|
|
Post by Mister Chase on Jul 18, 2023 7:51:40 GMT -6
My AEA RPQ is crazy clean. Love it. The Hardy M-2 I have is a touch more colorful and large/3d. I would think those would do well. The QPP as well, with their low distortion op amps.
|
|
|
|
Post by plinker on Jul 18, 2023 8:48:27 GMT -6
"P.S I knew my suggestion would go down like a lead balloon but if it's feasable I will try to offer a cost effective yet quality solution."
Funny! I support you on this mission, Shadow -- but, unfortunately, your suggestion doesn't cost enough ;-)
|
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Jul 18, 2023 8:49:44 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that.
|
|
|
|
Post by ironinthepath on Jul 18, 2023 9:22:26 GMT -6
I like Hardy a lot, but to me there is no 1073 vibe - more true to the source with maybe a little harmonic support from the Jensen transformers
|
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Jul 18, 2023 9:33:23 GMT -6
I like Hardy a lot, but to me there is no 1073 vibe - more true to the source with maybe a little harmonic support from the Jensen transformers I should say, I've used a Hardy M1 during some session work at a pro studio, but it was a very classical set up with omni SDCs, so my reference point is off from what I'm used to. |
|
|
|
Post by sean on Jul 18, 2023 10:22:13 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that. The Phoenix Audio stuff might be a good Neve option with less color since it has a transformerless input. Not sure though, never owned one. |
|
|
|
Post by plinker on Jul 18, 2023 10:34:01 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that. The Phoenix Audio stuff might be a good Neve option with less color since it has a transformerless input. Not sure though, never owned one. I think you're onto something. I recently purchased a DRS and it's very flexible in terms of clean<-->color. The top-end has a tube-like featheriness to it. Pushing the output thickens the bottom-end as well. So, you get a hi-fi top with a neve-ish bottom. It's really about how you drive both gain stages (there are 2/channel). The second one interacts with the output transformer. |
|
|
|
Post by Mister Chase on Jul 18, 2023 10:36:57 GMT -6
The Phoenix Audio stuff might be a good Neve option with less color since it has a transformerless input. Not sure though, never owned one. I think you're onto something. I recently purchased a DRS and it's very flexible in terms of clean<-->color. The top-end has a tube-like featheriness to it. Pushing the output thickens the bottom-end as well. So, you get a hi-fi top with a neve-ish bottom. It's really about how you drive both gain stages (there are 2/channel). The second one interacts with the output transformer. I have 8 or 10 channels of Phoenix. They really offer something unique. It can be leaner than a 1073 but if you crank the output it can get that thickness. The top end tube thing is definitely real and not just marketing stuff. It's my only non tube pre that does that and it's pretty cool. |
|
|
|
Post by ml on Jul 18, 2023 11:01:11 GMT -6
The Phoenix Audio stuff might be a good Neve option with less color since it has a transformerless input. Not sure though, never owned one. I think you're onto something. I recently purchased a DRS and it's very flexible in terms of clean<-->color. The top-end has a tube-like featheriness to it. Pushing the output thickens the bottom-end as well. So, you get a hi-fi top with a neve-ish bottom. It's really about how you drive both gain stages (there are 2/channel). The second one interacts with the output transformer. Are the Phoenix in the same ballpark as the RND portico series? |
|
|
|
Post by mcirish on Jul 18, 2023 11:05:41 GMT -6
Hardy is a good clean preamp with a little mojo. The Daking is even cleaner with higher headroom (IMO). If you can find one of the Jensen Dual Servo preamps, that would have higher headroom than the Hardy.
Honestly, I think the Hardy is the nicest sounding preamp I've owned. Sorry to say but I must be in the minority about Neve 1073 style preamps. I have a Stam 1073MPA and it gets wooly way more than I almost ever want. Sounded great on a very light and frail female vocal, but I hated it on loud rock vocals. Too much saturation for my liking. But like I said, I'm sure I'm in the minority.
|
|
|
|
Post by christopher on Jul 18, 2023 11:13:29 GMT -6
|
|
|
|
Post by jeremygillespie on Jul 18, 2023 11:13:59 GMT -6
How about a Hairball Lola with 990’s
|
|
|
|
Post by notneeson on Jul 18, 2023 11:24:52 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that. The Phoenix Audio stuff might be a good Neve option with less color since it has a transformerless input. Not sure though, never owned one. I have a lot of time on the Phoenix pres, they can get a little hairy on vocals if you’re not running them at the cleanest setting. Not terrible, but as I was getting acquainted with them I slightly overcooked a vocal or two. No one else seemed to notice, but there it is. |
|
|
|
Post by robo on Jul 18, 2023 11:28:08 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that. Great River pres sort of hit that mark. They tend to get dense/thick rather than distort as you drive them. Phoenix get a bit colorful when hit hard to my ear, but it is a bit more smooth and predictable compared to a 1073. |
|
|
|
Post by notneeson on Jul 18, 2023 11:35:29 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that. Transformer balanced Hardys are maybe kinda sorta like a less mid-forward API. Definitely still has that finished quality that Neve/API etc. impart on sounds, but they’re a bit less colored perhaps. Would love to have one, but don’t really need more pres. |
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Jul 18, 2023 11:39:40 GMT -6
Thought I posted this, but maybe not.
Got a line on a Millennia HV-35 500...might give that a try.
So - yeah - talking about "harmonic/distortion" - it's one of those things I don't notice when I'm tracking with headphones, but then when I'm listening back on the monitors, it just gets a little hairy on the really big vocals.
|
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Jul 18, 2023 11:49:32 GMT -6
At some point I need to try a Hardy. I'd love a preamp which has a bit of that 1073 vibe, without the distortion. Not sure there is anything like that. Great River pres sort of hit that mark. They tend to get dense/thick rather than distort as you drive them. Phoenix get a bit colorful when hit hard to my ear, but it is a bit more smooth and predictable compared to a 1073. The Great River is on my list to try. I have a pair of the SL4K-E01. They are very nice. I also put a Royal Blue Colour Module in them for some Neve Vibe when I track or mix, as needed. They give me more of a 1272 kind of vibe with the colour module engaged. Without it they are very clean. I'm pretty sure I posted a comparison of it and my other neve preamps somewhere. |
|
|
|
Post by plinker on Jul 18, 2023 11:50:24 GMT -6
The Phoenix Audio stuff might be a good Neve option with less color since it has a transformerless input. Not sure though, never owned one. I have a lot of time on the Phoenix pres, they can get a little hairy on vocals if you’re not running them at the cleanest setting. Not terrible, but as I was getting acquainted with them I slightly overcooked a vocal or two. No one else seemed to notice, but there it is. I think the Phoenix discussion went astray from the original post, and into Neve-a-like land  You can definitely cook the input gain into breakup. I'm not sure about the output -- haven't hit that point yet. Have you? |
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Jul 18, 2023 12:29:24 GMT -6
So...uh...did a bunch more testing. Changed out the one of the little modules in my cheap ass DBX patchbay just to be sure...
Edit to add - I just realized my beloved Pulsar 1178 adds a little fuzz for sure.
|
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Jul 18, 2023 13:53:41 GMT -6
I have a lot of time on the Phoenix pres, they can get a little hairy on vocals if you’re not running them at the cleanest setting. Not terrible, but as I was getting acquainted with them I slightly overcooked a vocal or two. No one else seemed to notice, but there it is. I think the Phoenix discussion went astray from the original post, and into Neve-a-like land You can definitely cook the input gain into breakup. I'm not sure about the output -- haven't hit that point yet. Have you? My fault.  |
|
|
|
Post by Mister Chase on Jul 18, 2023 14:30:08 GMT -6
I have a lot of time on the Phoenix pres, they can get a little hairy on vocals if you’re not running them at the cleanest setting. Not terrible, but as I was getting acquainted with them I slightly overcooked a vocal or two. No one else seemed to notice, but there it is. I think the Phoenix discussion went astray from the original post, and into Neve-a-like land You can definitely cook the input gain into breakup. I'm not sure about the output -- haven't hit that point yet. Have you? That's what got me when I first had them. They were my second ever outboard pre's besides my much-missed Sytek pre's. I thought the input knob was like a Neve that drove things - it's meant for clean gain on the Phoenix but breaks up a lot if you push it too hard and in a not so pleasing way. That's my one gripe about those units. If you want all the transformer saturation, it's all on the output knob. The pad is for line level and drops a whopping 30db - so if you want to pad to get the output going you have to really crank the input then along with the output and it gets hissy. All in all though, they just sound great when operated at 30 input and 1 or 2 oclk on the output. |
|
ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,103 
|
Post by ericn on Jul 18, 2023 15:02:19 GMT -6
Thought I posted this, but maybe not. Got a line on a Millennia HV-35 500...might give that a try. So - yeah - talking about "harmonic/distortion" - it's one of those things I don't notice when I'm tracking with headphones, but then when I'm listening back on the monitors, it just gets a little hairy on the really big vocals. While the 500 series HV-35 is clean, it doesn’t quite have the headroom of the rack version, Hardy M1 and dual servo has a bit more of a pleasant character. JW’s super fast is almost to clean for vocals. |
|
|
|
Post by notneeson on Jul 18, 2023 15:49:10 GMT -6
I have a lot of time on the Phoenix pres, they can get a little hairy on vocals if you’re not running them at the cleanest setting. Not terrible, but as I was getting acquainted with them I slightly overcooked a vocal or two. No one else seemed to notice, but there it is. I think the Phoenix discussion went astray from the original post, and into Neve-a-like land You can definitely cook the input gain into breakup. I'm not sure about the output -- haven't hit that point yet. Have you? Yep, I had output pulled back and input up, thus the little bit of opamp saturation/hair. |
|
|
|
Post by plinker on Jul 18, 2023 15:49:41 GMT -6
|
|
|
|
Post by stevenlmorgan on Jul 18, 2023 16:49:12 GMT -6
Pueblo Audio. You can even get one with a limiter that doesn’t “limit”, it turns down peaks. Line and Mic level in just one input.
I have an ADR 2/2 with perfectly smooth potentiometers and 16 channels of JR.
|
|
