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Post by kcatthedog on Aug 19, 2024 12:33:49 GMT -6
If you are curious/interested !
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Post by the other mark williams on Aug 19, 2024 22:13:22 GMT -6
I would be curious/interested in Softube Console, but Dan, didn't you say Softube is doing something in the Console shell that degrades performance of the plugins within it as compared to the same plugins "out of the shell," so to speak? I wonder if that also applies to UAD and FF plugins? I don't know enough about how the whole system works. Anyway, I've been really interested in the Console idea and workflow on several occasions, but never end up going for it. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Aug 20, 2024 2:32:52 GMT -6
Never heard of any degradation of plug ins before: experiential or evidence based ?
I thought one of my best sounding mixes was done with Console but I got tired of the workflow and sold it.
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Post by thehightenor on Aug 20, 2024 4:39:12 GMT -6
Never heard of any degradation of plug ins before: experiential or evidence based ? I thought one of my best sounding mixes was done with Console but I got tired of the workflow and sold it. Ha hah, I’m the opposite. I don’t really use the plug-ins much, I love the Console 1 for its workflow- it makes navigating a large Cubase project very quick as it has those 20 bankable channel select buttons and channel naming. Console 1 and Cubase have two way channel chasing and so C1 is a great additional controller for Cubase. The plug-ins are quite good too - bonus. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Aug 20, 2024 5:10:39 GMT -6
Ya, but you always were weird !  |
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Post by Quint on Aug 20, 2024 6:22:32 GMT -6
I would be curious/interested in Softube Console, but Dan, didn't you say Softube is doing something in the Console shell that degrades performance of the plugins within it as compared to the same plugins "out of the shell," so to speak? I wonder if that also applies to UAD and FF plugins? I don't know enough about how the whole system works. Anyway, I've been really interested in the Console idea and workflow on several occasions, but never end up going for it. I don't remember all of the details, but this at least WAS a thing. I don't know if it still is though. Softube may have addressed it. It had to do with aliasing or oversampling or something like that, where it actually did alter the sound. I've forgotten the details, but I remember thinking at the time that I didn't want a hardware controller to alter the sound even a little bit. It's supposed to just be a platform for providing physical knobs. The issue had something to do with how Softube accesses and controls the underlying plugins, but maybe they've fixed it now. It wasn't a bug though. It was an intentional design choice. Maybe it was associated with the filters? I just can't remember the details. |
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spud
Junior Member
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Post by spud on Aug 20, 2024 8:44:42 GMT -6
I would be curious/interested in Softube Console, but Dan , didn't you say Softube is doing something in the Console shell that degrades performance of the plugins within it as compared to the same plugins "out of the shell," so to speak? I wonder if that also applies to UAD and FF plugins? I don't know enough about how the whole system works. Anyway, I've been really interested in the Console idea and workflow on several occasions, but never end up going for it. the problem with the Console 1 plugin is the crappy anti-aliasing filter if you use it below 96/192K (the frequency varies depending on the plugins). Without this filter it would be a great tool. I don't use it anymore because of that. And I don't have your experience or your studios (I'm talking about RGO members in general) but I have enough to hear that it alters the sound in the wrong way. I hope one day they will do something about this, like an option to enable or disable this filter, or make it a linear phase one even if it requires more machine resources. |
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Post by shakermaker on Aug 20, 2024 9:03:01 GMT -6
hmm, is there anyone from softube that could confirm this was fixed? Am really tempted to sell my uf8 and go this route, the work flow seems perfect for me
but def do not want any sound change using the console 1 plug. Hmmmm hmm hmm lol
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Post by copperx on Aug 20, 2024 9:41:30 GMT -6
When I got my Console 1 Mk2 I did a mix and it was the easiest, most pleasurable experience mixing I ever had, coupled with a motorized fader on a Behringer X Touch One for automation. Unfortunately, even though the mix was good, from the sound quality perspective it had this ugly distorted high end signature that since I've pinned down on the default SSL EQ emulation. The group delay / phase response on it is horrible. "For me it sounds very unnatural. It’s like looking to an audio image through some kind of a crooked glass. You’ll never achieve hi-fi sound this way." vladgsound.wordpress.com/2015/01/12/a-classification-of-digital-equalizers-draft/Scroll down to "Phasy Bandwidth Limiting". That's how the Softube SSL 4k EQ emulation behaves. I've since spent a whooping 8 hours remapping the Console 1 using Realearn to Molot GE and SlickEQ and the results are now crazy good. I hope Softube implements 3rd party plugin mapping, because I think their design is fantastic. |
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Post by Dan on Aug 20, 2024 11:38:52 GMT -6
I would be curious/interested in Softube Console, but Dan , didn't you say Softube is doing something in the Console shell that degrades performance of the plugins within it as compared to the same plugins "out of the shell," so to speak? I wonder if that also applies to UAD and FF plugins? I don't know enough about how the whole system works. Anyway, I've been really interested in the Console idea and workflow on several occasions, but never end up going for it. Weiss Gambit strip for C1 has a crappy anti-alias filters like the rest of Softube products meant more as guitar amp stuff versus the very good half band linear phase filters positioned so that they roll off what they allow as aliasing of the full Weiss plugs and hardware. |
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Post by the other mark williams on Aug 20, 2024 19:12:46 GMT -6
I would be curious/interested in Softube Console, but Dan , didn't you say Softube is doing something in the Console shell that degrades performance of the plugins within it as compared to the same plugins "out of the shell," so to speak? I wonder if that also applies to UAD and FF plugins? I don't know enough about how the whole system works. Anyway, I've been really interested in the Console idea and workflow on several occasions, but never end up going for it. Weiss Gambit series has a crappy anti-alias filters like the rest of Softube products meant more as guitar amp stuff versus the very good half band linear phase filters positioned so that they roll off what they allow as aliasing of the full Weiss plugs and hardware. So does the Console 1 "shell" (sorry for my inelegance in terminology, just not sure what to call it...) change the underlying plugins? I know I mentioned to you lately that I've actually really been liking their Brit Class A ("Neve") package. Would the Brit Class A sound different in the Console 1 "shell" than it does as just a normal plugin (AU in my case)? Been digging their Summit TLA-100 lately, too - but again, I don't want no stinking shell changing anything about the sound... |
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Post by the other mark williams on Aug 20, 2024 19:16:27 GMT -6
When I got my Console 1 Mk2 I did a mix and it was the easiest, most pleasurable experience mixing I ever had, coupled with a motorized fader on a Behringer X Touch One for automation. Unfortunately, even though the mix was good, from the sound quality perspective it had this ugly distorted high end signature that since I've pinned down on the default SSL EQ emulation. The group delay / phase response on it is horrible. "For me it sounds very unnatural. It’s like looking to an audio image through some kind of a crooked glass. You’ll never achieve hi-fi sound this way." vladgsound.wordpress.com/2015/01/12/a-classification-of-digital-equalizers-draft/Scroll down to "Phasy Bandwidth Limiting". That's how the Softube SSL 4k EQ emulation behaves. I've since spent a whooping 8 hours remapping the Console 1 using Realearn to Molot GE and SlickEQ and the results are now crazy good. I hope Softube implements 3rd party plugin mapping, because I think their design is fantastic. They did code an entirely new "standard channel strip" for Console 1 mkIII. I imagine that may have been in response to what you're saying about the SSL 4k, which I believe was the prior default channel strip. |
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Post by wiz on Aug 20, 2024 19:40:34 GMT -6
I watched the video... then looked at the prices..... eeeek...
I have owned quite a few controllers and ended up selling all of them.. including console Mk1.....
I end up faster without them....
Doesn't stop me coveting them though 8)
cheers
Wiz
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Post by copperx on Aug 20, 2024 19:48:05 GMT -6
When I got my Console 1 Mk2 I did a mix and it was the easiest, most pleasurable experience mixing I ever had, coupled with a motorized fader on a Behringer X Touch One for automation. Unfortunately, even though the mix was good, from the sound quality perspective it had this ugly distorted high end signature that since I've pinned down on the default SSL EQ emulation. The group delay / phase response on it is horrible. "For me it sounds very unnatural. It’s like looking to an audio image through some kind of a crooked glass. You’ll never achieve hi-fi sound this way." vladgsound.wordpress.com/2015/01/12/a-classification-of-digital-equalizers-draft/Scroll down to "Phasy Bandwidth Limiting". That's how the Softube SSL 4k EQ emulation behaves. I've since spent a whooping 8 hours remapping the Console 1 using Realearn to Molot GE and SlickEQ and the results are now crazy good. I hope Softube implements 3rd party plugin mapping, because I think their design is fantastic. They did code an entirely new "standard channel strip" for Console 1 mkIII. I imagine that may have been in response to what you're saying about the SSL 4k, which I believe was the prior default channel strip.
Yes, although I haven't checked to see if it has been fixed on that strip. And if it is, it's still a $200 fix.
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Post by Quint on Aug 20, 2024 19:52:18 GMT -6
I watched the video... then looked at the prices..... eeeek... I have owned quite a few controllers and ended up selling all of them.. including console Mk1..... I end up faster without them.... Doesn't stop me coveting them though 8) cheers Wiz I'm nearly done with that Stream Deck project I've been working on. I know you have the smaller Stream Deck, but you can always demo SD Mobile Pro on an iPad, if you were still interested. I'm pretty happy with how it's turned out. |
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Post by shakermaker on Aug 20, 2024 20:47:23 GMT -6
When I got my Console 1 Mk2 I did a mix and it was the easiest, most pleasurable experience mixing I ever had, coupled with a motorized fader on a Behringer X Touch One for automation. Unfortunately, even though the mix was good, from the sound quality perspective it had this ugly distorted high end signature that since I've pinned down on the default SSL EQ emulation. The group delay / phase response on it is horrible. "For me it sounds very unnatural. It’s like looking to an audio image through some kind of a crooked glass. You’ll never achieve hi-fi sound this way." vladgsound.wordpress.com/2015/01/12/a-classification-of-digital-equalizers-draft/Scroll down to "Phasy Bandwidth Limiting". That's how the Softube SSL 4k EQ emulation behaves. I've since spent a whooping 8 hours remapping the Console 1 using Realearn to Molot GE and SlickEQ and the results are now crazy good. I hope Softube implements 3rd party plugin mapping, because I think their design is fantastic. They did code an entirely new "standard channel strip" for Console 1 mkIII. I imagine that may have been in response to what you're saying about the SSL 4k, which I believe was the prior default channel strip. So does the MKIII get past these phasy/anti-aliasing filter issues? And is everything fine if you just use 96khz or higher? Can't seem to get a solid answer, emailed softube ... but what are they gonna do? admit it? haha |
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Post by the other mark williams on Aug 20, 2024 20:58:17 GMT -6
They did code an entirely new "standard channel strip" for Console 1 mkIII. I imagine that may have been in response to what you're saying about the SSL 4k, which I believe was the prior default channel strip. So does the MKIII get past these phasy/anti-aliasing filter issues? And is everything fine if you just use 96khz or higher? Can't seem to get a solid answer, emailed softube ... but what are they gonna do? admit it? haha Yeah, I hear you for sure - and I don't know the answers, either.  |
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Post by wiz on Aug 20, 2024 21:03:06 GMT -6
I watched the video... then looked at the prices..... eeeek... I have owned quite a few controllers and ended up selling all of them.. including console Mk1..... I end up faster without them.... Doesn't stop me coveting them though 8) cheers Wiz I'm nearly done with that Stream Deck project I've been working on. I know you have the smaller Stream Deck, but you can always demo SD Mobile Pro on an iPad, if you were still interested. I'm pretty happy with how it's turned out. . I have the iPad version |
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Post by Quint on Aug 20, 2024 21:12:29 GMT -6
I'm nearly done with that Stream Deck project I've been working on. I know you have the smaller Stream Deck, but you can always demo SD Mobile Pro on an iPad, if you were still interested. I'm pretty happy with how it's turned out. . I have the iPad version Ah, I thought you had the 15 key SD. |
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Post by thehightenor on Aug 21, 2024 0:57:58 GMT -6
Ya, but you always were weird ! True |
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Post by Dan on Aug 21, 2024 6:33:26 GMT -6
Weiss Gambit series has a crappy anti-alias filters like the rest of Softube products meant more as guitar amp stuff versus the very good half band linear phase filters positioned so that they roll off what they allow as aliasing of the full Weiss plugs and hardware. So does the Console 1 "shell" (sorry for my inelegance in terminology, just not sure what to call it...) change the underlying plugins? I know I mentioned to you lately that I've actually really been liking their Brit Class A ("Neve") package. Would the Brit Class A sound different in the Console 1 "shell" than it does as just a normal plugin (AU in my case)? Been digging their Summit TLA-100 lately, too - but again, I don't want no stinking shell changing anything about the sound... I think the British, American and SSL strips were originally developed for Console 1 so they should be the same but all Softube plugs have the phased top end like that except for the Weiss and the fx. That’s why I would stick to the guitar stuff (the newer models not on UAD are quite good), Weiss, and fx. I have the British class a full plug from an plugin boutique bundle and it sounds good but I would only use it if I wanted to use it on everything or on samples or amp sims. I avoided the awesome Chandler Germanium compressor, the new C1b mk II, the overstayer mas, and the super solid Summit stuff (the eq is crazy) for that reason. If Softube and u-He updated their products to have linear phase anti alias filters, I’d use the Softube color stuff and U-he presswerk a lot more. |
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Post by shakermaker on Aug 21, 2024 7:20:04 GMT -6
Does anyone know if the fab filter / UAD stuff suffers from these phased top end? I could easily get by just using FF and UAD with the console 1
but def don't wanna spend 1k on a controller that changes the sound of my UAD plugins
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spud
Junior Member
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Post by spud on Aug 22, 2024 23:02:19 GMT -6
Does anyone know if the fab filter / UAD stuff suffers from these phased top end? I could easily get by just using FF and UAD with the console 1 but def don't wanna spend 1k on a controller that changes the sound of my UAD plugins Yes it change the sound, the crappy filter is by default on the Console 1 plugin so everything you load in this plugin will have this crappy filter unless you work in 96K (or 192 it depends on the plugins loaded, like some distortions for example). |
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Post by Dan on Aug 23, 2024 9:23:56 GMT -6
Does anyone know if the fab filter / UAD stuff suffers from these phased top end? I could easily get by just using FF and UAD with the console 1 but def don't wanna spend 1k on a controller that changes the sound of my UAD plugins Yes it change the sound, the crappy filter is by default on the Console 1 plugin so everything you load in this plugin will have this crappy filter unless you work in 96K (or 192 it depends on the plugins loaded, like some distortions for example). Yes but it is a midi controller than can be used to control other plugs. So if the filter is there in those plugs is unknown |
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spud
Junior Member
Posts: 71
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Post by spud on Aug 23, 2024 15:55:25 GMT -6
I need to try Realearn/CSI to control other plugins with Console 1 under Reaper, it seems to work pretty well.
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