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Post by RealNoob on Jul 7, 2023 8:51:30 GMT -6
So I took the plunge with the release of V9 - seemed to fix issues that previously kept me from using. I want to love it with a "console-style" workflow - all EQs, sends, compressors visible at the same time... using less plugins, etc.
I gave it a true whirl - mixed an album. I won't do it again. Here's why:
1) bugginess with rendering in real time. I have a hardware insert on the Master. Not sure if it has any impact however, I can mix away and then go to render and it passes no audio. I have to do some mixture of rebooting mac/software/interface and then finally, I can render.
2) Automation lanes are separate tracks without the track name or color. So if you have 5-6 parameters being automated, all you see is gray tracks or if you have a few per track, the automation lanes visually overwhelm the tracks - too easy to get visually lost.
3) Say you want to automate a bus send. As you go to set it up, you only see the bus number, not name... have to remember the numbers to automate bus sends.
4) Say you want to automate a EQ band gain in FF ProQ. What band number is it? Heck if I know - trial and error every time.
All of this to say that it just wastes too much time. I like the layout and workflow but too many things stull slow you down. V9 was a big step forward but a few more are needed. Back to PT.
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Post by Chad on Jul 7, 2023 10:24:31 GMT -6
I’m shocked it’s this poor of a workflow STILL. I first learned about Harrison Mixbus back in 08 or 09.
How much more time do they need??
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Post by drumsound on Jul 7, 2023 10:49:59 GMT -6
I’m shocked it’s this poor of a workflow STILL. I first learned about Harrison Mixbus back in 08 or 09. How much more time do they need?? Yeah, it seems really weird that they release new versions but never seems to make any progress. It's like the budget for each update is $100... |
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Jul 7, 2023 10:50:33 GMT -6
I’m kind of shocked the new owners haven’t kicked it aside!
Who knows maybe we will see them bring in all there big digital Console guys and finally bring it to where it should be!
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Post by ragan on Jul 7, 2023 13:29:24 GMT -6
They probably just don’t have the money for good software engineering. Feels like they’ve got a minimum viable (ish) product that will limp along forever.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2023 14:16:51 GMT -6
There's a ton going against Mixbus. It's based off a free daw, Ardour, that nobody uses that's a pita to use. The EQ, dynamics, and tape plugins are all worse than what you already own and third party plugins that have been around forever. They try to sell it as a mixing daw like you should have a tracking daw and a mixing daw like a tracking console and a mixing console but there's no point in that anymore because now we have modern daws that work and the thing is slower to mix in anyway than Reaper, Pro Tools, and Cubendo that have minimized their sonic footprint years ago as long as you don't use most of the stock inserts.
Dan
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2023 14:22:42 GMT -6
I’m kind of shocked the new owners haven’t kicked it aside! Who knows maybe we will see them bring in all there big digital Console guys and finally bring it to where it should be! The big digital console guys need to hook up with the DSP wizards to get good code on everything. Most of what's in a modern digital console is far worse than what Sony and Waves were doing in the 90s. Yamaha and Digico tools are wtf and Yamaha doesn't put a lot of the their classic (ie totally fucked up and better as special fx) algorithms on the boards. Digico is so horrible you pretty much need Waves soundgrid. Stock AVID inserts are frickin terrible. Those filters and gates, and expanders suck. The Sonnox AAX DSP plugins are lower latency and have less numerical errors but cost a fortune because nobody wants to code for a dsp chip anymore. |
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Post by itzprime on Jul 8, 2023 3:04:34 GMT -6
So I took the plunge with the release of V9 - seemed to fix issues that previously kept me from using. I want to love it with a "console-style" workflow - all EQs, sends, compressors visible at the same time... using less plugins, etc. I gave it a true whirl - mixed an album. I won't do it again. Here's why: 1) bugginess with rendering in real time. I have a hardware insert on the Master. Not sure if it has any impact however, I can mix away and then go to render and it passes no audio. I have to do some mixture of rebooting mac/software/interface and then finally, I can render. 2) Automation lanes are separate tracks without the track name or color. So if you have 5-6 parameters being automated, all you see is gray tracks or if you have a few per track, the automation lanes visually overwhelm the tracks - too easy to get visually lost. 3) Say you want to automate a bus send. As you go to set it up, you only see the bus number, not name... have to remember the numbers to automate bus sends. 4) Say you want to automate a EQ band gain in FF ProQ. What band number is it? Heck if I know - trial and error every time. All of this to say that it just wastes too much time. I like the layout and workflow but too many things stull slow you down. V9 was a big step forward but a few more are needed. Back to PT. I also tried Mixbus and really tried to love it, but alas its workflow is just terrible. I ended up creating a template using pretty much TDR plugins only - to get a "console-like" workflow. TDR Slick EQ on all channels, Molot on Drums, Kotelnikov/Molot mixture on Bass and Vocals. And then mix with that. I also added some Fuse Audio plugins into that "console-like" template. Given that you can automate so much already and templates are getting better and better - I see no reason to use most channel strips anymore as they often lack in one area or another. |
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Post by mamm7215 on Jul 12, 2023 14:18:43 GMT -6
I'm afraid I'm in the same boat as a few here. I REALLY wanted to love it. I like it but there's just no "flow" feeling for me either. Plus I've gotten pretty quick on Studio One and I can compose/record/master in it and the hardware integration is excellent (for me). I keep buying the 32C updates every couple of versions to see how they've advanced.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2023 15:42:31 GMT -6
So I took the plunge with the release of V9 - seemed to fix issues that previously kept me from using. I want to love it with a "console-style" workflow - all EQs, sends, compressors visible at the same time... using less plugins, etc. I gave it a true whirl - mixed an album. I won't do it again. Here's why: 1) bugginess with rendering in real time. I have a hardware insert on the Master. Not sure if it has any impact however, I can mix away and then go to render and it passes no audio. I have to do some mixture of rebooting mac/software/interface and then finally, I can render. 2) Automation lanes are separate tracks without the track name or color. So if you have 5-6 parameters being automated, all you see is gray tracks or if you have a few per track, the automation lanes visually overwhelm the tracks - too easy to get visually lost. 3) Say you want to automate a bus send. As you go to set it up, you only see the bus number, not name... have to remember the numbers to automate bus sends. 4) Say you want to automate a EQ band gain in FF ProQ. What band number is it? Heck if I know - trial and error every time. All of this to say that it just wastes too much time. I like the layout and workflow but too many things stull slow you down. V9 was a big step forward but a few more are needed. Back to PT. I also tried Mixbus and really tried to love it, but alas its workflow is just terrible. I ended up creating a template using pretty much TDR plugins only - to get a "console-like" workflow. TDR Slick EQ on all channels, Molot on Drums, Kotelnikov/Molot mixture on Bass and Vocals. And then mix with that. I also added some Fuse Audio plugins into that "console-like" template. Given that you can automate so much already and templates are getting better and better - I see no reason to use most channel strips anymore as they often lack in one area or another. Only problem with that is the latency builds up a ton if you use all TDR. You have to freeze so that the meters and faders synch up to what's coming out of the monitors. Some other developers are even worse about it like Sound Radix, Softube Weiss, and the Sonnox Oxford SuprEsser and Drum gate where you definitely want to freeze or render them. |
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Post by RealNoob on Jul 12, 2023 21:36:46 GMT -6
I also tried Mixbus and really tried to love it, but alas its workflow is just terrible. I ended up creating a template using pretty much TDR plugins only - to get a "console-like" workflow. TDR Slick EQ on all channels, Molot on Drums, Kotelnikov/Molot mixture on Bass and Vocals. And then mix with that. I also added some Fuse Audio plugins into that "console-like" template. Given that you can automate so much already and templates are getting better and better - I see no reason to use most channel strips anymore as they often lack in one area or another. I opened PT and started to build my template and I actually was excited - lol. Silly. |
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Post by itzprime on Jul 12, 2023 23:50:46 GMT -6
I also tried Mixbus and really tried to love it, but alas its workflow is just terrible. I ended up creating a template using pretty much TDR plugins only - to get a "console-like" workflow. TDR Slick EQ on all channels, Molot on Drums, Kotelnikov/Molot mixture on Bass and Vocals. And then mix with that. I also added some Fuse Audio plugins into that "console-like" template. Given that you can automate so much already and templates are getting better and better - I see no reason to use most channel strips anymore as they often lack in one area or another. Only problem with that is the latency builds up a ton if you use all TDR. You have to freeze so that the meters and faders synch up to what's coming out of the monitors. Some other developers are even worse about it like Sound Radix, Softube Weiss, and the Sonnox Oxford SuprEsser and Drum gate where you definitely want to freeze or render them. With the M1 Mac it is pretty decent and the Eco mode usually sound decent enough after I have set the parameters with Insane mode and enabled highest quality render. Softube Weiss are the worse ones IMO, one of the reasons I don't use them. I also tried Mixbus and really tried to love it, but alas its workflow is just terrible. I ended up creating a template using pretty much TDR plugins only - to get a "console-like" workflow. TDR Slick EQ on all channels, Molot on Drums, Kotelnikov/Molot mixture on Bass and Vocals. And then mix with that. I also added some Fuse Audio plugins into that "console-like" template. Given that you can automate so much already and templates are getting better and better - I see no reason to use most channel strips anymore as they often lack in one area or another. I opened PT and started to build my template and I actually was excited - lol. Silly. Not a fan of the music, but Billy Decker is the master of templates. Dude can drag and drop it into it and it sounds already okish mixed. He has everything setup from triggers to all the EQ moves he likes - and then just changes them to fit the song better. I don't go that extreme, but a few things in the template are invaluable IMO |
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Post by theshea on Jul 13, 2023 0:39:58 GMT -6
Only problem with that is the latency builds up a ton if you use all TDR. You have to freeze so that the meters and faders synch up to what's coming out of the monitors. Some other developers are even worse about it like Sound Radix, Softube Weiss, and the Sonnox Oxford SuprEsser and Drum gate where you definitely want to freeze or render them. With the M1 Mac it is pretty decent and the Eco mode usually sound decent enough after I have set the parameters with Insane mode and enabled highest quality render. Softube Weiss are the worse ones IMO, one of the reasons I don't use them. I opened PT and started to build my template and I actually was excited - lol. Silly. Not a fan of the music, but Billy Decker is the master of templates. Dude can drag and drop it into it and it sounds already okish mixed. He has everything setup from triggers to all the EQ moves he likes - and then just changes them to fit the song better. I don't go that extreme, but a few things in the template are invaluable IMO Billy Decker is insane. watched a video, didn‘t know him. but really, thats „how much money can i make with the least effort?“ no wonder every song sound the same. thats almost AI mixing. where‘s the creativity? where‘s the art? its all summed down to creating a product for a market. the client/band/artist is just a number … |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2023 1:10:58 GMT -6
Only problem with that is the latency builds up a ton if you use all TDR. You have to freeze so that the meters and faders synch up to what's coming out of the monitors. Some other developers are even worse about it like Sound Radix, Softube Weiss, and the Sonnox Oxford SuprEsser and Drum gate where you definitely want to freeze or render them. With the M1 Mac it is pretty decent and the Eco mode usually sound decent enough after I have set the parameters with Insane mode and enabled highest quality render. Softube Weiss are the worse ones IMO, one of the reasons I don't use them. I opened PT and started to build my template and I actually was excited - lol. Silly. Not a fan of the music, but Billy Decker is the master of templates. Dude can drag and drop it into it and it sounds already okish mixed. He has everything setup from triggers to all the EQ moves he likes - and then just changes them to fit the song better. I don't go that extreme, but a few things in the template are invaluable IMO You should keep TDR plugs on insane because they will behave differently at different settings. Extreme or disparate settings, which may be necessary for a track, will only behave well on Insane. |
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Post by itzprime on Jul 13, 2023 1:36:47 GMT -6
With the M1 Mac it is pretty decent and the Eco mode usually sound decent enough after I have set the parameters with Insane mode and enabled highest quality render. Softube Weiss are the worse ones IMO, one of the reasons I don't use them. Not a fan of the music, but Billy Decker is the master of templates. Dude can drag and drop it into it and it sounds already okish mixed. He has everything setup from triggers to all the EQ moves he likes - and then just changes them to fit the song better. I don't go that extreme, but a few things in the template are invaluable IMO Billy Decker is insane. watched a video, didn‘t know him. but really, thats „how much money can i make with the least effort?“ no wonder every song sound the same. thats almost AI mixing. where‘s the creativity? where‘s the art? its all summed down to creating a product for a market. the client/band/artist is just a number … Agree, but that is just the current country music reality. I have written with Billy and he is an insanely hard worker, often reworking his chain to sound better. But yea it is close to AI mixing and more akin to an assembly line than an art. I find it funny that both he and Serban Ghenea, both swear by the Metric Halo Channel Strip. It is a great CS, but I hate that it aliases. Metric Halo should really update their DSP. With the M1 Mac it is pretty decent and the Eco mode usually sound decent enough after I have set the parameters with Insane mode and enabled highest quality render. Softube Weiss are the worse ones IMO, one of the reasons I don't use them. Not a fan of the music, but Billy Decker is the master of templates. Dude can drag and drop it into it and it sounds already okish mixed. He has everything setup from triggers to all the EQ moves he likes - and then just changes them to fit the song better. I don't go that extreme, but a few things in the template are invaluable IMO You should keep TDR plugs on insane because they will behave differently at different settings. Extreme or disparate settings, which may be necessary for a track, will only behave well on Insane. Yes for the sources that sound completely different, I leave it on insane. |
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