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Post by kcatthedog on May 8, 2024 4:09:34 GMT -6
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Post by andersmv on May 8, 2024 5:47:20 GMT -6
This is getting ridiculous. I bought a brand new M2 Studio right when the M2 chips came out, and less than a year later Apples already 2 chip generations ahead… They need to slow down and focus on maximizing what they have.
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Post by kcatthedog on May 8, 2024 5:58:41 GMT -6
Yes and no, you m2 has great specs and use of power cores, so would an m4 when it shows up really make much of a difference?
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Post by thehightenor on May 8, 2024 6:01:20 GMT -6
I’m far more cynical - they already have their road map and no doubt an M6 on the test bench.
Drip drip drip feed the masses. Maximise profit.
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Post by Johnkenn on May 8, 2024 6:01:36 GMT -6
Yeah it’s all gravy at this point, right? Hell I’m on an M1 I can barely make break a sweat…
It’s ashamed Apple is forcing people to upgrade.
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Post by thehightenor on May 8, 2024 6:05:05 GMT -6
Yeah it’s all gravy at this point, right? Hell I’m on an M1 I can barely make break a sweat… It’s ashamed Apple is forcing people to upgrade. My Intel 4950 (six core) latest me 9 years. My new 13900K (24 core) will last me at least another 9 years. One new system per decade is all I need. It’s very expensive to stay on the cutting edge. |
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Post by Johnkenn on May 8, 2024 6:10:36 GMT -6
Yeah it’s all gravy at this point, right? Hell I’m on an M1 I can barely make break a sweat… It’s ashamed Apple is forcing people to upgrade. My Intel 4950 (six core) latest me 9 years. My new 13900K (24 core) will last me at least another 9 years. One new system per decade is all I need. It’s very expensive to stay on the cutting edge. No one is forcing anyone to buy. Btw - my 2012 Mac Mini 16gb ram stayed commissioned for 11 years. |
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Post by andersmv on May 8, 2024 6:53:45 GMT -6
Yes and no, you m2 has great specs and use of power cores, so would an m4 when it shows up really make much of a difference? It's not "shinny new thing" syndrome, my M2 Ultra is insane and I'm getting my work done faster than I thought I could. I'm still running ProTools on rosetta because a lot of stuff still isn't M Chip compatible. I'm concerned about their obvious priority of spitting out new chips as opposed to focusing on making sure everyone that make the crap that runs on those chips has the time to test and make sure things are compatible and working correctly. At this point, I don't see how developers are going to be able to keep up if there's already a new freaking chip by the time they've worked out the kinks for the last one. I'm worried nothing is ever going to work properly on a "professional" level ever again on macs because there's no possible way developers are going to be able to keep up. That was the problem way back in the early 2000's when a lot of people like me started to move to macs. Everything was streamlined to the point that your software just worked without any hassles. PC world was a lot more open and you really had to do your homework to make sure the hardware combinations you had were going to play well together. I hit that point where I didn't want to build computers anymore and have to do hours of research and learning, I wanted to make music and get better and engineering. I bought a mac and that freed up a lot of the headache for me. I don't understand these M chips well enough and I'm definitely not a computer guy anymore. Maybe all of these M chips are streamlines enough and similar enough where compatibility isn't that big of a deal. You can just code/design for their M stuff and it will all work well, I don't know? It sure doesn't seem like it though. It seems like to me Apple is just making it impossible for anyone to put out software that's going to be stable and bug free if they continue at this pace. |
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Post by svart on May 8, 2024 6:57:06 GMT -6
I came across some mini PCs the other day and daydreamed about "upgrading" from my lowly i7-9700 to the new i9-13900 which would effectively double my power, but then I remembered that I barely use 50% of my CPU as it is..
The new hotness will always be an enticing thing, but the new adopter tax is a big one.
Anyway, to accurately discuss new Macs in this or any thread, I believe I need to gripe about Apple not including some esoteric feature that 99.999% of people don't want or need and then proclaim that I will wait for the M5 chip, right?
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Post by Johnkenn on May 8, 2024 7:21:53 GMT -6
I came across some mini PCs the other day and daydreamed about "upgrading" from my lowly i7-9700 to the new i9-13900 which would effectively double my power, but then I remembered that I barely use 50% of my CPU as it is.. The new hotness will always be an enticing thing, but the new adopter tax is a big one. Anyway, to accurately discuss new Macs in this or any thread, I believe I need to gripe about Apple not including some esoteric feature that 99.999% of people don't want or need and then proclaim that I will wait for the M5 chip, right?  |
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Post by kcatthedog on May 8, 2024 8:08:58 GMT -6
Developers have had years to get M silicon compatible, if they are not there now, that’s hardly on Apple, what the hell have the developers been doing?
I think the Rosetta inefficiency is overstated as well. I have read that the plug is reskinned once, then that is saved, so doing the handshake between intel and Mac coding still consumes some cpu, I didn’t really notice much of a difference.
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Post by kcatthedog on May 8, 2024 8:15:13 GMT -6
Yeah it’s all gravy at this point, right? Hell I’m on an M1 I can barely make break a sweat… It’s ashamed Apple is forcing people to upgrade. My Intel 4950 (six core) latest me 9 years. My new 13900K (24 core) will last me at least another 9 years. One new system per decade is all I need. It’s very expensive to stay on the cutting edge. Maybe, I bought a used m1 mini with extended renewable warranty, Magic Trackpad and keyboard and a 34 inch curved monitor for $1100 cdn, like $800 usd. Agreed, buying new isn’t cheap, but there are Apple refurbished, like Ragan’s new air and the used market, so there are options. Like said above too, how much more power for audio, do you need than say an m2 studio? |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 8, 2024 11:13:22 GMT -6
To me it feels a little bit like the new chip announcements are much more branding/marketing based than they are all that big of a deal.
I think we are all still reeling from what a watershed leap forward the M1 chips were.
The reality is that each iteration seems to me to be modest power bumps and nothing else really. And that's totally ok. They own the chip design so why not keep notching up the capability? And Apple has arguably the best marketing teams in the world so why not take advantage of that too?
But it is getting just a little bit silly with the Pro/Ultra/Max/whatever designations. Why make consumers sit there calculating how an M3 Max compares to an M4 Pro or what have you?
One more thought... having a single digit numbering system is pure genius here. M3 to M4 feels like a huge leap. Compare that to Intel i9-13900k to i9-14900k.
The Apple numbering gives you FOMO. The Intel numbering gives you a headache.
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Post by gwlee7 on May 8, 2024 12:04:56 GMT -6
Computers are like other hardware is to me now. I ain't buying anything else until I have figured out how to use everything I already have. Besides, I have moved on to letting guitar pedals be my new buy without thinking item.  |
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Post by Blackdawg on May 8, 2024 12:24:31 GMT -6
Yeah it’s all gravy at this point, right? Hell I’m on an M1 I can barely make break a sweat… It’s ashamed Apple is forcing people to upgrade. I mean, a new chip doesn't mean you have to upgrade. Usually don't need a new machine for 8-12 years depending on software limitation more than anything. The only reason Apple is pushing M4 so fast even before some machines got m3 is to play catch up on the AI race against Nvidia. |
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Post by Johnkenn on May 8, 2024 12:46:13 GMT -6
Yeah it’s all gravy at this point, right? Hell I’m on an M1 I can barely make break a sweat… It’s ashamed Apple is forcing people to upgrade. I mean, a new chip doesn't mean you have to upgrade. Usually don't need a new machine for 8-12 years depending on software limitation more than anything. The only reason Apple is pushing M4 so fast even before some machines got m3 is to play catch up on the AI race against Nvidia. I was being sarcastic. |
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Post by mike on May 8, 2024 12:52:19 GMT -6
Do I remember correctly that for typical audio application software, it is the singe core performance that matters most?
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 8, 2024 12:59:06 GMT -6
Do I remember correctly that for typical audio application software, it is the singe core performance that matters most? That's what they say. I've never verified that independently. At some point though I think the software will do a better job at spreading the load. |
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Post by the other mark williams on May 8, 2024 21:58:30 GMT -6
Do I remember correctly that for typical audio application software, it is the singe core performance that matters most? That's what they say. I've never verified that independently. At some point though I think the software will do a better job at spreading the load. Generally speaking, you cannot spread a plugin across more than one core. That’s why single core speed matters so much in audio. You can peak out on one core with a super intensive plugin, and even though you still have tons of CPU left, the session chokes and you can’t play any audio. So faster single core speed generally is better for audio. |
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Post by the other mark williams on May 8, 2024 22:06:19 GMT -6
I know I sound like a broken record around here saying this, but seriously, chip speed and higher number of cores CANNOT come fast enough in the video world.
The video advancements that are just barely now becoming possible are because of the increased CPU from the latest chips. Even if chips QUINTUPLED in speed/power in the next year (they won't) it still wouldn’t be fast enough for what we need RIGHT NOW in the video world.
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Post by rowmat on May 8, 2024 22:09:30 GMT -6
Undoubtedly with Apple releasing new M* versions as quickly as they are the likely rate of ‘programmed’ obsolescence will follow at nearly the same speed.
I say “programmed” because Apple’s propensity for denying OS upgrades on older hardware, often only three versions prior to the current, when the hardware is invariably capable of supporting the newer OS’s is simply extortion.
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Post by the other mark williams on May 8, 2024 22:18:58 GMT -6
Undoubtedly with Apple releasing new M* versions as quickly as they are the likely the rate of ‘programmed’ obsolescence will follow at the nearly the same speed. I say “programmed” because Apple’s propensity for denying OS upgrades on older hardware, often only three versions prior to the current, when the hardware is invariably capable of supporting the newer OS’s is simply extortion. Regarding the above quote: Hey kcatthedog, what OS were you just running on what model of Intel Mac? (‘Til you bought your M1 Mini…) |
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Post by notneeson on May 8, 2024 22:51:33 GMT -6
Pro Tools ran kinda janky on my M1 Pro today.
Pretty sure Steve Albini’s just fucking with me from the beyond.
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Post by Blackdawg on May 8, 2024 23:10:35 GMT -6
I know I sound like a broken record around here saying this, but seriously, chip speed and higher number of cores CANNOT come fast enough in the video world. The video advancements that are just barely now becoming possible are because of the increased CPU from the latest chips. Even if chips QUINTUPLED in speed/power in the next year (they won't) it still wouldn’t be fast enough for what we need RIGHT NOW in the video world. try working on a PC....Plenty of speed there. |
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Post by kcatthedog on May 9, 2024 2:59:39 GMT -6
Undoubtedly with Apple releasing new M* versions as quickly as they are the likely the rate of ‘programmed’ obsolescence will follow at the nearly the same speed. I say “programmed” because Apple’s propensity for denying OS upgrades on older hardware, often only three versions prior to the current, when the hardware is invariably capable of supporting the newer OS’s is simply extortion. Regarding the above quote: Hey kcatthedog, what OS were you just running on what model of Intel Mac? (‘Til you bought your M1 Mini…) On the mbp, I was running the last Apple approved OS, have (forgotten once that was?), but once I got the m1, and learned about open legacy patcher, I have both Macs on current OS. |
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