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Post by robo on Oct 26, 2023 10:09:36 GMT -6
It seems like you should try what you’ve got on piano and see which mics compliment the specific instrument(s) you’ve got. If that’s 90% of the use, that seems the most direct way to get to the best choice. You are being completely sensible. You must be sick.... :-) Actually, I'm pretty much fine with the AT4050 pair on overheads, though a little more girth would be nice. U67 o U87 would do that. On piano, lately, I've use the MC930 pair. It's sounded so good that I really have no reason other than GAS to change it up. The MC930 are quite nuetral with a 10K lift (slightly). They are really great on so many things. I've tried the CM7 on piano and it was only OK. Maybe too much midrange, which would then exclude the U87 pair from the running. So many choices. I am trying to be good myself, in the market for a pair of LDC’s myself and trying to sort through what is hyped online and what I actually need in relation to what I’ve got… I love 930’s on my upright piano! Sometimes I use an LDC on the low end and a 930 on the highs. My two cents is that the BU67/69 pair would probably be a nice compliment to those and the 4050’s, both for piano and overheads. A pair of U87 clones wouldn’t suck either. |
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Post by Omicron9 on Oct 26, 2023 10:26:49 GMT -6
I’m loving a pair of Cremona on OH. I used to use 414b-ULS and I like these as well or better. I think the Cremona will probably shine on piano as well, but haven’t tracked mine with them yet. ragan, How does the top end on the Cremona compare to the B-ULS? I love the non-hyped top end on the B-ULS. TIA, -09 |
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Post by Omicron9 on Oct 26, 2023 10:34:32 GMT -6
Piano? The Neumann type LDCs can be very colored on pianos, acoustic guitars, and guitar cabinets. Maybe Shure KSM44? Sacrilege I know.
Drum overheads depend a lot on the drummer ime. I could tell you one that is detailed and undamped yet it would sound like the harshest thing in the whole world on one drummer yet a more pleasant mic for them might not capture the performance of another drummer. The Beyerdynamic LDCs were very great and inoffensive yet are discontinued. Beyerdynamic keeps raising their prices past the detail captured and durability of their mics though. I love the KSM-44 (multipattern) and am always surprised they don't get more love. I've even suggest the very overlooked and underrated KSM-32 (cardioid only). -09 |
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Post by Vincent R. on Oct 26, 2023 10:43:45 GMT -6
KSM-44 was my first mic. It is a great utility mic. Never quite wins shootouts though. Still, I recorded a ton of things with it, violin, viola, cello, guitars, male vocals, female vocals, you name it.
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Post by chessparov on Oct 26, 2023 11:02:06 GMT -6
I heard the AT 1040's are very taxing to listen to.
Lots of returns.
(Cues "Taxman"/Beatles)
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Post by notneeson on Oct 26, 2023 11:53:02 GMT -6
I’d add another BN67/269 v2 and use em as a pair. Love 269s on OH. ^This!^ Probably killer on piano too. One of the most talented AEs that I know loves them on acoustic guitar too, FWIW. |
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Post by mcirish on Oct 26, 2023 13:28:11 GMT -6
I think I will do some testing this weekend and try each of my single LDCs on overheads and piano and see what works the best. Kind of the logical approach though not nearly as fun as spinning the wheel and hoping to win.
A second B67-269 might make sense... if I really like it. Still need to use it on some sessions to say for sure. I have one today, so hopefully I will know better soon
If the ADK Cremona FETS drop in price again, it might be worth getting a second, but I'm still very interested in the BC12A FETs.
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Post by svart on Oct 26, 2023 13:35:36 GMT -6
Look at the mid-level Lewitt mics too. Very good value for the price.
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Post by notneeson on Oct 26, 2023 14:01:41 GMT -6
I think I will do some testing this weekend and try each of my single LDCs on overheads and piano and see what works the best. Kind of the logical approach though not nearly as fun as spinning the wheel and hoping to win. A second B67-269 might make sense... if I really like it. Still need to use it on some sessions to say for sure. I have one today, so hopefully I will know better soon If the ADK Cremona FETS drop in price again, it might be worth getting a second, but I'm still very interested in the BC12A FETs. And to be clear: I personally have only used the Neumanns. That said, everything that I have used that Ben makes has been great. |
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Post by plinker on Oct 26, 2023 23:09:13 GMT -6
It seems like you should try what you’ve got on piano and see which mics compliment the specific instrument(s) you’ve got. If that’s 90% of the use, that seems the most direct way to get to the best choice. Mr friend at addiction recommends the Lewitt 1040 to me as the best damned results he's ever had. So. . . guess what's on my radar? I've been eye-balling that one ever since I heard the samples of the mic's adjustable voicing. I have a pair of the higher-end, solid state Lewitts and they are very nice mics! They are excellent as overheads and, while I haven't had a chance to work them on piano, I am confident they would excel there. |
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Post by christopher on Oct 26, 2023 23:25:31 GMT -6
The C7 doesn't work with either Beyer MC930s (matched pair) or Neumann-Gefell M930s (also matched pair). Weirdly enough Try Ribbons. In my weird pseudo-fig 8 config. I’m speechless how well ribbons work on piano. I’m new to owning a grand, and tried out a bluemlien type thing (just XY w/ribbons) and I’m kinda stumped what more I’d want? 100 year old piano in tune, I love it |
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kbb
Junior Member
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Post by kbb on Oct 26, 2023 23:31:08 GMT -6
You've got a nice collection! Lot's of color. I want to scream RIBBONS...on the low end, a pair of Royer R10's, or the mighty stereo AEA R88 at the top end of your budget used. I'm assuming you've had ribbons, but just in case...ribbons on overheads is more than another flavor...it's a entirely different creative direction/sound/option...especially when it comes time to mix!
For LDC's:
I'm an ardent fan of AT-4050s, but if I were you, I'd get a pair of neutral-but-not-as-clinical fet LDCs...mics with a little more character than the 4050s or other usual suspects...like KSM32/44, 414's, etc.
I'd probably have these on my list to hear/check out: BU87i, Soyuz 1974s, maybe some of the Roswells.
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Post by the other mark williams on Oct 27, 2023 1:02:09 GMT -6
You've got a nice collection! Lot's of color. I want to scream RIBBONS...like maybe a pair of Royer R10's or ?...but I'm trying to stay in the LDC zone as you requested. I'm assuming you've had ribbons and know this, but just in case...ribbons on overheads is more than a new flavor...it's a entirely different creative direction/sound. I'm an ardent fan of AT-4050s, but if I were you, I'd get a pair of neutral-but-not-as-clinical fet LDCs...a little more character than the 4050s. If I were in your shoes, I'd probably have these on my list to hear/check out: BU87i, Soyuz 1974s, maybe some of the Roswells. I would echo all of this, but also suggest taking a listen to a Soyuz 017FET. Just a killer microphone with loads of character. |
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kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Oct 27, 2023 2:29:59 GMT -6
You've got a nice collection! Lot's of color. I want to scream RIBBONS...like maybe a pair of Royer R10's or ?...but I'm trying to stay in the LDC zone as you requested. I'm assuming you've had ribbons and know this, but just in case...ribbons on overheads is more than a new flavor...it's a entirely different creative direction/sound. I'm an ardent fan of AT-4050s, but if I were you, I'd get a pair of neutral-but-not-as-clinical fet LDCs...a little more character than the 4050s. If I were in your shoes, I'd probably have these on my list to hear/check out: BU87i, Soyuz 1974s, maybe some of the Roswells. I would echo all of this, but also suggest taking a listen to a Soyuz 017FET. Just a killer microphone with loads of character. I'd love to hear one of those! I think OP's budget is about $1600 for a pair... |
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Post by smashlord on Oct 27, 2023 5:30:07 GMT -6
If you don’t need multipattern, KSM32s are really good on overheads and guitar, so I imagine they are probably solid on piano. They are a 3/4 diaphragm.
Others mentioned KSM44s…. They are good utility mics, never sound bad on most things EXCEPT overheads, IMO. I really don’t like them there. GREAT tom mics, though.
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Post by the other mark williams on Oct 27, 2023 19:47:51 GMT -6
I would echo all of this, but also suggest taking a listen to a Soyuz 017FET. Just a killer microphone with loads of character. I'd love to hear one of those! I think OP's budget is about $1600 for a pair... Great point - I'd forgotten that important detail! |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 27, 2023 21:02:35 GMT -6
A pair of the Soyuz SDC's costs around $1,200.
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Post by drumsound on Oct 27, 2023 22:59:24 GMT -6
You've got a nice collection! Lot's of color. I want to scream RIBBONS...on the low end, a pair of Royer R10's, or the mighty stereo AEA R88 at the top end of your budget used. I'm assuming you've had ribbons, but just in case...ribbons on overheads is more than another flavor...it's a entirely different creative direction/sound/option...especially when it comes time to mix! For LDC's: I'm an ardent fan of AT-4050s, but if I were you, I'd get a pair of neutral-but-not-as-clinical fet LDCs...mics with a little more character than the 4050s or other usual suspects...like KSM32/44, 414's, etc. I'd probably have these on my list to hear/check out: BU87i, Soyuz 1974s, maybe some of the Roswells. My late friend Chris Garges used 4038s more than anything in his collection on his 1966 Yamaha C7, and it sounded glorious. |
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Post by reddirt on Oct 27, 2023 23:05:33 GMT -6
Yep Dr bill's pseudo fig 8 is a joy to behold with modded Apex 205 ribbons until the supposed high quality element shits itself and is exposed as "cigarette packet " foil
Cheers, Ross
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Post by Ward on Oct 28, 2023 0:11:21 GMT -6
You've got a nice collection! Lot's of color. I want to scream RIBBONS...on the low end, a pair of Royer R10's, or the mighty stereo AEA R88 at the top end of your budget used. I'm assuming you've had ribbons, but just in case...ribbons on overheads is more than another flavor...it's a entirely different creative direction/sound/option...especially when it comes time to mix! For LDC's: I'm an ardent fan of AT-4050s, but if I were you, I'd get a pair of neutral-but-not-as-clinical fet LDCs...mics with a little more character than the 4050s or other usual suspects...like KSM32/44, 414's, etc. I'd probably have these on my list to hear/check out: BU87i, Soyuz 1974s, maybe some of the Roswells. My late friend Chris Garges used 4038s more than anything in his collection on his 1966 Yamaha C7, and it sounded glorious. That’s really good to know! Thank you |
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Post by drbill on Oct 28, 2023 10:08:49 GMT -6
Yeah, the 4038's are great in my pseudo fig-8 pattern too. Coles for more open and beautiful sounding arrangements (less notes), and Apex 205 for more a more dense arrangement or needing more extended bottom. Really, hard to go wrong with either.
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Post by drbill on Oct 28, 2023 10:10:59 GMT -6
PS - Ross - hope you get your 205's up and running again!!!
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Post by drumsound on Oct 28, 2023 10:12:11 GMT -6
Yeah, the 4038's are great in my pseudo fig-8 pattern too. Coles for more open and beautiful sounding arrangements (less notes), and Apex 205 for more a more dense arrangement or needing more extended bottom. Really, hard to go wrong with either. Can you explain you pseudo figure-8 pattern, please? |
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Post by drbill on Oct 28, 2023 10:29:53 GMT -6
Sure, but if you go here you can hear examples, see pics, listen to comments, and get Fletcher explain to me how I broke "Blumlein".  gearspace.com/board/gear-shoot-outs-sound-file-comparisons-audio-tests/150891-ribbon-madness-some-comparisons.html"For the comparison I had 2 sets of mics "in" the piano and some outside as well. Mic sets 1 & 2 (they are as close together with ribbons lined up as best as I could get them) were - as I said earlier - "inside" the piano. The "L" mic is located towards the keys, about 10" inwards towards the middle of the piano from the hammers firing not towards the strings, but towards the L/R outside edges of the piano. Those mics were about 10" off the strings. The second set of mics, "R", were down towards the end of the piano, maybe 18-24" from the end about midway L to R and also about 10" off the strings. BUT this mic was firing towards the strings and towards the lid. It's kind of like a blumlein setup where the mics are firing 90 degrees from one another, but unlike a blumlein setup, they are three feet apart at least and turned. Hope that makes sense. If not, it will when I post a picture later." Leave a comment if it helps you!! Oops. Just notice - the pics have been nuked. Too bad unfortunately. A picture tells 1000 words.... |
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kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Oct 29, 2023 1:33:38 GMT -6
My late friend Chris Garges used 4038s more than anything in his collection on his 1966 Yamaha C7, and it sounded glorious. Oh wow, I'm sorry to hear that Chris passed. I remember him from TapeOp...he contributed quite a bit early on IIRC. I appreciated his stuff TapeOp, too. |
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