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Post by russellcreekps on May 27, 2024 19:42:38 GMT -6
I think that’s the lowest price I’ve ever seen on these. Great sale on right now! (And the EP-34 is only $29, what?!)
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Post by kcatthedog on May 28, 2024 3:20:58 GMT -6
I think they’ve been lower in bundle deals, but still not native, so need uad hardware ?
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Post by russellcreekps on May 28, 2024 19:23:11 GMT -6
kcatthedog yeah likely in a bundle, but I don’t need a bunch more plugs from them, already put together quite a few over the years. For a one off price though, I’ve never seen them close to this price. Also got the API EQ’s…Marc Daniel Nelson suggested that the 560 sounds amazing on the mixbus without any settings engaged (just turn it on). I absolutely concur, crazy what it adds! Anyway, looking forward to having some fun with the 140 and 250. But yeah, hardware is needed. Got a sweet deal on a used SSL Big Six awhile ago, and missed the convenience of the Apollo, so traded the Big Six and went back to all in with UA…super handy to track with their unison pre’s when my outboard options don’t fit. Glad I never sold the Apollo. Now my issues with important Luna features being addressed…that’s a different story! 
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Post by ragan on May 28, 2024 20:28:28 GMT -6
I wish they were native.
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Post by kcatthedog on May 29, 2024 17:00:32 GMT -6
Is anybody else scratching their head thinking what are ua staff actually doing?
We’ve already hashed out the customer support debacle, Luna, limps along missing, very obvious features: still, new plugs are reused old code, apollo refresh: who knows ?, 20 year old sharc chip designs, and guitar pedals, and constant remakes of hardware?
Is it just me ?
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Post by Johnkenn on May 29, 2024 18:40:30 GMT -6
Is anybody else scratching their head thinking what are ua staff actually doing? We’ve already hashed out the customer support debacle, Luna, limps along missing, very obvious features: still, new plugs are reused old code, apollo refresh: who knows ?, 20 year old sharc chip designs, and guitar pedals, and constant remakes of hardware? Is it just me ? No…I’ve been kindve shocked by it too. Now that UA has collapsed prices, it really seems to have rocked prices. Maybe this is a really naive thing to say, but just how much R&D do you have to recoup as a coder? Take something like Sound City. How many do you think they’ve sold? I really have NO idea…and I’m either gonna completely underestimate or overestimate. But let’s just do a round number and say 5000 units. Lets say - $200 average. That’s $1 million. Is there a team of coders? Even if there are 5 coders, you’re not paying them $200k apiece… Is 5000 grossly over or under estimating? |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 29, 2024 19:01:01 GMT -6
Is anybody else scratching their head thinking what are ua staff actually doing? We’ve already hashed out the customer support debacle, Luna, limps along missing, very obvious features: still, new plugs are reused old code, apollo refresh: who knows ?, 20 year old sharc chip designs, and guitar pedals, and constant remakes of hardware? Is it just me ? No…I’ve been kindve shocked by it too. Now that UA has collapsed prices, it really seems to have rocked prices. Maybe this is a really naive thing to say, but just how much R&D do you have to recoup as a coder? Take something like Sound City. How many do you think they’ve sold? I really have NO idea…and I’m either gonna completely underestimate or overestimate. But let’s just do a round number and say 5000 units. Lets say - $200 average. That’s $1 million. Is there a team of coders? Even if there are 5 coders, you’re not paying them $200k apiece… Is 5000 grossly over or under estimating? I think you're overestimating sales but I know you're underestimating how much good coders cost. In my world it's $250k - $300k for entry level and $400+ for experience. Maybe plugins are different than B2B software. But it's even more specialized so I wouldn't be surprised if it's similar. |
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Post by russellcreekps on May 29, 2024 20:07:25 GMT -6
Probably making good money off their Spark membership as well.
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Post by copperx on May 29, 2024 20:25:33 GMT -6
I think you're overestimating sales but I know you're underestimating how much good coders cost. In my world it's $250k - $300k for entry level and $400+ for experience. Maybe plugins are different than B2B software. But it's even more specialized so I wouldn't be surprised if it's similar.
That's not even counting people with niche specialties, such as DSP algorithms. Probably there's 2-4 of those at UA and the rest are generalists. However, algorithms only have to be written once; once the device has been modeled there's little to do, so they probably work under contract? I don't know. I just like speculating.
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Post by Quint on May 29, 2024 20:35:16 GMT -6
Is anybody else scratching their head thinking what are ua staff actually doing? We’ve already hashed out the customer support debacle, Luna, limps along missing, very obvious features: still, new plugs are reused old code, apollo refresh: who knows ?, 20 year old sharc chip designs, and guitar pedals, and constant remakes of hardware? Is it just me ? No…I’ve been kindve shocked by it too. Now that UA has collapsed prices, it really seems to have rocked prices. Maybe this is a really naive thing to say, but just how much R&D do you have to recoup as a coder? Take something like Sound City. How many do you think they’ve sold? I really have NO idea…and I’m either gonna completely underestimate or overestimate. But let’s just do a round number and say 5000 units. Lets say - $200 average. That’s $1 million. Is there a team of coders? Even if there are 5 coders, you’re not paying them $200k apiece… Is 5000 grossly over or under estimating? If only 0.1% (1 in a 1,000) of people in the world were into recording music, that's roughly 7 million people worldwide that would be purchasing plugins. Not that everyone who records music is a UA customer, but they are one of the largest producers of recording gear and software, so a decent number of those 7 million people likely are UA customers. I'm pretty sure I've heard Drew mention at some point that they have hundreds of thousands of customers, and I could believe that, especially now that UA has gone native. So let's' just say that UA has 200K customers, for the sake of discussion. It's probably higher than 200K, as that's only 2.9% of 7 million, but whatever. Anyway, 5,000 units sold, out of 200k potential customers seems a little low, especially considering the prices that UA plugins go for now and also considering that Sound City seems to be a pretty sought after and well regarded plugin. So I suspect the number should be higher than 5,000, but even if being pretty conservative, 5,000 units sold seems like something I could totally believe as an at minimum sort of number. Where it gets fuzzy for me is what the cost is in labor to produce something like Sound City. Something like the 6176 had to be pretty minimal in cost, considering its origins, and that plugin will almost certainly hit pure profit without a ton of sales. But something like Sound City had to cost a chunk. And the licensing costs are not for nothing either. I imagine that's part of what has held up UA from porting their DSP Neve plugins to native. I bet Neve wants a large enough slice that it's maybe to the point that it's not profitable for UA to port those Neve plugins to native, pay Neve their piece and still have anything leftover to make any profit when UA is no longer selling plugins for an average sale price of ~$150 per plugin. Somewhere along the way, I wanna say that I started to notice a pattern with plugins licensed by certain companies, and that pattern was that the price on those particular plugins, even during sales, had a higher floor, which led me to believe that said companies were getting roughly $50 per plugin sale. So if UA isn't even managing to get $50 per plugin sale these days, but a company like Neve is still demanding the same old $50 per plugin sale, that could create an impasse... |
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Post by bossanova on May 30, 2024 14:02:42 GMT -6
No…I’ve been kindve shocked by it too. Now that UA has collapsed prices, it really seems to have rocked prices. Maybe this is a really naive thing to say, but just how much R&D do you have to recoup as a coder? Take something like Sound City. How many do you think they’ve sold? I really have NO idea…and I’m either gonna completely underestimate or overestimate. But let’s just do a round number and say 5000 units. Lets say - $200 average. That’s $1 million. Is there a team of coders? Even if there are 5 coders, you’re not paying them $200k apiece… Is 5000 grossly over or under estimating? If only 0.1% (1 in a 1,000) of people in the world were into recording music, that's roughly 7 million people worldwide that would be purchasing plugins. Not that everyone who records music is a UA customer, but they are one of the largest producers of recording gear and software, so a decent number of those 7 million people likely are UA customers. I'm pretty sure I've heard Drew mention at some point that they have hundreds of thousands of customers, and I could believe that, especially now that UA has gone native. So let's' just say that UA has 200K customers, for the sake of discussion. It's probably higher than 200K, as that's only 2.9% of 7 million, but whatever. Anyway, 5,000 units sold, out of 200k potential customers seems a little low, especially considering the prices that UA plugins go for now and also considering that Sound City seems to be a pretty sought after and well regarded plugin. So I suspect the number should be higher than 5,000, but even if being pretty conservative, 5,000 units sold seems like something I could totally believe as an at minimum sort of number. Where it gets fuzzy for me is what the cost is in labor to produce something like Sound City. Something like the 6176 had to be pretty minimal in cost, considering its origins, and that plugin will almost certainly hit pure profit without a ton of sales. But something like Sound City had to cost a chunk. And the licensing costs are not for nothing either. I imagine that's part of what has held up UA from porting their DSP Neve plugins to native. I bet Neve wants a large enough slice that it's maybe to the point that it's not profitable for UA to port those Neve plugins to native, pay Neve their piece and still have anything leftover to make any profit when UA is no longer selling plugins for an average sale price of ~$150 per plugin. Somewhere along the way, I wanna say that I started to notice a pattern with plugins licensed by certain companies, and that pattern was that the price on those particular plugins, even during sales, had a higher floor, which led me to believe that said companies were getting roughly $50 per plugin sale. So if UA isn't even managing to get $50 per plugin sale these days, but a company like Neve is still demanding the same old $50 per plugin sale, that could create an impasse... There's something like that on Abbey Road Studio 3 from Waves where it rarely if ever drops below $50 on sales and is exempt from many of their promotions. That's not the case with the other Nx plugs which suggests there is a unique agreement there. |
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Post by viciousbliss on May 30, 2024 18:19:51 GMT -6
Tried the 140 again and I just think it sounds kinda flat compared to Transatlantic, Inspirata, and SP2016's plate. Have to mess around with it more later but I've tried it a few times since 2018.
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Post by chessparov on May 31, 2024 15:31:41 GMT -6
Will just muddle through with mainly Pure Plate and Relab 480 Essentials.
Chris
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Post by drumsound on May 31, 2024 17:40:13 GMT -6
Tried the 140 again and I just think it sounds kinda flat compared to Transatlantic, Inspirata, and SP2016's plate. Have to mess around with it more later but I've tried it a few times since 2018. I admittedly haven't used the 140 much, but I do go for the Soundtoys plates quite often. Even Little Plate with a delay in front of it. It's always super easy to get what I'm after. Maybe I'm just a simpleton (confirmed). |
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Post by russellcreekps on May 31, 2024 18:13:31 GMT -6
Tried the 140 again and I just think it sounds kinda flat compared to Transatlantic, Inspirata, and SP2016's plate. Have to mess around with it more later but I've tried it a few times since 2018. I haven’t tried those, but I find the UAD 140 to have more life than any of my other plate plugs (Little Plate, Superplate, Pro-R plate presets, Pure plate, etc)…different strokes for different folks I guess  |
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Post by Quint on May 31, 2024 18:52:39 GMT -6
If only 0.1% (1 in a 1,000) of people in the world were into recording music, that's roughly 7 million people worldwide that would be purchasing plugins. Not that everyone who records music is a UA customer, but they are one of the largest producers of recording gear and software, so a decent number of those 7 million people likely are UA customers. I'm pretty sure I've heard Drew mention at some point that they have hundreds of thousands of customers, and I could believe that, especially now that UA has gone native. So let's' just say that UA has 200K customers, for the sake of discussion. It's probably higher than 200K, as that's only 2.9% of 7 million, but whatever. Anyway, 5,000 units sold, out of 200k potential customers seems a little low, especially considering the prices that UA plugins go for now and also considering that Sound City seems to be a pretty sought after and well regarded plugin. So I suspect the number should be higher than 5,000, but even if being pretty conservative, 5,000 units sold seems like something I could totally believe as an at minimum sort of number. Where it gets fuzzy for me is what the cost is in labor to produce something like Sound City. Something like the 6176 had to be pretty minimal in cost, considering its origins, and that plugin will almost certainly hit pure profit without a ton of sales. But something like Sound City had to cost a chunk. And the licensing costs are not for nothing either. I imagine that's part of what has held up UA from porting their DSP Neve plugins to native. I bet Neve wants a large enough slice that it's maybe to the point that it's not profitable for UA to port those Neve plugins to native, pay Neve their piece and still have anything leftover to make any profit when UA is no longer selling plugins for an average sale price of ~$150 per plugin. Somewhere along the way, I wanna say that I started to notice a pattern with plugins licensed by certain companies, and that pattern was that the price on those particular plugins, even during sales, had a higher floor, which led me to believe that said companies were getting roughly $50 per plugin sale. So if UA isn't even managing to get $50 per plugin sale these days, but a company like Neve is still demanding the same old $50 per plugin sale, that could create an impasse... There's something like that on Abbey Road Studio 3 from Waves where it rarely if ever drops below $50 on sales and is exempt from many of their promotions. That's not the case with the other Nx plugs which suggests there is a unique agreement there. Case in point. The UA half yearly sale just started. A ton of plugins are on sale for $50, but the Neve stuff is all "on sale" for $150. |
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Post by drumsound on May 31, 2024 23:06:01 GMT -6
There's something like that on Abbey Road Studio 3 from Waves where it rarely if ever drops below $50 on sales and is exempt from many of their promotions. That's not the case with the other Nx plugs which suggests there is a unique agreement there. Case in point. The UA half yearly sale just started. A ton of plugins are on sale for $50, but the Neve stuff is all "on sale" for $150. The poeple who bought the Neve name know it's worth. |
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Post by Johnkenn on May 31, 2024 23:22:36 GMT -6
Tried the 140 again and I just think it sounds kinda flat compared to Transatlantic, Inspirata, and SP2016's plate. Have to mess around with it more later but I've tried it a few times since 2018. Start on B…make sure it’s all the way stereo with the knob. Turn the two mod knobs up halfway…Pull the HP input filter up to get rid of the rumble…if you need brighter go to plate A…Darker, C. |
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Post by viciousbliss on Jun 1, 2024 3:04:59 GMT -6
Tried the 140 again and I just think it sounds kinda flat compared to Transatlantic, Inspirata, and SP2016's plate. Have to mess around with it more later but I've tried it a few times since 2018. Start on B…make sure it’s all the way stereo with the knob. Turn the two mod knobs up halfway…Pull the HP input filter up to get rid of the rumble…if you need brighter go to plate A…Darker, C. Sounds better this way. The settings I was working with were a little milder due to being based off presets. It sticks to the source a lot more than the SP2016. The EMT is a lot less wild than the SP2016, Transatlantic, or Inspirata. Definitely cleaner. |
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Post by thehightenor on Jun 1, 2024 3:12:21 GMT -6
The EMT 250 is the best one to my ears as it was originally a digital device and according to UAD blurb the original developer gave UA the original algorithms.
Being a Constant Density Plate emulation it sounds great on snare and acoustic guitar to my ears.
The EMT 140 has been surpassed by the Soundtoys Superplate - it’s been a long time since I used the UAD 140.
Great in it’s day but as a digital emulation it’s starting to show its age compared to the lastest plug-in emulations available.
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Post by Quint on Jun 1, 2024 3:25:49 GMT -6
Case in point. The UA half yearly sale just started. A ton of plugins are on sale for $50, but the Neve stuff is all "on sale" for $150. The poeple who bought the Neve name know it's worth. But it's only worth what people will pay. Now that the new price regime at UA is in effect, I wonder how many people will balk at the idea of paying $150 for a Neve plugin when everything else is going for $40 or $50 or less. If UA customers no longer are willing to pay $150 for a UAD Neve plugin, it won't really matter what the people at Neve think the name is worth. I suspect both sides, UA and Neve, are each entrenched in their position, and are waiting to see who blinks first, hence why none of the UAD Neve plugins, except for the 1073, have been ported to native, and the 1073 is really only available on native as part of a squirrely work around. |
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Post by Dan on Jun 1, 2024 9:18:01 GMT -6
And here comes psp to undercut their sale: www.jrrshop.com/psp-2445 Code: GROUP = $20.58 You can use both the 244 and 245 at once to make some crazy sounds. Also endorsed by Dr. Barry Blesser. The EMT 250 is the best one to my ears as it was originally a digital device and according to UAD blurb the original developer gave UA the original algorithms. Being a Constant Density Plate emulation it sounds great on snare and acoustic guitar to my ears. The EMT 140 has been surpassed by the Soundtoys Superplate - it’s been a long time since I used the UAD 140. Great in it’s day but as a digital emulation it’s starting to show its age compared to the lastest plug-in emulations available. I think the point is that it’s an algorithmic port of an early digital reverb more than it’s a real plate. There are entire music genres based off of those like Shoegaze ( the yamaha reverse reverb and alesis bloom) and there were only a limited amount of them, they couldn’t even come close to realistic (until the Michael Carnes lexicons and the TC Electronics late 90s verbs) so they had to sound cool and ethereal, and they were on every record and most movies from the late 70s until the 2000s |
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 1, 2024 9:58:55 GMT -6
The EMT 250 is the best one to my ears as it was originally a digital device and according to UAD blurb the original developer gave UA the original algorithms. Being a Constant Density Plate emulation it sounds great on snare and acoustic guitar to my ears. The EMT 140 has been surpassed by the Soundtoys Superplate - it’s been a long time since I used the UAD 140. Great in it’s day but as a digital emulation it’s starting to show its age compared to the lastest plug-in emulations available. I really don’t get the love for Superplate. I’ve not found a single use for it. |
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Post by thehightenor on Jun 1, 2024 10:06:40 GMT -6
The EMT 250 is the best one to my ears as it was originally a digital device and according to UAD blurb the original developer gave UA the original algorithms. Being a Constant Density Plate emulation it sounds great on snare and acoustic guitar to my ears. The EMT 140 has been surpassed by the Soundtoys Superplate - it’s been a long time since I used the UAD 140. Great in it’s day but as a digital emulation it’s starting to show its age compared to the lastest plug-in emulations available. I really don’t get the love for Superplate. I’ve not found a single use for it. .... And right there is the reason there are 50 different versions of 1176, LA2A, EQ's Reverb, Delays et etc plugins. One man's junk is another man's treasure. John we never cross paths on reverb I also love, love, love Hitsville Chambers .... to me that is the sound of a record - same for the Hitsville EQ. Agree .... I thought not  |
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Post by drumsound on Jun 1, 2024 11:52:39 GMT -6
The poeple who bought the Neve name know it's worth. But it's only worth what people will pay. Now that the new price regime at UA is in effect, I wonder how many people will balk at the idea of paying $150 for a Neve plugin when everything else is going for $40 or $50 or less. If UA customers no longer are willing to pay $150 for a UAD Neve plugin, it won't really matter what the people at Neve think the name is worth. I suspect both sides, UA and Neve, are each entrenched in their position, and are waiting to see who blinks first, hence why none of the UAD Neve plugins, except for the 1073, have been ported to native, and the 1073 is really only available on native as part of a squirrely work around. I was more so referring to the original agreement, but I totally see what you mean, and I think you're right. Though, without being privy to inside info, we won't know. The Neve cache still means a lot, and it's possible that the UAD 'sanctioned' Neve things still get the price put on them. Marketing is a weird thing, and so is perception. The EMT 250 is the best one to my ears as it was originally a digital device and according to UAD blurb the original developer gave UA the original algorithms. Being a Constant Density Plate emulation it sounds great on snare and acoustic guitar to my ears. The EMT 140 has been surpassed by the Soundtoys Superplate - it’s been a long time since I used the UAD 140. Great in it’s day but as a digital emulation it’s starting to show its age compared to the lastest plug-in emulations available. I really don’t get the love for Superplate. I’ve not found a single use for it. I think that's just one of those situations where individual interaction can't really be explained. We all hear things a little differently and we all have things that make sense to us in the moment. When Little Plate first hit, I did a Karaoke type thing where a kid sang a bunch of Sinatra and Bobby Darin songs. Little Plate (compared to other things I had at the time ITB) just worked. It made sense in context and I didn't have to work hard to get what I was looking for. The SuperPlate, therefore also made sense. I probably sound make myself spend more time with the 140 so that I feel more 'at one' with it. It has different options and whatnot, and I've never thought it to sound bad. |
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