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Post by russellcreekps on Oct 26, 2024 7:26:43 GMT -6
Hey Y’all,
Been super busy as of late (new job) so haven’t had a lot of time to be here. Finally have some time in the studio today and wondering if this is a viable option or will it cause phase issues? Recently got an R84 and love it through my API pre as the main mic on my J45. Thinking of trying it in a mid configuration with my B67/269 in figure 8 pattern as the side mic. Could this work or does it have to be a cardioid pattern in mid mode? Wanting a really wide sound for acoustic/vocal only track.
Thanks,
Russell
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Post by EmRR on Oct 26, 2024 8:32:22 GMT -6
Mid can be any pattern. You can only go so wide, if it’s phasey you’re too wide.
Quote from Rolo 46:
M carries the weight of the music
S provides space and the stereo field info
As long as M is within its critical distance you will render an effective stereo image
Omni M is wide angle, little proximity, close critical distance
Card M is portrait, medium proximity, medium critical distance
Fig 8 M is telephoto, hi proximity, long critical distance.
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Post by drumsound on Oct 26, 2024 9:34:13 GMT -6
Mid can be any pattern. You can only go so wide, if it’s phasey you’re too wide. Quote from Rolo 46: M carries the weight of the music S provides space and the stereo field info As long as M is within its critical distance you will render an effective stereo image Omni M is wide angle, little proximity, close critical distance Card M is portrait, medium proximity, medium critical distance Fig 8 M is telephoto, hi proximity, long critical distance. That's a great description! |
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Post by EmRR on Oct 26, 2024 9:47:33 GMT -6
Rolo 46's work and comments can be found at GS in the remote recording area. TV/film guy who did a lot of classical recording later on. Definitely a MS guru.
On one level omni mid will let you get closer and they'll be stronger S info.
F8 will give the strongest pinpoint mid with the most proximity effect, maybe making you pull back, lessening the S.
For wide guitar, I'd probably look at another technique, but try it.
When I go ribbon M condenser S I'm usually thinking about a softer sounding mid and/or an S output with more level and less cable/preamp noise. A brighter S condenser might make for a more 'excited' wideness.
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Post by russellcreekps on Oct 26, 2024 11:17:43 GMT -6
Thanks EmRR , excellent info! |
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Post by markfouxman on Oct 26, 2024 23:03:09 GMT -6
While it is probably possible to use in this configuration, for 'S' I'd suggest using ribbon. Not the least for its unique polar pattern, which is uniform up to very high frequencies. This alone should keep the stereo image stable and focused. Also, the fig 8 condensers in that position tend to sound shrill and lack body--something where ribbons excel.
Best, M
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Post by EmRR on Oct 27, 2024 4:33:07 GMT -6
Except for at least the Sennheiser MKH 30. Most uniform figure 8 pattern I’ve experienced in practice, most filled in picture of every angle as a Blumlein pair. Ribbons still have vertical versus horizontal pattern differences, specifically useful at times. LDC’s? Less than desirable for S position, laughable pattern uniformity. May sound great for M or any other usage, but will give a bad impression of MS as the S. All separate from tonal preference - pick your battles.
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Post by markfouxman on Oct 27, 2024 18:57:17 GMT -6
Except for at least the Sennheiser MKH 30. Most uniform figure 8 pattern I’ve experienced in practice, most filled in picture of every angle as a Blumlein pair. Ribbons still have vertical versus horizontal pattern differences, specifically useful at times. LDC’s? Less than desirable for S position, laughable pattern uniformity. May sound great for M or any other usage, but will give a bad impression of MS as the S. All separate from tonal preference - pick your battles. The MKH 30 is in a class of its own for many reasons. It has a single diaphragm, so even though it is tuned in the mid band, still perhaps the closest to the ribbon arrangement out of all condenser mics because of lack of the acoustic resistance control. Its directivity is excellent because of its small diaphragm and as we know the pattern is a function of the diaphragm size. Still even large geometry ribbon is twice as narrow, so the uniformity of the pattern is about an octave up in a horizontal plane. As you rightly noticed the vertical plane is quite a bit more narrow because of much longer physical dimension. That can be used as an advantage to eliminate floor and ceiling high frequency reflections.
Best, M
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