocals picks up less bleed than a condenser.
Cardioid condensers have been sort of a nightmare for me.
Sometimes a single mic picking up both can sound fine, but you've no control over balance after the take and your mixing has less options, so you have to get it right.
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